Cleveland Police go it alone!!!!!!!!
Chief Bottle Washer
Originally Posted by Phil Space
Cleveland Police area covers approximately 230 square miles and has a population of over 554,000.
How the hell can they justify spending all that money on a helicopter?
How the hell can they justify spending all that money on a helicopter?
Since you seem to be on a mission to stir on Rotorheads without showing much in the way of commonsense, maybe you could read previous posts and see this as a justification:
The use of the aircraft has resulted in the equivalent of 116,021 officer hours being saved across the Force during October to December. This would equate to a cost saving of approximately £794,192 compared to officers on the ground being deployed to the same incidents.
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Back seat drivers I stand corrected
To the drivers and back seat drivers who have pointed out the error of my calcualations, I stand corrected. I will sit in the naughty corner and make the tea for the rest of the shift 
From what I have been told the Chief and his councillor lackies around the large authority table up at Ladgate Lane are once again planning to pay more than expected in 2012.
They will be paying over £5m for 2011 with the units £2m running costs. Wright123 you were right
They had to add £0.5m last year when the EC airframe and PBH contracts were split into 2 seperate contracts courtesy of ECUK.
That took the cost of Cleveland Police going into alone rising from £800k as a 2008-9 NEASU consortium member (started at less than £400k in 1995) to the current £2m a year to cover the small "ex county" of Cleveland. Its now 4 seperate councils all paying into the Police pot.
The latest Claveland report states they are expecting to pay even more which means my council tax will have to go up AGAIN, as the gov has no money.
http://www.clevelandpa.org.uk/admin/...e%20Update.pdf
ITEM 3.6
"At present it is still believed that by joining the National Air Service, we would be paying £535,000 more than our present budget, for the first 4 or 5 years, and then £300,000 more than our present budget after that. It is also still the intention that we would operate only 20 hours per day, with cover from other forces in the North East."
As for JAFO and his new little handshake sign, I've come across agreed passengers before who used to say "look over there on the RIGHT 9'o'clock! yes they often didnt know their right from their lefts. But back to the thread again, intead of the bickering.
I'm still open to offers NPAS, but you may have to use a red pen on my calculations now and again
To thomas coupling, thank you for giving an accurate price for a new EC135p2 ;
"A new 135P2+ costs between 5.2 and 5.6 million fully equipped dependent on whether the final cost was protected against currency fluctuations
Some forces warranted against euro fluctuations and others failed to do so."
From what I have been told the Chief and his councillor lackies around the large authority table up at Ladgate Lane are once again planning to pay more than expected in 2012.
They will be paying over £5m for 2011 with the units £2m running costs. Wright123 you were right
They had to add £0.5m last year when the EC airframe and PBH contracts were split into 2 seperate contracts courtesy of ECUK.
That took the cost of Cleveland Police going into alone rising from £800k as a 2008-9 NEASU consortium member (started at less than £400k in 1995) to the current £2m a year to cover the small "ex county" of Cleveland. Its now 4 seperate councils all paying into the Police pot.
The latest Claveland report states they are expecting to pay even more which means my council tax will have to go up AGAIN, as the gov has no money.
http://www.clevelandpa.org.uk/admin/...e%20Update.pdf
ITEM 3.6
"At present it is still believed that by joining the National Air Service, we would be paying £535,000 more than our present budget, for the first 4 or 5 years, and then £300,000 more than our present budget after that. It is also still the intention that we would operate only 20 hours per day, with cover from other forces in the North East."
As for JAFO and his new little handshake sign, I've come across agreed passengers before who used to say "look over there on the RIGHT 9'o'clock! yes they often didnt know their right from their lefts. But back to the thread again, intead of the bickering.
I'm still open to offers NPAS, but you may have to use a red pen on my calculations now and again
To thomas coupling, thank you for giving an accurate price for a new EC135p2 ;
"A new 135P2+ costs between 5.2 and 5.6 million fully equipped dependent on whether the final cost was protected against currency fluctuations
Some forces warranted against euro fluctuations and others failed to do so."
Last edited by props stopped; 1st Mar 2011 at 11:09. Reason: Added 135 cost from TC
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Did I read it wrong ?
