Fear of heights?
Been there instructor got out & said OK do a circuit or two, I now realised he was barking, letting me loose with £ 100+k machine, went & hovered & did spot turns for what seemed like ages, radio call G**** do the circuits or you will have to re fuel!! or something like that. did circuit the feeling on landing was relief.
On the X country I kept thinking what am I doing here, as the way points passed I relaxed slightly, then it was time to land again
still got it back in one piece.
I think worry is good stops you becoming over confident.
With 2 hours a month half the flight is a re-learning curve.
On the X country I kept thinking what am I doing here, as the way points passed I relaxed slightly, then it was time to land again
still got it back in one piece.I think worry is good stops you becoming over confident.
With 2 hours a month half the flight is a re-learning curve.
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Few thoughts:
- Brave post, but good to ask
- I think 2 hrs pm / 160 hrs in 5 years is the issue
- Ideally 4 hrs pm, perhaps 1 of which with an instructor advancing your skills
- Aim to try an fly in good, comfortable weather, one less issue to worry about
- Never feel rushed or under pressure, take your time with prep and pfc
- On lift, initially air taxi to the heli training area and spend a few mins doing touch downs, lifts, turns.
- This re-familarises the senses, checks the helicopter is responding correctly, Ts & Ps ok - and you're close to the ground
- Only when you are happy, depart
- Brave post, but good to ask
- I think 2 hrs pm / 160 hrs in 5 years is the issue
- Ideally 4 hrs pm, perhaps 1 of which with an instructor advancing your skills
- Aim to try an fly in good, comfortable weather, one less issue to worry about
- Never feel rushed or under pressure, take your time with prep and pfc
- On lift, initially air taxi to the heli training area and spend a few mins doing touch downs, lifts, turns.
- This re-familarises the senses, checks the helicopter is responding correctly, Ts & Ps ok - and you're close to the ground
- Only when you are happy, depart
I'm with Gordy 
Even after circa 2,000 hrs I still feel uncomfortable above 2,000 ft agl and almost all my flying is done at 500ft . I only go high to make use of a tail wind . My main reason is that I have a few friends who have had emergencies that needed them to get on the ground ASAP ...... In the event of a fire or something shaking lose the time to get down from say 2,000 or higher can be too long . A friend recently did a forced landing with the whole tail rotor assembly hanging off .... If he had been much higher than 500ft he may not be here now as the whole lot would have departed . Each to his own but that is my thoughts !!!
Even after circa 2,000 hrs I still feel uncomfortable above 2,000 ft agl and almost all my flying is done at 500ft . I only go high to make use of a tail wind . My main reason is that I have a few friends who have had emergencies that needed them to get on the ground ASAP ...... In the event of a fire or something shaking lose the time to get down from say 2,000 or higher can be too long . A friend recently did a forced landing with the whole tail rotor assembly hanging off .... If he had been much higher than 500ft he may not be here now as the whole lot would have departed . Each to his own but that is my thoughts !!!
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Same here lower is better, one's nose tends to bleed above 2,000 feet, and I think nigelh is missing a nought, is that nawt all?
Even in the venerable '22 I've had three or four times where height would have been a big issue for emergencies. The smell of burning rubber, lower bearing 'nother day and once a hell of a din, sounded like the shebang falling apart. Just as well I got down quick that day or I'd have had a heart attack. Turned out it was only a cowl had come open.
Even in the venerable '22 I've had three or four times where height would have been a big issue for emergencies. The smell of burning rubber, lower bearing 'nother day and once a hell of a din, sounded like the shebang falling apart. Just as well I got down quick that day or I'd have had a heart attack. Turned out it was only a cowl had come open.
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Anyone scared of heights?
Maybe been done before but ... who is scared of heights?
I did years of paragliding. Could hardly look over the edge and then could run off it happily. Climbed out one Spring day to A100 in my deck chair suspended by dental floss below an elaborately sewn shower curtain.
Flew fixed wings with no issues. Don't love standing on the top deck of a machine looking at the rotorhead, but can do it OK if I can stand on the machine and not a ladder .... Not so keen on flying with the doors off .... but otherwise no issue.
Suspect it's a fear of falling, not heights, and suspect I am not alone. And I can cope with a spider in the cockpit.
Thoughts?
I did years of paragliding. Could hardly look over the edge and then could run off it happily. Climbed out one Spring day to A100 in my deck chair suspended by dental floss below an elaborately sewn shower curtain.
Flew fixed wings with no issues. Don't love standing on the top deck of a machine looking at the rotorhead, but can do it OK if I can stand on the machine and not a ladder .... Not so keen on flying with the doors off .... but otherwise no issue.Suspect it's a fear of falling, not heights, and suspect I am not alone. And I can cope with a spider in the cockpit.
Thoughts?
