AS350 Astar/Squirrel
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: Australia
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Thanks for that.
Can i conclude that when TURBOMECA state the below that N2 is the Ng gage ? It still don't sound right but the number are usable!
When N2 decreases and reaches a value between 85% and 70% then rises above 98%
F2 = 0.1 (engine PRE-MOD TU77)
F2 = 0.3 (engine POST_MOD TU77)
When N2 decreases and reaches a value less than 70%, then rises above 98%: F2=1
Can i conclude that when TURBOMECA state the below that N2 is the Ng gage ? It still don't sound right but the number are usable!
When N2 decreases and reaches a value between 85% and 70% then rises above 98%
F2 = 0.1 (engine PRE-MOD TU77)
F2 = 0.3 (engine POST_MOD TU77)
When N2 decreases and reaches a value less than 70%, then rises above 98%: F2=1
Ezy,
I dont know where your original source of info came from but the N2 does not make sense to me and should actually be Ng.
The incident that I referred was a 350B1 with a 1D engine which was doing repetitive lift jobs with periods on the ground at idle. Partial cycles were not being recorded and the gas generator assembly eventually "left the building" so to speak.
General consensus is that recording of partial cycles has not been recorded so well in the past as it is quite difficult to achieve accurately without some assistance from automation. Many operators got a bit of a wakeup call when migrating from B2 to B3 which of course does it automatically! This is evident mostly with repetitive heavy lifting.
If you dig really deep in 350B SB's and TM TU's there is/was a tacho box modification that will/would do it for you. That being said there are aftermarket units out there that may be more economic as that mod may have disappeared.
The trick with the formula is knowing the maximum Ng achieved for a particular flight plus the number of times the Ng goes below 70%. If you have a flight profile that is pretty standard it is not so difficult but other profiles can be a distraction.
I dont know where your original source of info came from but the N2 does not make sense to me and should actually be Ng.
The incident that I referred was a 350B1 with a 1D engine which was doing repetitive lift jobs with periods on the ground at idle. Partial cycles were not being recorded and the gas generator assembly eventually "left the building" so to speak.
General consensus is that recording of partial cycles has not been recorded so well in the past as it is quite difficult to achieve accurately without some assistance from automation. Many operators got a bit of a wakeup call when migrating from B2 to B3 which of course does it automatically! This is evident mostly with repetitive heavy lifting.
If you dig really deep in 350B SB's and TM TU's there is/was a tacho box modification that will/would do it for you. That being said there are aftermarket units out there that may be more economic as that mod may have disappeared.
The trick with the formula is knowing the maximum Ng achieved for a particular flight plus the number of times the Ng goes below 70%. If you have a flight profile that is pretty standard it is not so difficult but other profiles can be a distraction.
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: Italy
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AS 350 BA vs AS350 B3
Hi
I need an information,
do you think it is useful take type rating AS350 BA then proceed with AS 350 B3 with only 2 hours or it is better take type rating directly to AS350 B3 , in this case you can not pilot AS 350 Ba without other 5 hours?
how many AS 350 around europe or outside europe are available?
thank you
I need an information,
do you think it is useful take type rating AS350 BA then proceed with AS 350 B3 with only 2 hours or it is better take type rating directly to AS350 B3 , in this case you can not pilot AS 350 Ba without other 5 hours?
how many AS 350 around europe or outside europe are available?
thank you
Given the apparent susceptibility of the AS350/5's cabin to 'falling off' at the slightest provocation (okay, well some provocation) and given that they are still being produced .. wouldn't it be possible for our friends in Marignane to install a couple of roof spars extending say from the engine deck (where perhaps the spar could be mounted) forward into the fabric (or underside) of the cabin roof and in the general vicinity depicted by the yellow stripe in the image below?
The significant issues are gearbox intrusion into the back seat and errant rotor blade into the front.
Perhaps your roof member could be designed to deflect the blade? Massive forces involved though...
After looking at ways to integrate camera processing and monitors in the rear I came up with a concept of a carbon fibre framework that installs inside the cockpit like a roll cage.
Seats and electronic kit attach to the framework. You would lose one seat in the rear. Then I though that if the frame work extended to the front that it would aid survivability of front seat passengers. There is space between front seats and door for the frame work. Would be very expensive to develop.
It is a glaring design issue that the blade can bend down and chop off the top half of the cabin.
I'm not a stranger to the manufacture of F1 bodies, given a clean sheet... one could make a new cabin in composite as one piece. In a prang the entire ball could detach and (with luck) roll away from the noise, fuel and moving parts.
