Air Force One Surprise Visit to Baghdad
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I do not think he flew in at all,
it was a really long tunnell, dug from washington DC to the California dessert...Mmmm...naw...
It was filmed weeks ago when that guy in charge of Iraq, Bremner I think his name is, came for a visit to Washington.
it was a really long tunnell, dug from washington DC to the California dessert...Mmmm...naw...
It was filmed weeks ago when that guy in charge of Iraq, Bremner I think his name is, came for a visit to Washington.
Paxing All Over The World
Bush did what had to be done for the election. Had he NOT have done this, his opponents would have asked why.
My (inexpert) guess is that the operation would have been safer than his visit to the UK. There was no advance notice and he would have been protected at all times with a remarkable amount of hardware and anti-everything devices.
Had it gone wrong and he have been killed - he would have died a hero and died a martyr. It was what the PR people call a 'Win-Win'.
My (inexpert) guess is that the operation would have been safer than his visit to the UK. There was no advance notice and he would have been protected at all times with a remarkable amount of hardware and anti-everything devices.
Had it gone wrong and he have been killed - he would have died a hero and died a martyr. It was what the PR people call a 'Win-Win'.
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Man, you lot are a cynical bunch. Must be horribly depressing to go through life always looking at the worst possible case.
Bush made the comment about taking the press because there's a real issue of accountability and continuity of command here. The President can't just flit off unannounced to a war zone without bringing someone along to document what the heck he did while he was there. No president has done something this sneaky since Yalta. There would have been hell to pay today if he left the reporters home. So he brought the standard pool. Drudge has got the pool notes from the newspaper poolie (Mike Allen). They're very detailed and tell you his perspective on just about everything that happened from the time he was told about going on the trip to the departure from Baghdad.
Yes, this is also a wonderful campaign photo op. But those of you who think that's the only reason Bush would consider going really haven't learned anything about the man yet. Keep underestimating him....
Bush made the comment about taking the press because there's a real issue of accountability and continuity of command here. The President can't just flit off unannounced to a war zone without bringing someone along to document what the heck he did while he was there. No president has done something this sneaky since Yalta. There would have been hell to pay today if he left the reporters home. So he brought the standard pool. Drudge has got the pool notes from the newspaper poolie (Mike Allen). They're very detailed and tell you his perspective on just about everything that happened from the time he was told about going on the trip to the departure from Baghdad.
Yes, this is also a wonderful campaign photo op. But those of you who think that's the only reason Bush would consider going really haven't learned anything about the man yet. Keep underestimating him....
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I think Bush is a complete idiot, a religious zealot who rules by laws abandoned over here years ago.
Religion has no place in the running of a country, in my opinion.
This is a man that amassed a fortune through numerous shady deals while living a playboy lifestyle of indulgence. He drove his oil businesses into the ground before being bailed out by his dad's friends.
Most of his funding and administration comes from the oil and gas industry. Dick Cheney, the vice-president is former head at Halliburton, a Texas-based oil company and Chief of Staff Andrew Card is the former head of the American Automobile Manufacturers Association. Condoleeza Rice was a board member at Chevron and has an oil tanker named after her.
Most of the legislation he has passed favours the oil industry.
He ordered the invasion of a non-Christian country that happens to be rich in oil, on the pretext that there were weapons of mass destruction there and that the leader was a threat. None have been found.
North Korea freely admits it hates the West, and is making more nuclear weapons capable of reaching pretty much anywhere in the world, so Bush does... very little.
He has little time for the environment, ordering domestic oil drilling in a highly sensitive area of Alaska.
He refuses to ratify the Kyoto treaty, which would see a cap on greenhouse gas emission levels. The US currently emits a quarter of the greenhouse gasses in the world.
He refuses to acknowledge the International Criminal Court in case Americans get into trouble.
He ignored the will of the UN, throwing the whole system of international co-operation and diplomacy into chaos.
He's anti-choice, doing his best to make abortion illegal.
He binged on cocaine and alcohol up until his 40s.
While governor of Texas he authorised the execution of 152 prisoners, the highest number of any governor in US history. In one case during an interview, he mocked the desperate pleas of a woman he sentenced to death.
For God's sake, he shouldn't even have won the election, he got less votes than Gore.
So, we have an religious fanatic, former coke fiend and alcoholic with a penchant for oil and money, who shouldn't even be in the White House, and yet we're supposed to support him as the most powerful man in the world?
Not likely IMO. I could go on for much longer, but you get the idea. I think Bush is a symbol of what's wrong with the world today.
Religion has no place in the running of a country, in my opinion.
This is a man that amassed a fortune through numerous shady deals while living a playboy lifestyle of indulgence. He drove his oil businesses into the ground before being bailed out by his dad's friends.
