Birds
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Joined: Aug 2000
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From: 5 nM S of TNT, UK
Birds
Feathered ones.. .. .Last weekend I was doing my annual LPC with a very wise and experienced examiner.. .Towards the end of it, he had me poling fast round the airfield at 20 odd feet to practice. .driving with no feet. In the course of this, I lost my sense of direction somewhat. As a consequence,. .when he told me to turn into wind I had lost track of where the wind was, and said so.. .. .He then told me to look at the birds, who were sitting everywhere on low wire fences. .running across the field.. .. .In 20 years of aviating, I never knew that birds face into wind in case they need to take off. .in a hurry. Several other flyers who I have mentioned this to did not know it either.. .. .You learn something new every day.
Joined: Jan 2001
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From: AB, Canada
Birds were sitting everywhere across the field.. .. .Ummmmm....maybe you shouldn't have been flying around at 20 ft? A good percentage of birdstrikes should not be called accidents. When you fly where birds are known to be it becomes more Darwinian than bad luck.. .. .Yesterday we were flying 500 ft just off the west coast of Canada. Copilot flying suddenly banks hard right. I look up to see a very large eagle also bank right. We roll left and dive. He (I saw proof it was a male by now <img border="0" title="" alt="[Eek!]" src="eek.gif" /> ) also rolled left and flared. The eagle, now terribly frightened and spread eagle had an H46 pass below him with about 3 ft clearance from the forward rotor. We braced for the thump of eagle on aft pylon, but heard nothing. Lucky day for all 6 of us (5 crew, 1 eagle).. .. .Lesson: Eagles own 500 and below during herring season.
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muffin,. .Your instructor's tip is a sound one, but the birds align with the wind not because of the need for rapid take-off, but rather that they can't do otherwise without risking life and limb. If parked downind, their feathers bloom open and their drag increases considerable, so that they can be torn lose from their perches and tumbled. Into the wind, they streamline quite nicely, and their low drag, based on 100,000,000 years of good design and development (any Creationists out there? Sorry!) make it imperitive that they help you find the wind direction.
Joined: Sep 2001
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From: CA
You will also find that horses and drystock stand with their backsides into wind, often in a queue to shelter each other.. .Now as for sheep ..... <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="biggrin.gif" /> . .SETTLE! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="wink.gif" />
Joined: Nov 2001
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From: Iceland
Those birds can tell you a lot if you know their habits.. .. .Have you ever wondered why they fly very low in heavy winds and turbulence?. .. .One of my friends who flies helo's told me that birds avoid you when you fly at 60 kts or slower.. .. .I like birds, most of them taste very good. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="biggrin.gif" />
Joined: Nov 2000
Posts: 467
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From: Sunrise, Fl. U.S.A.
</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica"> One of my friends who flies helo's told me that birds avoid you when you fly at 60 kts or slower. </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica">Uh ... not in my case. See my post above. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="biggrin.gif" />
Gatvol
Joined: Jun 2000
Posts: 4,197
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From: KLAS/TIST/FAJS/KFAI
OK, Who has the equation for measuring wind speed by the distance from where a bird craps and where it hits the ground while sitting on a wire at 100'. .I guess one whould have to also know the weight and density of the disposed item.. . Is anyone sure its not cows who put their asses in the wind??...Also, in the Northern Hemisphere moss grows on which side of the trees?? Got some great birdstrike stories also....
