The end of the J-visa.
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yeah. Another thing.
Not sure about Bristow Academy, but there's more US helicopter instructors teaching Germans and Norwegians than US students in proportion. Thus looking to me like all the heli students being trained by Americans SHOULDN'T BE HERE TO LET AMERICANS HOURBUILD ON THEM DAMN FAST. Right?
(KHIO -main part of Hillsboro Aviation. Not sure about numbers in KTTD since it's not for M1/J1 students)
As for this almost xenophobic, patriotic protectionst feelings, without all those European an Asian sponsored (or otherwise) cadets flying planks, there'd be hundreds (if not low thousands) of American airplane instructors without work - training foreigners, companies without business from foreigners, employing American in maintenance, menial and office jobs in flight schools. J1 students are a drop in a pond. J1 rotary even less. The total of foreigners training in the US isn't.
Only blunt people would want non-US aviation students to steer clear from this country as they greatly benefit it. Aviation in the USA wouldn't be what it is without it.
Also, not the best time, but regionals in the US have been recruiting domestic CPL/MEIR graduates into F/O seat. So in FW world, getting to 1000TT or around isn't as magical and quintessential as for rotary Europeans.
As for 'Homeland Security' reasons, J1 students are career minded aviation enthusiasts who plan their career. Not one in hoardes of people flying here recreationally or on M1 without intent to work here temporarily. M1 guys are 'higher risk'. Not to mention all the JAA PPLs who get 'piggyback' FAA PPL and fly around Florida. They're even worse since they were not indoctrinated to FAA standards, aren't they?
Can't find anything on US website. AOPA and AvWeb quoting AOPA
Not sure about Bristow Academy, but there's more US helicopter instructors teaching Germans and Norwegians than US students in proportion. Thus looking to me like all the heli students being trained by Americans SHOULDN'T BE HERE TO LET AMERICANS HOURBUILD ON THEM DAMN FAST. Right?
(KHIO -main part of Hillsboro Aviation. Not sure about numbers in KTTD since it's not for M1/J1 students)
As for this almost xenophobic, patriotic protectionst feelings, without all those European an Asian sponsored (or otherwise) cadets flying planks, there'd be hundreds (if not low thousands) of American airplane instructors without work - training foreigners, companies without business from foreigners, employing American in maintenance, menial and office jobs in flight schools. J1 students are a drop in a pond. J1 rotary even less. The total of foreigners training in the US isn't.
Only blunt people would want non-US aviation students to steer clear from this country as they greatly benefit it. Aviation in the USA wouldn't be what it is without it.
Also, not the best time, but regionals in the US have been recruiting domestic CPL/MEIR graduates into F/O seat. So in FW world, getting to 1000TT or around isn't as magical and quintessential as for rotary Europeans.
As for 'Homeland Security' reasons, J1 students are career minded aviation enthusiasts who plan their career. Not one in hoardes of people flying here recreationally or on M1 without intent to work here temporarily. M1 guys are 'higher risk'. Not to mention all the JAA PPLs who get 'piggyback' FAA PPL and fly around Florida. They're even worse since they were not indoctrinated to FAA standards, aren't they?
Can't find anything on US website. AOPA and AvWeb quoting AOPA
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Originally Posted by TheVelvetGlove
Always wondered, where DO you guys get all that cash for US training? Seems like every one of you shows up with a mountain of it. Did most of you earn it, or are your parents just very generous?
Just to rise enough money to do what I want - and that is flying rotorcrafts.J-1 is useful as it allow to train, and than work in the same environment for short period of time - thus giving young pilots ability to learn more than what he can get from simple CPL(H) course. I believe its like driving a car. You may pass the test, get your driving license, but until you drive more on you're own, you can't say you can drive. Fresh CPL(H) pilots don't know squat about working as helicopter pilot until they do some time as one. Without J-1s, people like me, after training will have to switch visas - as I'm aware, is not so simple - or go somewhere else to finalize their learning process.
Training in the US is very tempting, as the prices in Europe are ridiculous - let's say that in US I can do PPL(H), CPL(H), IR, FI, turbine transition, mountain flying and long line operations training for the same amount of money as the simple PPL(H) cost here
Well, it's free market, and it do not like void, by the time I rise my funds there will be other possibilities to chose from, equal or better than the US with J-1. It is only pity to see US closing down without apparent reasons.
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This will lead to a shortage of helicopter pilots for the North Sea.
Many helicopter students come to the USA, become Heli CFI's and then go home with 1,000 hours. North Sea operators will have to 1) lower their standards to 200-300 hours 2) hire more military pilolts if they can find them 3) allow USA pilots to emigrate to the EU
I don't think this will affect airlines as they may be will to take on 300 hour pilots.
Many helicopter students come to the USA, become Heli CFI's and then go home with 1,000 hours. North Sea operators will have to 1) lower their standards to 200-300 hours 2) hire more military pilolts if they can find them 3) allow USA pilots to emigrate to the EU
I don't think this will affect airlines as they may be will to take on 300 hour pilots.
