NSW EMS (NGO or Private operator)
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Dragons, the contract is a health dept one, if the public get behind SLSA and CareFlight, without a contract they will get no work! As far as CHC taking on crew, rest assured that will have to happen, have you noticed they have been advertising recently. Sure some existing CHC people will go to Sydney, CHC will want existing CHC staff to run the show, and educate those who are accepted how to operate to the CHC song. Everyone understands that people are upset at losing the contract, but life moves on, and the sooner it becomes accepted the better it will be for all concerned. The CareFlight docs have said they won't play, and that CHC can find their own Docs, not required that is the responsibility of the Health Dept, they will fly in aircraft supplied and crewed by CHC. The people of NSW will continue to have Docs and Paramedics land on the side of the road and transport the sick and injured. If the Doc's from CareFlight do not want to work for health and fly on the helicopters, the question could be asked "are they doing it for the good of the NSW public now or are they doing it to inflate their own ego's??" I would hope that they would reconsider once the dust has settled, because they do do a good job.
fatty
fatty
Some recent news reports
Some recent news reports
Last Update: Friday, December 8, 2006. 8:00pm (AEDT)
Rescue chopper decision 'nonsensical'
The New South Wales Opposition has promised to reverse a State Government decision to hand over the rescue helicopter contract to a foreign company if it wins the next election. The Government has today announced that the Canadian Helicopter Corporation has been awarded the tender to provide nine new aircraft.
The decision ends the contracts of the two charity services, NRMA Careflight and the Westpac Rescue Helicopter. Opposition health spokeswoman Jillian Skinner says the decision is incomprehensible. "We will halt this contract review, the whole process, open it to public gaze and move forward from there," she said. "It's just simply nonsensical and I can tell you the community rage is palpable."
Helicopter services upgraded
December 9, 2006
The Illawarra's rescue helicopter will soon be flying 24 hours a day in what's seen as a major victory for the region. Unions said yesterday's announcement was the culmination of a three-year community campaign to extend the rescue service, now operating 10 hours a day.
The State Government said yesterday that CHC Australia had won the hotly contested contract to cover the upgraded Wollongong service, as well as those in Sydney and Orange.
Four new twin-engine helicopters will be used, which are up to 30 per cent faster than existing aircraft and can carry heavier loads.
The decision attracted criticism from the existing rescue helicopter operators, NRMA CareFlight and Westpac Life Saver Rescue Helicopter Service, which cover Sydney and Orange and will now be replaced.
Last Update: Friday, December 8, 2006. 8:00pm (AEDT)
Rescue chopper decision 'nonsensical'
The New South Wales Opposition has promised to reverse a State Government decision to hand over the rescue helicopter contract to a foreign company if it wins the next election. The Government has today announced that the Canadian Helicopter Corporation has been awarded the tender to provide nine new aircraft.
The decision ends the contracts of the two charity services, NRMA Careflight and the Westpac Rescue Helicopter. Opposition health spokeswoman Jillian Skinner says the decision is incomprehensible. "We will halt this contract review, the whole process, open it to public gaze and move forward from there," she said. "It's just simply nonsensical and I can tell you the community rage is palpable."
Helicopter services upgraded
December 9, 2006
The Illawarra's rescue helicopter will soon be flying 24 hours a day in what's seen as a major victory for the region. Unions said yesterday's announcement was the culmination of a three-year community campaign to extend the rescue service, now operating 10 hours a day.
The State Government said yesterday that CHC Australia had won the hotly contested contract to cover the upgraded Wollongong service, as well as those in Sydney and Orange.
Four new twin-engine helicopters will be used, which are up to 30 per cent faster than existing aircraft and can carry heavier loads.
The decision attracted criticism from the existing rescue helicopter operators, NRMA CareFlight and Westpac Life Saver Rescue Helicopter Service, which cover Sydney and Orange and will now be replaced.
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CHC AW139's for Austeralian EMS Contract
Do some further investigating into what the state government exactly paid Westpac and Careflight to do. Even with all the fundraising that these orgs conducted they still received an exhorbitant (spelling??) amount of money (from the state gov) if they flew or not. Once airborne they charged the gov an hourly rate.
I don't know what CHC are going to charge but I'm sure we will find out eventually.
There was a report on the NSW ambulance service website about 6-12 months ago that detailed all the incumbants costings and aircraft availability. Obviously the gov wanted to provide an improved service without too much of an increase in cost (maybe)...
I don't know what CHC are going to charge but I'm sure we will find out eventually.
