Flarechecklevel

From the latest edition .....

"As has been stated before in this publication the people making the decisions and signing the contracts are not the ones with the slightest personal expertise in any operational aspects of police air support.
In the first instance this is all driven by profit and loss, it will get worse before it gets better."

Sad state of affairs .....

Also, I have it on first hand authority that the Met have NOT signed the agreement yet.

FCL

SilsoeSid

REVEALED: Major decline in helicopter flying hours searching for criminals and missing as Cambridgeshire police save cash.

Requests are down!
That's the kind of statement that reflects the rumblings out there that it's not worth asking for an ac any more because, along with other popular phrases, 'it'll be too long before it gets here, so there's simply no point'.


Pre NPAS 627 hours / £1.2 mill; Under NPAS 500 hrs / £480k
Pre NAPAS £1913 p/hr; Under NPAS £960 p/hr

<50% saving, per hour! Pretty good, but what is the reality behind it all

"• NPAS will deliver a more cost effective service balancing the need to save money against the need to ensure the police service has a quickly deployable asset that can be used to tackle crime and protect the public."

J.A.F.O.

I find myself in agreement with a great deal of what is written in PAN but to suggest that the police officers in the Met have had a unique level of access to and appreciation of air support is, at best, disingenuous. To say that it is probably unique in Europe is either stunningly ill-informed or scathingly insulting.

Having said that, his assessment of NPAS seems quite comprehensive and reasoned.

ROTORVATION

Hi everyone,

Would anyone out there be able to give a best guess as to what it costs the Met Police to keep Lippitts hill operational?

I'm not talking about staffing level/wages, fuel or maintenance costs. I am more interested in the actual yearly cost to operate / maintain the buildings / hangars?

Thanks

RV

MightyGem

My thoughts exactly. I think that every force that had Air Support prior to NPAS was doing that.

SilsoeSid

Cabby, you naughty so & so, google NPAS Hitler and it's #1 on the list. It's ok to link to, it's the creation of any more anti-NPAS propaganda that will set heads rolling so we've been warned

Rumour has it that one 145 will go to W.Yorks, one was going to go to a unit in the Midlands but their hangar is too small, so N.Wales is on for the second with the third staying at Lippitts.

Happy Days

SilsoeSid

I think that's what is in mind in the bigger plan for the future of NPAS.

With the civil aid type jobs in winter and the coastline & hill rescues, supplementary to the Valley unit, there will also be a very useful unit in close proximity to Liverpool and Manchester for any firearms troop lift type jobs that may occur throughout the region. Likewise for the North East with the 145 in host force land. Para military Ops as seen in Europe may well be coming our way!

Despite the views of others, the snowball that we know as NPAS seems to keep on rolling. 145 redistribution, fixed wing, drones/quadrocopters, integrated air ambulance tasking, para military capabilities, it all seems to be a policy of you have to spend in order to save.



The video was shown at the last great meet, it is in the public domain, so it is ok to still post it;

Hitler finds out about National Police Air Service (NPAS) - YouTube

SilsoeSid

Anyone mention overtime?

Hitler reflects on cuts to the Police overtime budget

published in Feb 2013 so before the head roll amnesty

tigerfish

I guess that the only way to deal with this disaster is to make light of it, but I am near to tears!
When I think back to where we were just 10 years ago it really hurts. We led the developed world in effective air cover. Most counties shared cover with their neighbour. Time on scene at most incidents was way under 20 minutes, arrest rates were high and morale of the guys in the ground high too because they knew that they only had to ask.
The courts had a ready supply of photographic evidence and as a crime prevention tool we were highly effective. Despite what the Politicoes say today cross border co-operation was high and neighbouring units covered for down time.
Then came along Hogan Howe and Alex Marshall and it all went to rat **** in a fairly short order.
Now Police officers are learning Political half truths to save their careers and trotting out ridiculous rubbish about how cost effective this mess is. They should be ashamed.
As I said many years ago, "Guys, - never forget where the fault lies. it is with Hogan Howe and Alex Marshall. They played the Political Cow Tow game and we all lost!"
My time is done, Nearly 70 now, but still I have the pride to say "We got it about right". The Ram raiders and the Joy riders and the muggers had a nasty shock, and we managed to hold the line for a goodly time.
Its a pity that in the fullness of time we too were mugged by that pair!
tigerfish

RichiePAO

Have to agree TF.
On a recent night shift in the local bazaar I was involved in a 27 min long pursuit....didn't occur too late at night and it stayed conveniently in the same town....the nearest aircraft arrived just at the time the vehicle was stopped and occupants arrested.......
27 mins........
When I worked for the local ASU we would have been on scene in 10....

MightyGem

If anyone wants to get something off their chest, then feel free to do it via a PM to me and I'll post it. As I'm now retired, my head can't roll.

SilsoeSid

Anyone know the purpose of the flight test during a TFO/BM selection process?

MightyGem

We used to use it for potential Observers just to see how they coped being in the air: ie, did they know where they were, how to get to places and how did they cope with a few, ahem, aerobatics. We had more than one who professed to being uncomfortable in the air.

airpolice

Gem, I was never sick, but JC did his best to find my limits.

Given how long I've been seeing this stuff, from up close, I can only say that TigerFish is bang on the button there.

However, he who pays the piper calls the tune.

The troops at the sharp end are no longer paid to do what they did in the good old days, they are paid to turn up at the jobs they can afford to attend.

That's how it is.

As for Bernard, he was asked to do a job, and he has done it rather well I think. It's a great shame that anyone was asked to do it, but he has achieved what he set out to do.

jayteeto

If it wasn't Bernard HH, it would have been someone else. You have to stand out from the crowd to get the Met, I personally think he was a good man for the job. Despite being a total political animal and churning out targets, he still sees catching criminals as being very important................. Unlike most CCs, they just want to meet the targets, the end

Cabby

PCSO Vince should pass the fitness test as the next observer/TFO

Could G4S be inline to be NPAS overtime employees?
Hitler reflects on cuts to the Police overtime budget - YouTube

Fuzz Burner

Cabby, don't believe all that you hear. Noise complaints did not increase with the 145s. In fact as they have a longer endurance it means less movements from/to the base.
145s were chosen as the Met have certain roles and responsibilities on top of the 'normal' police tasks performed by most ASUs.

airpolice

Cabby,

Fuzz should have written "Had some responsibilities"

Fuzz Burner

airpolice......is that right? I assume you're in the know.

tigerfish

The fact that the hours have reduced still further, is a direct result in the slump in confidence of those on the ground, that the aircraft will be able to assist them anymore.

In the days when when a call for overhead cover resulted in a quick response, it was effective. Morale and condidence grew. But today in the knowledge that you will be waiting for ages even if it comes at all, no one bothers anymore.

Its what HH and AM wanted and its what you got.

NPAS was always the correct way forward, its just the way that it was done that was wrong.
TF