Most of his funding and administration comes from the oil and gas industry. Dick Cheney, the vice-president is former head at Halliburton, a Texas-based oil company and Chief of Staff Andrew Card is the former head of the American Automobile Manufacturers Association. Condoleeza Rice was a board member at Chevron and has an oil tanker named after her.
Most of the legislation he has passed favours the oil industry.
He ordered the invasion of a non-Christian country that happens to be rich in oil, on the pretext that there were weapons of mass destruction there and that the leader was a threat. None have been found.
North Korea freely admits it hates the West, and is making more nuclear weapons capable of reaching pretty much anywhere in the world, so Bush does... very little.
He has little time for the environment, ordering domestic oil drilling in a highly sensitive area of Alaska.
He refuses to ratify the Kyoto treaty, which would see a cap on greenhouse gas emission levels. The US currently emits a quarter of the greenhouse gasses in the world.
He refuses to acknowledge the International Criminal Court in case Americans get into trouble.
He ignored the will of the UN, throwing the whole system of international co-operation and diplomacy into chaos.
He's anti-choice, doing his best to make abortion illegal.
He binged on cocaine and alcohol up until his 40s.
While governor of Texas he authorised the execution of 152 prisoners, the highest number of any governor in US history. In one case during an interview, he mocked the desperate pleas of a woman he sentenced to death.
For God's sake, he shouldn't even have won the election, he got less votes than Gore.
So, we have an religious fanatic, former coke fiend and alcoholic with a penchant for oil and money, who shouldn't even be in the White House, and yet we're supposed to support him as the most powerful man in the world?
Not likely IMO. I could go on for much longer, but you get the idea. I think Bush is a symbol of what's wrong with the world today.
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Right, wbryce, and you are the only hope of the future.
This is a forum about aviation. It's about flying and airplanes. Let's try to keep it that way. There are already too many forums for people to get their political and moral shorts in knots. I don't think we need to take this one into that dump heap also.
This is a forum about aviation. It's about flying and airplanes. Let's try to keep it that way. There are already too many forums for people to get their political and moral shorts in knots. I don't think we need to take this one into that dump heap also.
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Elections? Not so soon!
I read many posts suggesting Pt.
Bush went to Baghdad to improve his popularity and get more votes at next presidential election.
But my dear, the election is not to take place tomorrow.
So, if I believe you, he has a lot more stunt to do, to get to a climax at the right moment.
What's next on his agenda?
Bush went to Baghdad to improve his popularity and get more votes at next presidential election.
But my dear, the election is not to take place tomorrow.
So, if I believe you, he has a lot more stunt to do, to get to a climax at the right moment.
What's next on his agenda?
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Well, as always, folks in the UK are obsessed with things American.
Not many Americans comment on British politics or even care.
Would a Tony Blair visit generate multiple threads on an American aviation forum? Somehow, I doubt it.
We're not big on titles over here since being an American is quite an honor in itself.
We appreciate your interest in our great nation! And thanks as always for your help and support over the years.
And now, the continued analysis here on PPRuNe of George Bush and the American scene...
Not many Americans comment on British politics or even care.
Would a Tony Blair visit generate multiple threads on an American aviation forum? Somehow, I doubt it.
We're not big on titles over here since being an American is quite an honor in itself.
We appreciate your interest in our great nation! And thanks as always for your help and support over the years.
And now, the continued analysis here on PPRuNe of George Bush and the American scene...
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must admit when I spotted the thread I was looking forward to lots of technical info on the trip including ....... likely crewing format ..... refueling ...... ATC ...... air to air visibility (I did raise a smile when I heard the BA crew story) ..... flight ID . ....... etc etc ......
oh well .....
hobie ....
oh well .....
hobie ....
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We're not big on titles over here
Would a Tony Blair visit generate multiple threads on an American aviation forum
As to our obsession, only 25% of the responses to this thread were posted by people obviously from the UK!
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BA plane spotted Air Force One
Does anyone know which BA flight spotted Air Force One on its way to Baghdad yesterday?
Apparently the BA flight asked him if he was Air Force One and he answered no, we're Gulfstream 5....
Apparently the BA flight asked him if he was Air Force One and he answered no, we're Gulfstream 5....
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This is a forum about aviation. It's about flying and airplanes. Let's try to keep it that way.
SoS
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>>must admit when I spotted the thread I was looking forward to lots of technical info on the trip including ....... likely crewing format ..... refueling ...... ATC ...... air to air visibility (I did raise a smile when I heard the BA crew story) ..... flight <<
I agree. There are some fascinating operational questions raised by this historic flight.
