Colour Blindness (merged)

[picodaily]

?

hi,i was wondering if it is possible to cheat in the ishihara plate test.. it's not something i would do but i noticed that i am able to see most plate without problems,however,there is a couple where i cant see at all and there are some that i can see 1 or 1 1/2 number...

does anyone have this problem?
help needed, my medical for cadet pilot is very close..

[LH_Pilot]

Some people say it is possible to cheat, but in my opinion it is only possible under certain situations. First, there are couple hundred Ishihara plates on the market, most of them are identical, but still differ from each other.
Also, in my last medical, I did August 5th, the doctor opened the book somewhere in the middle and asked me what numbers I see and then turned to another page somewhere in the book. This book had no signs (numbers and letters to tell the doctor what number is correct) below the picture, like few do.

Well, I did those test quite often and no matter if I tried to cheat or not, I always failed, because a doctor can also tell by looking at you if you cheat or not. My mom is a doctor and a friend of her is also a doctor and both told me that.

If you're able to do a test like it is done in the USA, don't worry, it is possible to pass.
If you're only able to do test like we have them in Europe, your chance to pass is quite low...

LH_Pilot

[picodaily]

fortunately,i'm not doing it in europe,unfortunately,i'm not doing it in USA... i'm from malaysia,if i dont pass the ishihara test plate,is there another alternative test for me to still receive my class 1 medical?

[LH_Pilot]

Well, if you don't pass in Malaysia, don't worry, you can still do your medical in other countries, I'm from Germany and I had to do mine in the USA. It doesn't matter to me if I fly a plane from the USA to Europe on the first trip or on the return trip.

All it matters is that I'm allowed to fly, if you think the same way, you'll find a country (most likley Australia or the USA) where you're allowed to fly if you don't pass.

What kind of tests are allowed in Malaysia may ve found on the malaysian aviation administration homepage.

In Europe it is called JAR-FCL 3, if I remeber it correct it is called apendix in the USA, but you'll always find the requirements online. It takes some time to do the research, but terefore you know exactly what's going on in the country where you're doing the medical. Most doctors don't even know most of the rules, in this case you can tell them where to find it.

LH_Pilot

[picodaily]

i passed!! i've got my class1 now and i'm going to be enrolled in flight school on Nov22. to my suprise,the check for color blindness was so simple! just a few plates, and it was just conducted by a nurse.. is it like this in US,europe?

[Flyboy543]

Hey,
been reading lots of your stories and congtatulations to those who have achieved their dream!! I am in the same position as a lot of you, taken the CAA test at LGW and failed that but don't know by how much, the miserable guy said i'd failed and couldn't do anything about it!

Am looking at maybe takin the medicals in USA but have herd there is some restrictions to type of aircraft/jobs you can fly. Can anyone shed some light on this or is it just people trying to stop me doing it??!!

Also those of you who have passed the 'tests' in the USA where did you have them done and what sort of prices did you have to pay?

Any information would be greatly appreciated that leads me to my dream!!

thanks guys,
Jamie

[ThePirateKing]

Hi all,

In case some of you hadn't noticed, there appears to be some interesting research into using gene therapy to cure colour blindness. Here is an article I found - there are plenty more: http://healthlink.mcw.edu/article/1031002361.html

Interesting times - let's just hope it doesn't take 5 years!

Rgds,

TPK

[picodaily]

i was just wondering, is there any airline pilots out there who is color blind? i'm worried coz i know i am slightly color blind (but i got my class1,SPL) i'm worried that i'll fail my medicals in the future..

[UnderneathTheRadar]

Latest situation

Hi all,

Sorry if I'm repeating what others have said earlier but my CAA JAR class 1 experience went like this (yesterday!).

After making 2 errors on the Ishihara (which I think I was given the opportunity to fix) we went to the Lantern test, which I also failed - possibly up to 4 times.

I was then given the opportunity to do the test again in the dark and was given 10 minutes to 'dark-adjust'. No problems thereafter (but a bloody nerve wracking 10 minutes sitting in the dark pondering the imminent demise of my not-yet-started aviation career!).

I asked the guy about it afterwards. Under JAR any mistakes on Ishihara require the lantern test - whereas in Oz I believe you're allowed a mistake or two (not certain on this - but I'm fairly sure I always make at least one mistake on the Ishishara).

He also said that colour blindness is NORMALLY congenetive and that once he'd checked that it wasn't related to a problem with my eyes (i.e. they were healthy) there would be no more testing without some kind of trigger reason. He did say that certain prescription medicines have the ability to affect colour perception and so reporting being on one of those would require a retest.

Hope this helps,

UTR.

[thrustidle74]

Hi,
I'd like to share my story with you and also need some advice.
I started flying in UK in 1997.I had color vision problem in my initial medical.Did the lantern in Gatwick and passed.Since then I am flying(in Eastern Europe).in my country you are requried to take an isihara test every renewal but it doesnt matter if you pass or fail because theres nothing called lantern here.(they show you only 2- 4 plates)
Now I am offered a dream job in Dubai.I had the same problem during pre-employment medical.I sent them my lantern result in Gatwick but they didnt accept.So I did another one in Amsterdam and passed.(But this one was much harder.What I think is the lights were reflected from a mirror in Amsterdam.So theres a reflection.And I am not sure if mirrors can reflect colors 100%.What I think is there should be a loss in reflection like in everything manmade.Anyway the guys in AMS were very helpful)
Now what I am worried is if they will require me to take a Lantern every renewal in Dubai.Because by means of color vision I am very relaxed in my current job.And I dont want to have problems in Dubai after flying 1 year happily and end jobless.
At the end of the day your medical depends on a Lantern test.There are a lot of people that passed a lantern and failed another lantern somewhereelse.
Another thing is about anomaloscopy.is there anybody passed the lantern and failed anomaloscopy or vice versa?
is it harder or easier to pass anomaloscopy?
Because I just want to take an anomaloscopy to secure myself before resigning from my current job.
Any ideas about the renewal regulations in Dubai?