There was a report on the NSW ambulance service website about 6-12 months ago that detailed all the incumbants costings and aircraft availability. Obviously the gov wanted to provide an improved service without too much of an increase in cost (maybe)...
Last edited by BreakerB; 9th Dec 2006 at 00:05. Reason: minor grammar
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Too early for congratulations or commiserations- remember 1996 when the
people of NSW had their say . Investigations are proceeding into something pretty smelly in the tendering process . CHC`s bid was $100 million more than the leading NGO`s , for an inferior offered service .
people of NSW had their say . Investigations are proceeding into something pretty smelly in the tendering process . CHC`s bid was $100 million more than the leading NGO`s , for an inferior offered service .
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Apocalypse Why?????
Too early for congratulations or commiserations- remember 1996 when the
people of NSW had their say . Investigations are proceeding into something pretty smelly in the tendering process . CHC`s bid was $100 million more than the leading NGO`s , for an inferior offered service .
people of NSW had their say . Investigations are proceeding into something pretty smelly in the tendering process . CHC`s bid was $100 million more than the leading NGO`s , for an inferior offered service .
Bring on CHC i say, better conditions, better pay, more job security... Newcastle, Lismore watch your backs boys, as Gretski would say "you've been evicted, it's time to leave the house"
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The sponsor of the leading NGO pledged the cost of all aircraft required for the contract, and whatever else was required to win it.There is obvious
non-compliance with the tendering acceptance process.
non-compliance with the tendering acceptance process.
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Nsw Ems
Unsure of what the CHC contract will cost. Although these NGOs are funded by donations the gov also pays a substantial fee for the right. See the link below:
http://www.treasury.nsw.gov.au/bp06-...10health_f.pdf
Page four...
http://www.treasury.nsw.gov.au/bp06-...10health_f.pdf
Page four...
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Splot123
There's always an appeal process in every govt tender, sounds like you guys have at least a bit of ammunition in the locker, do you and your brethren have the fortitude to load and fire at will?
I particularly am taken with your attention to cost savings in the 'close in' highest work areas.
cheers tet
There's always an appeal process in every govt tender, sounds like you guys have at least a bit of ammunition in the locker, do you and your brethren have the fortitude to load and fire at will?
I particularly am taken with your attention to cost savings in the 'close in' highest work areas.
cheers tet
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I'm based outside Australia and have no vested interest in any of this. However, I am getting very bemused by all this petition lark. Here are some questions
- Why should the fact that the existing operator has flown the contract for the past X years make any difference?
- Why should the nationality of the ultimate ownership of an operator make any difference? Global village and all that.....
- All organisations had the same tender spec, so if the Ambulance Service of NSW decided one meets their requirements better than the others, is the problem just the inability to accept failure on the part of the unsuccessful bidders?
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Is there any information on the helicopter type to be purchased for the contract and from whom they will be purchased? There is only a limited number of buisnesses in Australia who can supply brand new helicopters.
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ApocalypseThen,
So you are saying that the sponsor of the 'leading' NGO offered Westpac or Careflight anything that they needed to win the contract, wow! that's fantastic.. Based on your previous post, they only needed to give them 1 more dollar and they would have won it... you know $100 million + $1.
Remember your second last post - "CHC`s bid was $100 million more than the leading NGO`s"
They should have sold one more raffle ticket...
So you are saying that the sponsor of the 'leading' NGO offered Westpac or Careflight anything that they needed to win the contract, wow! that's fantastic.. Based on your previous post, they only needed to give them 1 more dollar and they would have won it... you know $100 million + $1.
Remember your second last post - "CHC`s bid was $100 million more than the leading NGO`s"
They should have sold one more raffle ticket...
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Thanks Driptray for the link. It, as expected, didn't reveal the dollars and cents. What it did say was of the 1650 odd missions undertaken in 2005/06, there were 27 per month that needed to wait 2hrs and 12 per month more than 3 hours, which doesn't sound too bad.
I can't see how anyone, CHC or NGO, can improve on that with less machines than they currently have (4 vs 5). Oh well, I am only a mere mortal.
I can't see how anyone, CHC or NGO, can improve on that with less machines than they currently have (4 vs 5). Oh well, I am only a mere mortal.
Quickdraw, you seem determined to live up to your nickname.