To me the report looks like Cleveland Poice are saying that IF they join NPAS
( which is supposed to be about saving money ), then it will cost them MORE than their exisiting budget
( Para 3.6 of the report & Conclusion at Para 5.1 of the report ),
by the figures quoted of £535,000 per year for the first four or five years,
then "only" £300,000 per year more for each year thereafter,
hence the reason for calling for further meetings to clarify the dubious figures
used by NPAS in their orignal report to the Chief Constables,
but if they DIDN'T join NPAS, then their exisiting budget,
planned for forthcoming years, would be less than with NPAS ??
To me the report looks like Cleveland Poice are saying that IF they join NPAS
( which is supposed to be about saving money ), then it will cost them MORE than their exisiting budget
( Para 3.6 of the report & Conclusion at Para 5.1 of the report ),
by the figures quoted of £535,000 per year for the first four or five years,
then "only" £300,000 per year more for each year thereafter,
hence the reason for calling for further meetings to clarify the dubious figures
used by NPAS in their orignal report to the Chief Constables,
but if they DIDN'T join NPAS, then their exisiting budget,
planned for forthcoming years, would be less than with NPAS ??
As for JAFO and his new little handshake sign, I've come across agreed passengers before who used to say "look over there on the RIGHT 9'o'clock! yes they often didnt know their right from their lefts.
My little avatar wasn't directed at you, anyway. It was directed at someone who thought they could wag their finger at me because I had the temerity to point out that you'd got your sums wrong.
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North East pilot turnover?
Props, I used to fly up that way while doing my bit for Her Maj, but in the finer N.York's Dishforth palace years ago.
Was tempted by an offer of some contract ASU flying up in the north east a while ago, but heard on the grapevine while in Oxford that there were quiet a few jafo's in the geordie and smoggy empires who were very hard work, and thought they were flying it.
Is that why they go through so many pilots at those 2 north east bases, or is something else going on?
Money seems the same all over the country except the MET who are well paid.
The pilot turnover up there is well over the odds over the last 15 years, so there must be something wrong somewhere for over 40 drivers to vanish for one reason or another? I did hear about 2 rtemporary elief pilots who were contracted in who both refused to go back due to the hostile obs!
Not so sure the smoggy base would be the place to move to with the problems of further funding, but I'd jump at the chance for another N.Yorks placement if an ASU ever happened in that county.
Was tempted by an offer of some contract ASU flying up in the north east a while ago, but heard on the grapevine while in Oxford that there were quiet a few jafo's in the geordie and smoggy empires who were very hard work, and thought they were flying it.
Is that why they go through so many pilots at those 2 north east bases, or is something else going on?
Money seems the same all over the country except the MET who are well paid.
The pilot turnover up there is well over the odds over the last 15 years, so there must be something wrong somewhere for over 40 drivers to vanish for one reason or another? I did hear about 2 rtemporary elief pilots who were contracted in who both refused to go back due to the hostile obs!
Not so sure the smoggy base would be the place to move to with the problems of further funding, but I'd jump at the chance for another N.Yorks placement if an ASU ever happened in that county.
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Beach party
What a waste of time and money using a helicopter to move this lot on. The housing estates and towns in the area would have been a lot quieter if they had left the teenagers on the beach 
BBC News - Police helicopter ends Teesside teenage beach party
A couple of dogs might have been a cheaper option if they were really causing problems.
Instead of using more asu budget hours to visit this nursery (has happened 4 times to different schools in the last year), wouldnt a video of the asu operations have been a wiser move in saving money, instead of dropping into a NURSERY!! Or was it an observer or pilot dropping in to see their kids to impress?
Police Helicopter Drops In | Yarm School - Independent Nursery, Preparatory School, Senior School and Sixth Form in Tees Valley, North East England
Cleveland Police must have money to burn while everyone else is cuttting back
BBC News - Police helicopter ends Teesside teenage beach party
A couple of dogs might have been a cheaper option if they were really causing problems.