I had a bit of a brown moment yesterday. I had to take a manlift to around 36ft to reach a fall protection reel under the hangar roof. We didn't have any safety harnesses around (I know...) and I didn't feel the need for one since I regularly work on the manlift unsecured at 10 to 15ft and always feel safe. When I leaned over the handrail to reach the reel I somehow suddenly lost visual reference and had a strong sensation of falling. It got me pretty shaky and boy did it feel good once I got down to more reasonable heights... 
What a nasty feeling that was. I'm convinced that everyone who ever deliberately jumped to kill themselves terribly regretted their decision as soon as they started to accelerate...
For me it's also more the fear of falling. When I'm safety harnessed I don't mind walking to an edge and peeking down. When I'm not secured, I get the unpleasant kind of rush. When a handrail is at breast height, I don't mind sticking my head over it, when it's only at waist height, I feel like my center of gravity is way over the ledge even though I know it's not the case. I get the feeling that someone will pull my feet back to flip me over and my body is anticipating the sensation of that. Always interesting to meet the inner caveman when the instincts kick in.
I never felt like that flying a helicopter. But I've never actually flown above 2500AGL I think. Reading this thread makes me want to take one way up to try and reproduce this shrinking floor phenomenon you guys are talking about.
What a nasty feeling that was. I'm convinced that everyone who ever deliberately jumped to kill themselves terribly regretted their decision as soon as they started to accelerate...For me it's also more the fear of falling. When I'm safety harnessed I don't mind walking to an edge and peeking down. When I'm not secured, I get the unpleasant kind of rush. When a handrail is at breast height, I don't mind sticking my head over it, when it's only at waist height, I feel like my center of gravity is way over the ledge even though I know it's not the case. I get the feeling that someone will pull my feet back to flip me over and my body is anticipating the sensation of that. Always interesting to meet the inner caveman when the instincts kick in.
I never felt like that flying a helicopter. But I've never actually flown above 2500AGL I think. Reading this thread makes me want to take one way up to try and reproduce this shrinking floor phenomenon you guys are talking about.
weeeeeeeeee
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re: Gordy why fly high
Why do you fly so high? I think your fear is not of being alone, but of heights. I rarely go above 500 ft/agl
Then I started to do a lot of instrument flying/instructing where you're often at 4,000-6000 ft or more and you just get used to it.
After a little while you realize that there are lots of benefits - less noise for the people on the ground, lots and lots of places to pick from for an autorotation, and arguably fewer birds/wires/towers.
There are mechanical failures where you would be better off close to the ground, but of the dozen or so failures people I know have had, they've all been failures where extra altitude would have been a benefit (i.e. where they weren't going to lose control of the aircraft if they didn't get it right down).
So, while there's always the risk that you might get one of those types of failures where time is of the essence, I think the odds are against those types of failures and that it's more typically safer to fly higher and a lot more neighborly.
When I fly with someone who likes to fly low I'll roll the throttle off on them (so, say, 500 feet) and then after the (very short) autorotation I'll have them do the same thing from 2,000 feet. Having 16 times the area to pick from for their forced landing, and 4 times as long to think about stuff usually convinces them that higher is better.
That said, if you're afraid when you go higher than 500 feet it's not something you'll quickly cure yourself of - it's not fun flying while scared! But it's something you can gradually work yourself up to.
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Shock reaction as PIC during flight
Hello guys,
I could not find anything in the search function and maybe here are some experienced pilots who know how to handle and might were already in a similar situation.
I am in my hour building for cplh nearly 150 total hours and done with all theory exams, so the only thing what I have to do is flying now.
In my last flight I wanted to practise some steep turns, weather was cavok, wind 15kts gusting up to 17kts, temperature warm enough to fly off doors with the R22. Reaching 1500ft AGL everything was ok, I started my turns and suddenly I got a weird feeling in my head and couldnt look down to ground anymore. I was like nailed in my seat, felt my pulse was increasing hands began to sweat, breathing rate changed, was hard to stay focus on avaiting.
I immediately stopped the turns, started to look only on horizon in the front with a fixed head position and did proper xchecks with the instruments only by eye movement but avoided looking down and tried to ignore my peripheral vision.
Luckily I was close to base, so I flew back and landed safely, I was aware of other traffic, but personally I felt in this high tense stress condition I lost at least 30% of my situational awareness, and it was not funny.
Since that happened I am struggling to motivate me to get back into the cockpit, because I dont know if this condition could appear at any time again.
I want to fly so I decided to fly with other pilots as pax and focussed on staring constantly on the ground just to check if the condition appears again, but it did not, but the conditions were not comparable with the conditions when it happened. And it was definitely a psychological thing, physiological I am completely in top condition.
So anyone here who got some experience in similar cases and knows what to do to get back into the cockpit?
I mean just saying, avoid flying off door steep turns above 1500AGL cannot be an option, due to too many jobs in the business requiring that situation...
I could not find anything in the search function and maybe here are some experienced pilots who know how to handle and might were already in a similar situation.
I am in my hour building for cplh nearly 150 total hours and done with all theory exams, so the only thing what I have to do is flying now.