I also heard the figure of $100 million extra cost for the CHC tender. Admittedly it came from a Westpac helicopter spokesman in a radio interview - not the most reliable source given the context. There was a detailed post on the CHC AW139 thread presumably from someone in the know in the Careflight organisation, which has since mysteriously disappeared. It gave a fairly detailed cost breakdown of their bid, and mentioned that their sponsors were willing to put up $55 million for 4 AW139's. That's $55 million that Careflight would NOT have to ask the government for, which presumably CHC would have to factor into their own bid. In addition, CHC has to make a profit - Careflight does not, so if you factor in CHC's profit margin over the 10 year life of the contract in addition to the $55 million extra cost of the aircraft, $100 million extra for CHC compared to Careflight doesn't sound quite so ridiculous does it.
The Health Dept. was paying the Westpac Lifesaver mob something like $40,000 per month to operate the Wollongong service. After it was replaced by CHC the cost to the Health Dept ballooned to$180,000 per month for essentially the same service.
I also heard the figure of $100 million extra cost for the CHC tender. Admittedly it came from a Westpac helicopter spokesman in a radio interview - not the most reliable source given the context. There was a detailed post on the CHC AW139 thread presumably from someone in the know in the Careflight organisation, which has since mysteriously disappeared. It gave a fairly detailed cost breakdown of their bid, and mentioned that their sponsors were willing to put up $55 million for 4 AW139's. That's $55 million that Careflight would NOT have to ask the government for, which presumably CHC would have to factor into their own bid. In addition, CHC has to make a profit - Careflight does not, so if you factor in CHC's profit margin over the 10 year life of the contract in addition to the $55 million extra cost of the aircraft, $100 million extra for CHC compared to Careflight doesn't sound quite so ridiculous does it.
The Health Dept. was paying the Westpac Lifesaver mob something like $40,000 per month to operate the Wollongong service. After it was replaced by CHC the cost to the Health Dept ballooned to$180,000 per month for essentially the same service.
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ABC online
Doctors to reject positions with new rescue chopper service
About 40 specialist CareFlight doctors have unanimously agreed not to accept positions in the new New South Wales helicopter rescue service.
The doctors were offered positions by the Health Department after the Government awarded a 10-year helicopter contract to a Canadian company.
CareFlight chairman Ian Badham says the doctors will only reconsider if control of the service is handed back to CareFlight.
"We're more than happy to discuss with [the] Government how we can use these shiny new air taxis they're going to get from the Canadians, but operate them in an integrated way where it's CareFlight's air crew, doctors and management operating these [Canadian] helicopters," he said.
"That would do it safely."
Doctors to reject positions with new rescue chopper service
About 40 specialist CareFlight doctors have unanimously agreed not to accept positions in the new New South Wales helicopter rescue service.
The doctors were offered positions by the Health Department after the Government awarded a 10-year helicopter contract to a Canadian company.
CareFlight chairman Ian Badham says the doctors will only reconsider if control of the service is handed back to CareFlight.
"We're more than happy to discuss with [the] Government how we can use these shiny new air taxis they're going to get from the Canadians, but operate them in an integrated way where it's CareFlight's air crew, doctors and management operating these [Canadian] helicopters," he said.
"That would do it safely."
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Mark Six, It can't have been for the SAME service, after all that's why CHC took over isn't it? The service wasn't there! I just love the way that people make comparisons with big figures with no real comparisons as to what is being offered or required or whatever the case maybe. It always generally starts with.... apparently, or something similar....
You just know you can believe anything that follows.
You just know you can believe anything that follows.
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I think Ian Badham should be careful how he words things, is he inferring CHC the "canadian" company (with all it's "Australian" workforce - If it was still Lloyd helicopters would he have so much to gripe about, and nothing major has changed in australia with regard to the company since then) is unsafe. He must be getting desperate to try and save his job.
JD, By SAME service I mean the scope of the service offered by both organisations was the same, ie winch equipped multi-engine IFR helicopter conducting EMS ops 7 days a week during daylight hours, so operating costs should have been comparable. As for the STANDARD of the service provided, that's obviously another issue altogether.
Agree the "Canadian" bit is unnecessary, along with the "we've saved x thousand lives in the past. Babies will die," etc. I'd like to see them argue their case purely on a costs and standard of service basis. I think the other (emotional) aspects merely cloud the issue without necessarily strengthening their case.
Agree the "Canadian" bit is unnecessary, along with the "we've saved x thousand lives in the past. Babies will die," etc. I'd like to see them argue their case purely on a costs and standard of service basis. I think the other (emotional) aspects merely cloud the issue without necessarily strengthening their case.
Last edited by Mark Six; 10th Dec 2006 at 09:25. Reason: couldn't spell strengthening