Instead of using more asu budget hours to visit this nursery (has happened 4 times to different schools in the last year), wouldnt a video of the asu operations have been a wiser move in saving money, instead of dropping into a NURSERY!! Or was it an observer or pilot dropping in to see their kids to impress?
Police Helicopter Drops In | Yarm School - Independent Nursery, Preparatory School, Senior School and Sixth Form in Tees Valley, North East England
Cleveland Police must have money to burn while everyone else is cuttting back
Last edited by wright123; 6th Mar 2011 at 11:16.
Was the A/C tasked specifically for the Beach task?
How many other assets were available?
Were the dogs elsewhere?
School visit, if you can combine a visit with another job or a land away why not?
How many other assets were available?
Were the dogs elsewhere?
School visit, if you can combine a visit with another job or a land away why not?
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Memo to the Chief Chap Price
Yes it was specfically tasked to the fly the beach flag job. An expensive Flying panda as usual!!!!!!! Not exactly a misper search was it?
As for the recent Nursery helicopter visit, the daily log for the day says it was the job of the day, and wasnt combined with any other task!
The same observers with lots of badges have done the same thing with 4 different schools in the not so sprawling county of Cleveland last year as well.
Memo to Chief Constabule Price and his merry men, havent you heard of a video or power point presentation like the Northumbrian fine men do? instead of wasting £1500 per hour to drop in on a colleagues kids to pose infront of the teachers?
I'm sure there is something written in the CAA files about the dangers of landing on school fields with kids about. Cleveland will be giving jollies around the school next!!!!!
When Northumbria ran the constortium show there wasnt any of these posing trips to schools with the a/c! The office duty chap was usually elected to spend a few hours giving talks and going to the meeting by car not helicopter!
Memo to Mr NPAS, I hope you get a grip of this waste of resources in Cleveland when you come to power
As for the recent Nursery helicopter visit, the daily log for the day says it was the job of the day, and wasnt combined with any other task!
The same observers with lots of badges have done the same thing with 4 different schools in the not so sprawling county of Cleveland last year as well.
Memo to Chief Constabule Price and his merry men, havent you heard of a video or power point presentation like the Northumbrian fine men do? instead of wasting £1500 per hour to drop in on a colleagues kids to pose infront of the teachers?
I'm sure there is something written in the CAA files about the dangers of landing on school fields with kids about. Cleveland will be giving jollies around the school next!!!!!
When Northumbria ran the constortium show there wasnt any of these posing trips to schools with the a/c! The office duty chap was usually elected to spend a few hours giving talks and going to the meeting by car not helicopter!
Memo to Mr NPAS, I hope you get a grip of this waste of resources in Cleveland when you come to power
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trying to look cool on yet another posing mission!
What a pose, medals and all
Gazette Live - News - Local News - Cleveland Police’s air operations unit visits Stockton schools
Gazette Live - News - Local News - Cleveland Police’s air operations unit visits Stockton schools
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So props...whats wrong with showing the tax paying community what there money has gone. Kids and adults alike love to see this type of stuff and it goes a long way to mixing in with the community and that does mean a lot these days.
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Role equipment costs.
Budgie; I heard that the camera system alone was getting on for a million but cant remember if that was with the service support package?
Then there is airwaves, they are changing systems as we type and how much will that take to sort?
Different dowlink packages, search lights, different forces wanting switches and monitors etc in different places, its never ending.
Power by the hour packages, airframe packages, all add to the ongoing costs, and thats without paying the 30yr service observers who are on more than a pilot with their overtime, and the cost of running the unit, fuel, rent etc.
As for posing at schools, hasnt the Cleveland UEO heard of Best Value, the Chief should be getting a grip of that place and make them take a car to give their speech.
By all means visit schools and show a video of the helicopter, give out some posters, but come on its a complete waste of money to task a £1500 per hour a/c to drop into various schools across Cleveland to pose.
NPAS I hope you have plans set up for this waste of resources in the not so large ex county of cleveland.
Map of Police Stations
Then there is airwaves, they are changing systems as we type and how much will that take to sort?
Different dowlink packages, search lights, different forces wanting switches and monitors etc in different places, its never ending.