A lowering of the hour requirements for co-pilots is not necessarily the same thing as lowering standards; 1000 hours gained as an instructor in the US has questionable relevance to the rôle of a North Sea P2.
Why not a return to the airline-style system of yesteryear? Take a bloke straight out of Oxford/Cabair, with 100 hours helo time and a fresh CPL; stick him in the left seat and off ye go.
Tis the favoured way among European airlines: mould the new in their own image, afore they pick up/develop wicked ways.
Amen
Why not a return to the airline-style system of yesteryear? Take a bloke straight out of Oxford/Cabair, with 100 hours helo time and a fresh CPL; stick him in the left seat and off ye go.
Tis the favoured way among European airlines: mould the new in their own image, afore they pick up/develop wicked ways.
Amen
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Maybe you will see more American pilots in the North Sea after 2010 
The end of the J1 will be bad for everyone- foreign students, American CFI's, American schools.
On a side note, can we put an end to the use of the word "rotorcrafts" ?
The plural of rotorcraft is rotorcraft.
The end of the J1 will be bad for everyone- foreign students, American CFI's, American schools.
On a side note, can we put an end to the use of the word "rotorcrafts" ?
The plural of rotorcraft is rotorcraft.
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On a side note, can we put an end to the use of the word "rotorcrafts" ?
I agree, but many posters (like Lt.Fubar) are not speaking English as their first language. They do very well I think.
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I believe any helo training done outside of the USA will cost more per hour. Several years ago I looked into a Canadian CPL(H) conversion, the CAN was only worth .65 to one USD at the time and it still cost less to fly an R22 in the states.
I'd like to see what the rates are for R22's, S300 in Aus or NZ.
I'd like to see what the rates are for R22's, S300 in Aus or NZ.
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UK accept FAA license for flying PIC in UK registered a/c, so Canada may be very interesting option right now, even though prices are 30-50% higher than in US, it's still a bargain compared to European ones. But Scandinavians and others may have a problem.
Although, as I said, the void will be filled. Probably by the first who allow/enforce biofuel, which may reduce the flight-per-hour costs, as the prices of Avgas are getting a bit ridiculous these days.
Ups, sorry about that.
Although, as I said, the void will be filled. Probably by the first who allow/enforce biofuel, which may reduce the flight-per-hour costs, as the prices of Avgas are getting a bit ridiculous these days.
Originally Posted by TheVelvetGlove
On a side note, can we put an end to the use of the word "rotorcrafts" ?
The plural of rotorcraft is rotorcraft.
The plural of rotorcraft is rotorcraft.
I'm a German citizen, currently working in the US as a CFI on a J1 visa..
my training here cost me around $60,000. During my time working here, I will make $30,000 at the most. And most of that will be spent here to cover my costs of living.
Someone explain to me how this is bad for the US economy / aviation industry?
my training here cost me around $60,000. During my time working here, I will make $30,000 at the most. And most of that will be spent here to cover my costs of living.
Someone explain to me how this is bad for the US economy / aviation industry?
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Av8rdan's World of Flying
Some people are making this out to be a sudden, petulant outbreak from the State Department, it is not. It has nothing to do with terrorism, borders or GW Bush, its those J1 students, from all professions, who have overstayed their visas to work illegally in the US. Unfortunately, it affects pilots who are a fraction of the total J1 visas issued every year and as a group are probably the least to blame. That is an assumption on my part because most pilots I know tend to be law abiding and more conscientious than the average
and employers have to be careful who they hire so they also toe the line, when convenient.
Cross pollination of ideas, training and techniques is always a good thing and it is a pity that some of the experience as a CFI will be lost. The real losers are the flight schools who will need to train and employ US CFI's for the JAA syllabus and they will need to pay more because they cant use desperate J1 holders anymore. Some CFI's will need to get a JAA instructors rating, I wonder how many will be able to work in JAA land?
The amount of money that is spent by the students is not even a drop in the ocean to the US economy so I don't believe that is very relevant. It certainly is not bad for the economy but I don't think the treasury is unduly concerned about running dry.
Oz and NZ may be in the running for JAA training but don't bank on South Africa, too much corruption in the CAA there is going to reduce the credibility of the licence obtained there, even though the training is of a high standard. It will also be very difficult to work there as work permits are definitely more difficult to obtain than a J1 visa has been.
Some people are making this out to be a sudden, petulant outbreak from the State Department, it is not. It has nothing to do with terrorism, borders or GW Bush, its those J1 students, from all professions, who have overstayed their visas to work illegally in the US. Unfortunately, it affects pilots who are a fraction of the total J1 visas issued every year and as a group are probably the least to blame. That is an assumption on my part because most pilots I know tend to be law abiding and more conscientious than the average
and employers have to be careful who they hire so they also toe the line, when convenient.Cross pollination of ideas, training and techniques is always a good thing and it is a pity that some of the experience as a CFI will be lost. The real losers are the flight schools who will need to train and employ US CFI's for the JAA syllabus and they will need to pay more because they cant use desperate J1 holders anymore. Some CFI's will need to get a JAA instructors rating, I wonder how many will be able to work in JAA land?