Thanks

Thrustidle

[dscartwright]

Moses said:

"The Farnsworth Lantern I would suspect is more aviation/practical than the Holmes Wright - but I wonder how both compares to the real flying environment?"

Frankly the Holmes Wright test is a complete farce - at least in the way the CAA administers it at Gatwick. I'm one of those people that has no actual problems with colour vision in real life, only when doing colour vision tests, and having failed the Ishihara plate test I went for a lantern test.

The test commenced in a windowless room, in fluorescent light. As soon as I got one red/green combination wrong, that was the test finished - they stop on the spot and go no further (despite you having paid 28 quid for a whole test).

The only restriction on my pilot's licence is that I'm not allowed to fly at night because of my colour vision deficiency. I have an IMC rating, so I can fly in cloud (in the UK, at least), I just can't fly at night.

I'm allowed to fly VMC in the day, even though I'm officially unable to tell the difference between a red light and a green light being shone at me by an ATCO (actually in real life I can see the difference, with no problem). Yet I'm not allowed to fly at night even though the JAA/CAA's official test has never actually shown whether or not I'm able to tell the difference between colours at night (again, in real life I can see the difference - I've been out at night with my instructor several times just for the fun of it and the light thing is easy). All the CAA knows is that I'm unable to see tiny pinpricks of light from the far end of a room in fluorescent light - hardly an environment I'm likely to encounter in the sky.

D.

[whitelabel]

dscartwright
finally someone I can talk with.
Why do we understand the problem and JAA/CAA not?
They are the experts aren't they??

Falant, Holmes etc. are not practical. In real life you will never see the lights like they show you. If the visibility or cloud base is too poor you are prohibited to land the aircraft and you must divert!

The say that you must indentify the runway, cockpit and tower signals correctly. If you tell them that you are able to do that, they won't believe you.

It is the same as a traffic light! why can I drive a car a bus or truck?? because they show you pure red and pure green.

only someone who suffers achromatopsie (black/white) can't distinquish these colours.

In aviation it is axactly the same but JAA thinks different

I don't know what the future brings but don't give up!

cheers

[garyhowarth]

German AMC

Does anyone know the address of the German AMC that seems to have helped?

Thanks

[egbb_2004]

Here you go:

Fliegerärztliche Untersuchungsstelle
des Deutschen Zentrums für
Luft- und Raumfahrt
Linder Höhe
D-51170 Köln

Tel: [phone]
Fax: [phone]
e-mail: [email protected]

[Fropilot]

As an instructor I conducted simulator and line checks on a pilot who performed brilliantly. And it came as a shock to me when he was grounded due to colour blindness. Some things in aviation just do not make sense. But I guess the system tends to lean towards worst case scenario, which may not be such a bad thing.

[Blinkz]

Its quite rare for someone to be grounded due to colourvision. If your colourblind then your colourblind for life and theres nothing you can do about it. If you are able to pass the initial medical then as far as I know thats the only time colour vision is tested.

Do you have any more information about exactly why he was grounded? Would make for interesting reading.

[blab]

Probably already mentioned by someone, but...

If I fail a lantern test in an extended examination in one JAA member state, are the results communicated to the rest of JAA members?

Thank you.

[Flyboy543]

It seems that there is a few mis-understandings in the CAA and AME's

I know that I have a colour deficiency after failing the lantern tests at Gatwick few years back but told I could still get a class 2 only flying during day & in VFR in VMC. So I start training for my PPL and get to the stage of obtaining my initial medical. I told the AME that i had the lantern tests done to make him aware of the facts. He said that he needed to talk to the CAA regarding what he had to write on the forms and he would post it to me. So about a month after my inital exam I get a letter from the AME saying that he had been in contact with the CAA and it told me that i could not obtain ANY JAA medical certificate!!

So i got in contact with the CAA making them aware of the situation. A week later i got a phonecall from the CAA telling me that i could indeed get a class 2 with the VFR/VMC restrictions. They said they would get a new form from the AME to be posted to the CAA then sent to me! over 2 months after the initial exam i am STILL waiting for the certificate!!

Jus wondered if this had happened to anyone else and has not challenged it?

Flyboy

edited - change spelling

[Blinkz]

Was reading the CAA Medical Committee news today and came across this from the November meeting:

A proposal to relax the private pilot colour vision standard, based on a different pass/criteria on the Nagel anomaloscope (a German colour vision test) was rejected. This decision was reached on the basis that colour vision standards are currently under international review and that it would not improve harmonisation across JAA member states.

I was quite surprised to see it as it means that at least some people are thinking about relaxing standards even if it wasn't accepted, which is a steep in the right direction I guess.

I am slightly concerned about what the international review of colourvision is, as far as I am aware it is to make sure that the testing for colourvision is standardised across the JAA. Does anyone know if this will affect those of us with a Class 1/2 having passed a lantern test?

[strewf]

Have read the above with much interest as i am supposedly colour deficient. Desperate to apply to Air Services as an ATC. Does anyone know if the practical test is available to ATC applicants?