Power by the hour packages, airframe packages, all add to the ongoing costs, and thats without paying the 30yr service observers who are on more than a pilot with their overtime, and the cost of running the unit, fuel, rent etc.
As for posing at schools, hasnt the Cleveland UEO heard of Best Value, the Chief should be getting a grip of that place and make them take a car to give their speech.
By all means visit schools and show a video of the helicopter, give out some posters, but come on its a complete waste of money to task a £1500 per hour a/c to drop into various schools across Cleveland to pose.
NPAS I hope you have plans set up for this waste of resources in the not so large ex county of cleveland.
Map of Police Stations
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If you take your blinkers off for a moment 
and think. The helicopter will not just pop into a school at the over inflated cost you came up with. It would have dropped in whilst on the way back from a task. So now whilst at the school a task comes in closer to where they are now than would have been if they had been at base.
so now less transit time and closer to the task means it's actually cheaper to have been at the school than at base. Open your eyes
and think. The helicopter will not just pop into a school at the over inflated cost you came up with. It would have dropped in whilst on the way back from a task. So now whilst at the school a task comes in closer to where they are now than would have been if they had been at base.so now less transit time and closer to the task means it's actually cheaper to have been at the school than at base. Open your eyes
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Mr Budgie, if you knew what went on at Cleveland Police, you would know that these school visits are pre-planned and are not tagged onto tasks which you mention.
The logs show this to be a fact, and all the schools all had to be prepared for the photo call with the press in attendance (more than 4 seperate schools). It is discussed as a planned trip on the force website.
I suggest you take your blinkers off when it comes to what goes on up north, as it might be different down south, but to me its a waste of money.
May I be as bold to make a suggestion to Cleveland's finest and Councillor McLuckie, who spends my taxes.
Organise a coach trip paid for by the school to visit the helicopter at their Sleepy Hollow base, or better still let the schools all know when the yearly Ridewell show is on, and they can attend that as the helicopter is also on display there each year.
"This initiative is part of a Force wide police programme, which will see the Air Operations Unit visit schools in all four districts"
School Pupils get a Flying Visit from Cleveland Police Air Operations Unit
Schools Get Flying Visit
Helicopter treat for pupils after Mia wins contest (From The Northern Echo)
The logs show this to be a fact, and all the schools all had to be prepared for the photo call with the press in attendance (more than 4 seperate schools). It is discussed as a planned trip on the force website.
I suggest you take your blinkers off when it comes to what goes on up north, as it might be different down south, but to me its a waste of money.
May I be as bold to make a suggestion to Cleveland's finest and Councillor McLuckie, who spends my taxes.
Organise a coach trip paid for by the school to visit the helicopter at their Sleepy Hollow base, or better still let the schools all know when the yearly Ridewell show is on, and they can attend that as the helicopter is also on display there each year.
"This initiative is part of a Force wide police programme, which will see the Air Operations Unit visit schools in all four districts"
School Pupils get a Flying Visit from Cleveland Police Air Operations Unit
Schools Get Flying Visit
Helicopter treat for pupils after Mia wins contest (From The Northern Echo)
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How Bitter
Prop Stopped. Thank god they were..... Just because you lost your job here at "Sleepy hollow" there is no need for such a vendeta.
Whist some of your points are valid most are not and so twisted from the truth. If you really care for your community you may actually support the machine which you gave so many years too......if you call the unit or pp me I'll be glad to discuss all your points
Whist some of your points are valid most are not and so twisted from the truth. If you really care for your community you may actually support the machine which you gave so many years too......if you call the unit or pp me I'll be glad to discuss all your points
Chief Bottle Washer
Originally Posted by props stopped
Memo to Chief Constabule Price and his merry men, havent you heard of a video or power point presentation like the Northumbrian fine men do? instead of wasting £1500 per hour to drop in on a colleagues kids to pose infront of the teachers?
The PR of exposing school age kids to Police equipment and the hands-on thrill of actually seeing the machine is inestimable, and to be commended in this PC conscious age. Instead of treating the results (soaring youth crime rates, etc) this is addressing the issue of 'us vs them' at an early and formative stage.