The amount of money that is spent by the students is not even a drop in the ocean to the US economy so I don't believe that is very relevant. It certainly is not bad for the economy but I don't think the treasury is unduly concerned about running dry.
Oz and NZ may be in the running for JAA training but don't bank on South Africa, too much corruption in the CAA there is going to reduce the credibility of the licence obtained there, even though the training is of a high standard. It will also be very difficult to work there as work permits are definitely more difficult to obtain than a J1 visa has been.
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I agree, Lt Fubar does write English very well.
I was just giving a tip to those who don't realize that using that word in English really sounds odd to native English speakers. Kinda like asking for a "hairs cut".... I meant no offense.
I was just giving a tip to those who don't realize that using that word in English really sounds odd to native English speakers. Kinda like asking for a "hairs cut".... I meant no offense.
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Which school in Aus is conducting JAA rotary training? I was under the impression that the only JAA (rotary) schools outside JAA-land were in the USA?
Sorry guys, my previous post were quite a rant. I can be bit emotional. No sign of booze. I'm flying too often and don't drink much in general. Not a good habit to have. Might change my mind if I ever go planks bush flying though :-/
I'm like a beatnik writer sometimes. One might have to be on the same 'wavelength' or read it again.
Btw, somehow the same wording of 'statement of intent to bla blah' were used at the beginning of the idea to cut it to 18 months etc. the link I gave has links to some pdf docs with the official letter swapping. Didn't happen. Though it seems that even before they stopped approving more schools for J1 visas, they somehow denied Quantum Helicopters in AZ - their application for J1 issuing rights.
Let's leave it to AOPA, HAI, integrated JAA schools and Patrick Corr's charm and persuasive/lobbying skills.
The worst scenario for heli wannabes is to come on M1, do all the training up to CFI and then return on F1, paying some community college, ERAU or UVSC for Associate degree, have some credit hours waived due to certs/ratings and work part-time instructing in the school, as it's 'on-campus' technically. Still, very limiting and time consuming since the school has to hire the guy/gal and no 'externship' ie going to some small heli school that's just hiring with original school's J1 visa 'administered' still by it (complying to rules) There's also the OPT, temporary work visa in the discipline that can be authorised by the college/Uni to get experience in the field. Not sure it's worth 'wasting' at least 12k USD on AAS/AS degree just to have F1 plus other living costs and limited options.
RE: singular, plural and non-native speakers
There's too many exceptions to rules EN students don't know and natives have the feeling but can't explain it or give a definition.
Snob plurals, mutated plurals (umlaut), discretionary plurals, plurals in singular form, irregular plurals, words with two plural versions, French, Latin exceptions and English deviations to the original plurals (also due to using them 'in English grammar way') different context meanings, ay ay ay....
From my experience, there are far too many native speakers in the UK or US who can't spell correctly - websites, papers, everywhere. Even huge billboard ads with 5 words of which one screwed up..
Sorry guys, but that looks kinda redneckish to me -far more than someone using English as second or third language making trivial mistakes.
RE: 1000TT R22/S300 CFIing relevance, well even if not insurance reasons, it's still experience. and it's P1. Self-funding JAA ME IR(R) after rotary CPL is nice, but will get P2 time, so not best for jobhunting after NS without becoming captain first. That's what folks in the know write on PPRuNe. Also North Sea may not be the only option after CPL and instructing, though likely in Europe.
As for sponsorships and CPL 'cadet schemes', look at Bond in UK recently. Quite in demand even when part self-funded.
North Sea is virtually the only chance in the UK for fresh CPL or even experienced instructors without turbine time. It's almost Catch-22 we 'youngsters' can't beat without military background. C'est la vie.
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Not sure about Bristow Academy, but there's more US helicopter instructors teaching Germans and Norwegians than US students in proportion. Thus looking to me like all the heli students being trained by Americans SHOULDN'T BE HERE TO LET AMERICANS HOURBUILD ON THEM DAMN FAST. Right?
(KHIO -main part of Hillsboro Aviation. Not sure about numbers in KTTD since it's not for M1/J1 students)
(KHIO -main part of Hillsboro Aviation. Not sure about numbers in KTTD since it's not for M1/J1 students)
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It certainly is not bad for the economy but I don't think the treasury is unduly concerned about running dry.
.So what do you guys think the chances are that this dumb hillbilly decision made by a bunch of dumb hillbillies will get reversed at some point in the 4-8 years of the new guy's("the not yet President Obama" as Jon Stewart puts it) reign? He does seem to be showing some sort of knowledge of how the world works so far, well certainly more than the current bumbling idiot.