I reckon this is better than the latest composite designs that incorporate engine mounts fuel cell and tail boom into the passenger cell.
Whilst there is little choice the more we crow about poor crash worthiness the better... as demonstrated by R44 fuel cell situation.
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Germany
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@blueriver
my 2 cents: It depends on your situation. Are you going to fly B3's only afterwards? Are you paying yourself for the typerating?
In general the B3 is just a piece of cake coming from a B/BA/B2. Startup by simply turning a (ok, two) switches. No 'real' governor failures to train and usually no need to think about power available.
However, if it was my pocket, i'd to the TR on a BA (i did actually) and differences training for the B3 afterwards (45-60 min of flight ... typically like a checkflight). The typerating itself actually is AS350/350B3/130B4 with only differences training between them.
It depends on the owner anyway whether he gives you his helicopter with less than 20ish hours supervision on type.
Whatever you do: Have fun (you definately will)
my 2 cents: It depends on your situation. Are you going to fly B3's only afterwards? Are you paying yourself for the typerating?
In general the B3 is just a piece of cake coming from a B/BA/B2. Startup by simply turning a (ok, two) switches. No 'real' governor failures to train and usually no need to think about power available.
However, if it was my pocket, i'd to the TR on a BA (i did actually) and differences training for the B3 afterwards (45-60 min of flight ... typically like a checkflight). The typerating itself actually is AS350/350B3/130B4 with only differences training between them.
It depends on the owner anyway whether he gives you his helicopter with less than 20ish hours supervision on type.
Whatever you do: Have fun (you definately will)
Join Date: Dec 2000
Location: Desert Rat
Age: 53
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As 350 low rotor rpm audio warning
I have a question about the "low rotor rpm audio warning" button.
Does the low rotor rpm warning horn sound before starting the engine? The check which I was tought was starting the engine first, and then while running up check if the low rotor rpm audio warning goes off at approximately 360 rpm.
Feedback apreciated.
Cheers,
Alouette
Does the low rotor rpm warning horn sound before starting the engine? The check which I was tought was starting the engine first, and then while running up check if the low rotor rpm audio warning goes off at approximately 360 rpm.
Feedback apreciated.
Cheers,
Alouette
Fuel filter drain - B2
When draining the fuel filter (by the main gear box, port side) it tends to spray all over the place...!
Has any one come up with a funnel or fuel catcher system to prevent this?
Has any one come up with a funnel or fuel catcher system to prevent this?
Join Date: May 2008
Location: usa
Age: 43
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Flyting
I found it best to just use a very light pressure. This allows fuel to drain at a better pace, which keeps it from pooling on the floor. I little practice and you should be able to not spill any.
I found it best to just use a very light pressure. This allows fuel to drain at a better pace, which keeps it from pooling on the floor. I little practice and you should be able to not spill any.
Join Date: May 2008
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"Does the low rotor rpm warning horn sound before starting the engine? The check which I was tought was starting the engine first, and then while running up check if the low rotor rpm audio warning goes off at approximately 360 rpm."
BA & B2 you can press the "horn" button with the engine off and master electrical on, it should sound. Horn is muted (with button in) when hyd pressure > 30 bar & RPM < 250. And when RPM > 360 (& < 410 *B2*)
BA & B2 you can press the "horn" button with the engine off and master electrical on, it should sound. Horn is muted (with button in) when hyd pressure > 30 bar & RPM < 250. And when RPM > 360 (& < 410 *B2*)
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: Australia
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Get a short length of clear tube (6 inches) and keep it in your fuel drain jar. Tygon tube is the best as it does not age harden, this also stops false readings from the muck stuck in the drain tube under your filter housing.
BA speed
My BA Newly acquired is excellent for lifting power hovering ige at 68/70 Torque at max gross + but seems slow. 96 ng 65torque 650Temp and it runs about 100 105 kts with 1 pax and half fuel. Any engineers know how to tweak it up speed wise? Its dead smooth so a bit reluctant to muck around if there is no real benefit I would like to see 115k. I suppose I can pull 97ng but I don't like pushing it too hard. Is it a flat pitch setting issue?
Join Date: May 2008
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BA speed
One thing that might help. The 350 is a little harder to tell if you are in trim, if you are coming from a robbie. Two things can throw you off.
The trim string out on the little flag pole makes it hard to know if you are exactly in trim. The second really is because the 350 can be loaded with a large variety of lateral CG, so to be truly in trim you may feel like you are leaning, the ball will be off. Just a little out of trim can easily steal 5-8 knots, without you really even being aware.