Joined: Jul 2001
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From: the cockpit
Had a crewman once who took a birdstrike to the helmet whilst looking out the side of the aircraft in an attempt to see the bird we were trying to avoid!! He saw it alright! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="biggrin.gif" /> <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="biggrin.gif" /> . .. .My experience has been that gritting your teeth and staying on course is a good safe bet because birds tend to be far more adept at evasive manoeuvres than us - and then I dont have to get in a guessing game with them about which way to swerve! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="biggrin.gif" /> . .. .I thought cows tend to stay nose into wind in warm weather to increase ventilation, crosswind in temperate conditions to reduce the possibilities of re injestion of either burps or farts, and arse into wind in cold weather to enjoy the warmth of their excrement. And dont they lie down before the rain? <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="biggrin.gif" />
Joined: Mar 2002
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From: Iceland
It has been my experience when flying in areas with high bird concentration i.e. coastal areas with large groups of birds using the updrafts of inland winds from up to 1000m (3000´) rock cliffs that flying at speeds at or under 60 kts will give them enough time to notice you and get out of the way. If you have to fly in bird areas you usually are doing a job which requires you to fly at slower speeds anyway f.eks. filmwork, exploration, seal counting or such. Birds in these ares are of course vigilant and awake since they are hanggliding and probably hunting for food.
If flying at these slower speed I find that its usually better to let the bird get out of the way self, if he sees you, avoid though flying under birds, depending in race theyr first instinct is often to dive when startled.
However birds can be anywhere at any altitude. One friend of mine that used to fly a Super Puma actually had a birdstrike from above, it came through the roof window just in front of the throttle quadrant, the carcass stopped in the throttles and the insides continued all over the radios, instruments and pilots, they sure where happy to have the helmets on and clear visor down.
I find the birds of prey to be the worst, Hawks and such tend to take a break and fall asleep while flying. I have only had 3 birdhits in 3600hrs and two of those were with hawks at 1500 and 3000 feet. Needless to say I´m glad that the windshield in the Bell 222U that I fly now can withstand a 2 lbs birdstrike at 150 kts.
Walter
If flying at these slower speed I find that its usually better to let the bird get out of the way self, if he sees you, avoid though flying under birds, depending in race theyr first instinct is often to dive when startled.
However birds can be anywhere at any altitude. One friend of mine that used to fly a Super Puma actually had a birdstrike from above, it came through the roof window just in front of the throttle quadrant, the carcass stopped in the throttles and the insides continued all over the radios, instruments and pilots, they sure where happy to have the helmets on and clear visor down.
I find the birds of prey to be the worst, Hawks and such tend to take a break and fall asleep while flying. I have only had 3 birdhits in 3600hrs and two of those were with hawks at 1500 and 3000 feet. Needless to say I´m glad that the windshield in the Bell 222U that I fly now can withstand a 2 lbs birdstrike at 150 kts.
Walter
Joined: Mar 2002
Posts: 814
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From: Iceland
Wind direction
Remember to let the birds help you to determine the wind direction if you are in a area where its difficult to find where the wind is blowing from.
Birds will usually always take off or land into the wind expecially larger birds like Geese. So if you´re heavy and not particurlarly interested in getting into settling with power, get some assist from the birds around you, check which way they are landing and taking off or if you have some cliffs nearby see on which side they are hanggliding.
It never fails and is easy to observe while flying.
Birds will usually always take off or land into the wind expecially larger birds like Geese. So if you´re heavy and not particurlarly interested in getting into settling with power, get some assist from the birds around you, check which way they are landing and taking off or if you have some cliffs nearby see on which side they are hanggliding.
It never fails and is easy to observe while flying.
The Original Whirly
Joined: Feb 1999
Aviation Qualifications: CPL
Posts: 4,327
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From: Belper, Derbyshire, UK
I've just been doing some mountain flying in California, and was told the same thing. I never ever knew that before. Really helps when you have no smoke or water or trees or windsocks.
Joined: Jul 2000
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From: London
Muffin
Was your examiner Mike Smith @ HeliAir by any chance?
I ask because he gave me that tip during a LPC. Seems so obvious, after someone's pointed it out.
I've done a few check rides with him and I've learnt something new every time.
Nick Lappos
It's not often you get something wrong. Of coujrse birds were created, just like evrything else in this world.
Was your examiner Mike Smith @ HeliAir by any chance?
I ask because he gave me that tip during a LPC. Seems so obvious, after someone's pointed it out.
I've done a few check rides with him and I've learnt something new every time.
Nick Lappos
It's not often you get something wrong. Of coujrse birds were created, just like evrything else in this world.
Cows into wind???