In my last flight I wanted to practise some steep turns, weather was cavok, wind 15kts gusting up to 17kts, temperature warm enough to fly off doors with the R22. Reaching 1500ft AGL everything was ok, I started my turns and suddenly I got a weird feeling in my head and couldnt look down to ground anymore. I was like nailed in my seat, felt my pulse was increasing hands began to sweat, breathing rate changed, was hard to stay focus on avaiting.
I immediately stopped the turns, started to look only on horizon in the front with a fixed head position and did proper xchecks with the instruments only by eye movement but avoided looking down and tried to ignore my peripheral vision.
Luckily I was close to base, so I flew back and landed safely, I was aware of other traffic, but personally I felt in this high tense stress condition I lost at least 30% of my situational awareness, and it was not funny.
Since that happened I am struggling to motivate me to get back into the cockpit, because I dont know if this condition could appear at any time again.
I want to fly so I decided to fly with other pilots as pax and focussed on staring constantly on the ground just to check if the condition appears again, but it did not, but the conditions were not comparable with the conditions when it happened. And it was definitely a psychological thing, physiological I am completely in top condition.
So anyone here who got some experience in similar cases and knows what to do to get back into the cockpit?
I mean just saying, avoid flying off door steep turns above 1500AGL cannot be an option, due to too many jobs in the business requiring that situation...
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You wouldn't catch me doing steep turns with the doors off in an R22 for precisely the same reasons. I suffer vertigo in the R22 when I fly 500ft over the top of a mountain and then it rapidly drops away down to a couple of thousand feet. I know it's coming and steady myself for it. I don't suffer such extreme symptoms as you, quite possibly as a result of being ready for it. I also fly an MTO Sport autogyro. If I look straight down the side in that, I can feel the vertigo coming on. As a result, I avoid doing so for too long. I only get it by looking directly downwards over the side, everywhere else is fine.
Basically, the secret is to ease yourself back into it slowly. You know that going up with friends has not reproduced the effects. So go up flying and fly as they did. Gradually expand the envelope. Through experience, you should be able to identify exactly when the effects are going to come on, and either avoid them, or learn to recover from them. I just tell myself over and over to keep flying the aircraft and it's an illogical fear. It passes pretty quickly for me, but only once I've stopped doing what was causing the problem. In all likelihood, you'll never stop yourself from suffering vertigo whilst performing tight turns with the doors off. But you may be able to learn how long you can tolerate it, and I think you will learn how to recover your capacity far more quickly now you have a better idea of what it was, rather than combining it with fright adrenaline from your first encounter.
I wouldn't be too worried about it, and just get up flying again. Think of it as good training for the scenario where you experience a high stress scenario due to a significant inflight failure? You've now learnt that yes, high stress zaps capacity, but you can still manage that stress and keep flying the aircraft.
Good luck
GS
Basically, the secret is to ease yourself back into it slowly. You know that going up with friends has not reproduced the effects. So go up flying and fly as they did. Gradually expand the envelope. Through experience, you should be able to identify exactly when the effects are going to come on, and either avoid them, or learn to recover from them. I just tell myself over and over to keep flying the aircraft and it's an illogical fear. It passes pretty quickly for me, but only once I've stopped doing what was causing the problem. In all likelihood, you'll never stop yourself from suffering vertigo whilst performing tight turns with the doors off. But you may be able to learn how long you can tolerate it, and I think you will learn how to recover your capacity far more quickly now you have a better idea of what it was, rather than combining it with fright adrenaline from your first encounter.
I wouldn't be too worried about it, and just get up flying again. Think of it as good training for the scenario where you experience a high stress scenario due to a significant inflight failure? You've now learnt that yes, high stress zaps capacity, but you can still manage that stress and keep flying the aircraft.
Good luck
GS
I'm no rotorhead but honestly you're not the first and you won't be the last that scares himself ( or herself) during timebuilding.
Part of the maturing process.
Time to get back on the horse.
Part of the maturing process.
Time to get back on the horse.
Yep - Vertigo for sure - have had exactly the same in a Gazelle with the doors off. It's just a psychological thing, normally the doors prevent you from seeing straight down so it is very different when you have them removed.
I don't do heights and get Vertigo but I can fly a helicopter in the mountains with rock on one side and thousands of feet of fresh air on the other - hasn't stopped me from flying for 35 years - crack on.
I don't do heights and get Vertigo but I can fly a helicopter in the mountains with rock on one side and thousands of feet of fresh air on the other - hasn't stopped me from flying for 35 years - crack on.
Nigerian In Law
Rusty1983,
I guess you can tell from the answers this is a fairly common effect; when I flew Scouts in Hong Kong doors off I had the same effect, albeit less profound.
You'll get that with the doors off; it's not a thing you need to worry about.
Cheers,
NEO
I guess you can tell from the answers this is a fairly common effect; when I flew Scouts in Hong Kong doors off I had the same effect, albeit less profound.
You'll get that with the doors off; it's not a thing you need to worry about.
Cheers,
NEO