Were night vision goggles used for the landing in Baghdad? How were overflight permits handled (or did they use MARSA)? Did they use a Reach callsign in theater? Inflight refueling (not normally done with pax onboard)?
I agree. There are some fascinating operational questions raised by this historic flight.
Were night vision goggles used for the landing in Baghdad? How were overflight permits handled (or did they use MARSA)? Did they use a Reach callsign in theater? Inflight refueling (not normally done with pax onboard)?
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What would really take guts would be to visit Arlington cemetery - or other cemeteries in the country - once in a while to pay respects to those who came back from Iraq in a body bag.
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Hmm....
Bush went to Baghdad - stayed 2 1/2 hours - then went all the way back.... - and of course nobody knowing....
This is just a HOAX. Same as the Moonlandings in the late 60's and early 70's.....
The U.S. did NEVER go to the moon ! - and nobody have ever been there.....
See for Yourself and make up Your own opinion:
http://www.geocities.com/Area51/3543/moonfake.htm
NASA's own pictures:
http://images.jsc.nasa.gov/iams/html/pao/as11.htm
Bush went to Baghdad - stayed 2 1/2 hours - then went all the way back.... - and of course nobody knowing....
This is just a HOAX. Same as the Moonlandings in the late 60's and early 70's.....
The U.S. did NEVER go to the moon ! - and nobody have ever been there.....
See for Yourself and make up Your own opinion:
http://www.geocities.com/Area51/3543/moonfake.htm
NASA's own pictures:
http://images.jsc.nasa.gov/iams/html/pao/as11.htm
"Remember this is the brave man who spent the hours immediately after September 11th. hiding!"
SOS,
The USA was under attack that morning. It was wise to keep the command of the USA intact. Those in charge of protecting Bush did the right thing on that terrible day.
SOS,
The USA was under attack that morning. It was wise to keep the command of the USA intact. Those in charge of protecting Bush did the right thing on that terrible day.
Union Goon
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While this is an aviation forum, the fascination with all things american and the SPECTACULAR MISUNDERSTANDING OF AMERICAN LAW AND GOVERNMENT as displaye by WBRYCE, do call for a few comments back.
First off,
Bush's fund raising... As opposed to BILL Clinton/Al Gore both of whom received 90 percent of their money from less than 100 sources, (IN otherwords they were big single contributions from Special interests) Bush received 75 percent of his donations (In dollar value) in denominations of less than 100 dollars. Infact it has almost ALWAYS been that way and is one of the reasons the campaign finance reform bill has been the death knell of the democratic party. Infact the first democratic candidate not to be made up of special interest money has been Howard Dean. So you want to know who was more beholden to big business and special interest? It would have been GORE. Both candidates raised about the same amount from big business. The difference in fundraising came from the little guy, and Bush buried Gore.
2nd You claim that Bush refused to ratify KYOTO.
I got news for you, Bush DOESN"T HAVE THE POWER TO RATIFIY KYOTO. CONGRESS must ratify all treaties. Gore went to Kyoto and put HIS signature on it hoping to embarrass the republicans in congress, but the issue is an overwhelming loser for the Democrats and Most American's recognize the KYOTO treaty for the peice of crap that it is. When KYOTO was signed, it was with the FULL knowledge that it would NEVER be ratified. That is a pretty good expression lieing by Gore and of democracy bringing back the one lunatic ruler, actually. Deliberate distortions of this by the UK press are one of the things that drove me crazy when I lived there.
ICC? Same thing. Will never pass congress. Even if it did, then it might get struck down by the supreme court as unconstitional. Also might require a constitutional ammendment inorder to submit the country to extra judicial justice. THAT will certainly never happen.
Drilling in Alaska, SO WHAT.... Not important to most Americans
Ignores the UN. Tell me what has the UN EVER accomplished without US money and soldiers.... I can tell you Far more embarrassing things about the UN. It isn't a bastion of fairness, truth and justice. That is for sure, and most Americans recongnize that.
Abortion? I may be pro choice, but the US voters have spoken. You would deny us the right to vote on that issue? Some procedures have been banned by congress. Big deal. Again. that is an expression of democracy. I don't agree with it, but I'm obviously in the minority. I suspect there are more than a few procedures (Like partial birth abotions, the only thing banned so far in the US) that may effectively be banned over there administratively through the NHS...
Binged on Alchohol and Cocaine? He was far more honest about it than old Bill Clinton (I smoked pot but didn't inhale) and you can't argue that it is clouding his judgement NOW (He doesn't drink)
Executions, Well all those convictions were more than 10 years earlier. It takes a VERY long time to get executed in America, during which there is an exhaustive review of the evidence and appeal of the trial... Tell me, When is the UK going to have a vote on capital punishment? I think it would pass in the UK. Okay, I guess democracy is only okay when you know the answer in advance <G> Capital punishement is done with the utmost care, yet reflects the will of the people. Again, democracy in action.