One thing that might help. The 350 is a little harder to tell if you are in trim, if you are coming from a robbie. Two things can throw you off.
The trim string out on the little flag pole makes it hard to know if you are exactly in trim. The second really is because the 350 can be loaded with a large variety of lateral CG, so to be truly in trim you may feel like you are leaning, the ball will be off. Just a little out of trim can easily steal 5-8 knots, without you really even being aware.
agodesign
Thanks I know what you mean on the balance, I might have it worked out there has been a problem with the bleed valve not shutting. When I first got it it was faster then got slower, now bleed valve is not shutting at all. Will be replacing the little black box( pilot tech talk) next week. I suspect this might help. Will advise.
Yes they can but you have to look very deep into the circumstances.
HB 350 B - No unless upgraded to a BA.
There are a few BA's and B2's that have migrated outside Brazil.
The eligible serial number document L102-001 is the key and you may have fun trying to view that!
AE-MS refers to American Eurocopter Mississippi.
HB 350 B - No unless upgraded to a BA.
There are a few BA's and B2's that have migrated outside Brazil.
The eligible serial number document L102-001 is the key and you may have fun trying to view that!
AE-MS refers to American Eurocopter Mississippi.
EASA TCDS R.008
AS 350 BA
1. Eligible serial numbers: - AS 350 BA aircraft S/N 2588 and up.
- AS 350 B aircraft converted into AS 350 BA by application of Service Bulletin n° 01.00.35
- AS 350 D aircraft converted into AS 350 BA by application of Service Bulletin n° 01.00.40.
The aircrafts whose s/n is listed in Eurocopter document L102-001 are manufactured under Helibras and those in L102-002 under
AE-MS license.
AS 350 B2
1. Eligible serial numbers: - AS 350 B2 aircraft S/N 2100 and up
- AS 350 B1 aircraft converted into AS 350 B2 by application of Service Bulletin n° 01.26 or
01.00.26
- AS 350 B aircraft converted into AS 350 B2 by application of Service Bulletin n° 01.00.51
- AS 350 BA aircraft converted into AS 350 B2 by application of Service Bulletin n° 01.00.50 or
Service Bulletin n° 01.90.61
- AS 350 B2 with VEMD major modification: aircraft S/N 4129 and up
The aircrafts whose s/n is listed in Eurocopter document L102-001 are manufactured under Helibras license and those in L 102-002
under AE-MS license.
AS 350 B3
1. Eligible serial numbers: - AS 350 B3 aircraft S/N 2968, S/N 3063 and up.
- AS 350 B3 aircraft S/N 4201 and up for a/c incorporating mod. OP-3369 (2370 kg weight extension)
- AS 350 B3 aircraft S/N 4767 and up for a/c incorporating mod. OP-4305 (without or with mod. OP-
3369)
The aircraft whose s/n is listed in Eurocopter documents L102-001 are manufactured under Helibras license and those in L102-002
under AE-MS license.
AS 350 BA
1. Eligible serial numbers: - AS 350 BA aircraft S/N 2588 and up.
- AS 350 B aircraft converted into AS 350 BA by application of Service Bulletin n° 01.00.35
- AS 350 D aircraft converted into AS 350 BA by application of Service Bulletin n° 01.00.40.
The aircrafts whose s/n is listed in Eurocopter document L102-001 are manufactured under Helibras and those in L102-002 under
AE-MS license.
AS 350 B2
1. Eligible serial numbers: - AS 350 B2 aircraft S/N 2100 and up
- AS 350 B1 aircraft converted into AS 350 B2 by application of Service Bulletin n° 01.26 or
01.00.26
- AS 350 B aircraft converted into AS 350 B2 by application of Service Bulletin n° 01.00.51
- AS 350 BA aircraft converted into AS 350 B2 by application of Service Bulletin n° 01.00.50 or
Service Bulletin n° 01.90.61
- AS 350 B2 with VEMD major modification: aircraft S/N 4129 and up
The aircrafts whose s/n is listed in Eurocopter document L102-001 are manufactured under Helibras license and those in L 102-002
under AE-MS license.
AS 350 B3
1. Eligible serial numbers: - AS 350 B3 aircraft S/N 2968, S/N 3063 and up.
- AS 350 B3 aircraft S/N 4201 and up for a/c incorporating mod. OP-3369 (2370 kg weight extension)
- AS 350 B3 aircraft S/N 4767 and up for a/c incorporating mod. OP-4305 (without or with mod. OP-
3369)
The aircraft whose s/n is listed in Eurocopter documents L102-001 are manufactured under Helibras license and those in L102-002
under AE-MS license.