Actually the above list of MISINFORMATION based on rediculous sound bites garnered from TV is a pretty good example of all that is wrong in the world today. The problem is that the press doesn't know what they are talking about, or the segments lack the length required to actually explain what is going on, yet in 30 seconds they preach as if they are telling the true gospel. Tellme, pray tell, Which press coverage of aviation do you feel is great and flawless and accurate. To look around rumors and news, the answer is NONE. Yet then you trust the media on all other items...
The NUMBER 1 TERRORIST TARGET IN THE WORLD, flew right into the heart of the beast and served dinner to the troops, (and met with local Iraqi's btw) Good on him
Yggorf,
Bush regularly does that. He also meets with the soldiers who have been wounded when they come through Bethesda. But he does it quietly, for their benefit, no the press's.
Cheers
Wino
First off,
Bush's fund raising... As opposed to BILL Clinton/Al Gore both of whom received 90 percent of their money from less than 100 sources, (IN otherwords they were big single contributions from Special interests) Bush received 75 percent of his donations (In dollar value) in denominations of less than 100 dollars. Infact it has almost ALWAYS been that way and is one of the reasons the campaign finance reform bill has been the death knell of the democratic party. Infact the first democratic candidate not to be made up of special interest money has been Howard Dean. So you want to know who was more beholden to big business and special interest? It would have been GORE. Both candidates raised about the same amount from big business. The difference in fundraising came from the little guy, and Bush buried Gore.
2nd You claim that Bush refused to ratify KYOTO.
I got news for you, Bush DOESN"T HAVE THE POWER TO RATIFIY KYOTO. CONGRESS must ratify all treaties. Gore went to Kyoto and put HIS signature on it hoping to embarrass the republicans in congress, but the issue is an overwhelming loser for the Democrats and Most American's recognize the KYOTO treaty for the peice of crap that it is. When KYOTO was signed, it was with the FULL knowledge that it would NEVER be ratified. That is a pretty good expression lieing by Gore and of democracy bringing back the one lunatic ruler, actually. Deliberate distortions of this by the UK press are one of the things that drove me crazy when I lived there.
ICC? Same thing. Will never pass congress. Even if it did, then it might get struck down by the supreme court as unconstitional. Also might require a constitutional ammendment inorder to submit the country to extra judicial justice. THAT will certainly never happen.
Drilling in Alaska, SO WHAT.... Not important to most Americans
Ignores the UN. Tell me what has the UN EVER accomplished without US money and soldiers.... I can tell you Far more embarrassing things about the UN. It isn't a bastion of fairness, truth and justice. That is for sure, and most Americans recongnize that.
Abortion? I may be pro choice, but the US voters have spoken. You would deny us the right to vote on that issue? Some procedures have been banned by congress. Big deal. Again. that is an expression of democracy. I don't agree with it, but I'm obviously in the minority. I suspect there are more than a few procedures (Like partial birth abotions, the only thing banned so far in the US) that may effectively be banned over there administratively through the NHS...
Binged on Alchohol and Cocaine? He was far more honest about it than old Bill Clinton (I smoked pot but didn't inhale) and you can't argue that it is clouding his judgement NOW (He doesn't drink)
Executions, Well all those convictions were more than 10 years earlier. It takes a VERY long time to get executed in America, during which there is an exhaustive review of the evidence and appeal of the trial... Tell me, When is the UK going to have a vote on capital punishment? I think it would pass in the UK. Okay, I guess democracy is only okay when you know the answer in advance <G> Capital punishement is done with the utmost care, yet reflects the will of the people. Again, democracy in action.
Actually the above list of MISINFORMATION based on rediculous sound bites garnered from TV is a pretty good example of all that is wrong in the world today. The problem is that the press doesn't know what they are talking about, or the segments lack the length required to actually explain what is going on, yet in 30 seconds they preach as if they are telling the true gospel. Tellme, pray tell, Which press coverage of aviation do you feel is great and flawless and accurate. To look around rumors and news, the answer is NONE. Yet then you trust the media on all other items...
The NUMBER 1 TERRORIST TARGET IN THE WORLD, flew right into the heart of the beast and served dinner to the troops, (and met with local Iraqi's btw) Good on him
Yggorf,
Bush regularly does that. He also meets with the soldiers who have been wounded when they come through Bethesda. But he does it quietly, for their benefit, no the press's.
Cheers
Wino
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It wasn't criticism of Bush, it is the political rhetoric that gets so emotional and out of control. I come to this forum as an escape from all of that crap. It bothers me to see every venue get contaminated.