Biz jet pilot looking to get into the airlines - any advice?
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Biz jet pilot looking to get into the airlines - any advice?
Hello All
I am probably not the only one right now! Don't get me wrong I love the flying and don't mind rolling my sleeves up and sorting stuff out when ops have gone to bed and forgotten to deal with something important and you are somewhere really remote. I didn't even mind being on call most of the time as I managed to plan my life on unscheduled days off. However over the last 2 years I have lost my job twice and on both accounts the owner either sold his plane or moved it to another operator who wouldn't employ either the captain or me as they had crew. How random is that??
Of course it's their plane but this is frequently how us corporate pilots are left high and dry! When this happens the "glamour" of being a VIP chauffeur goes right out the window!!
I am pretty much fed up of living my life subject to the whims of either the plane's owner or the operator!
Over the last year I have done a little freelance work and remained current but have effectively been unemployed for a year now and it's no fun. 
All I want is regular flying and a regular pay packet and anything else is a bonus!
I thought having a C560XL rating I'd be able to sort some regular paid work but that's not the case. I have been offered full-time work but I have to fund either a Hawker or Challenger rating at over £20k!! Right now I am not going to spend that money on a biz jet with its limited circulation and numbers. I have worked hard to get where I am and have about 2000 hours TT and about 600 multi crew hours.
I am a very youthful 40 years old and now I would like to consider trying to get into the airlines. From talking to colleagues it seems hardly anyone has made the jump from biz jet to airline!
Rather than spend £20k on a biz jet rating I am considering spending that on a 737 or A320 rating. Whilst it's still a gamble it makes more sense for obvious reasons. I don't like the fact that I may have to pay unfront for a rating but if I don't someone else will and their career moves on and mine gets stuck in neutral! It's a fact guys and gals straight out of flight school are paying for type ratings left, right and centre and what's for sure I can't beat them sitting on my moral high horse!
So what I am after is some advice from anyone, especially if you've been in a similar position whether it be corporate or airline pilots stuck on an outdated type!
Thanks all!
I am probably not the only one right now! Don't get me wrong I love the flying and don't mind rolling my sleeves up and sorting stuff out when ops have gone to bed and forgotten to deal with something important and you are somewhere really remote. I didn't even mind being on call most of the time as I managed to plan my life on unscheduled days off. However over the last 2 years I have lost my job twice and on both accounts the owner either sold his plane or moved it to another operator who wouldn't employ either the captain or me as they had crew. How random is that??
Of course it's their plane but this is frequently how us corporate pilots are left high and dry! When this happens the "glamour" of being a VIP chauffeur goes right out the window!!I am pretty much fed up of living my life subject to the whims of either the plane's owner or the operator!
Over the last year I have done a little freelance work and remained current but have effectively been unemployed for a year now and it's no fun. All I want is regular flying and a regular pay packet and anything else is a bonus!I thought having a C560XL rating I'd be able to sort some regular paid work but that's not the case. I have been offered full-time work but I have to fund either a Hawker or Challenger rating at over £20k!! Right now I am not going to spend that money on a biz jet with its limited circulation and numbers. I have worked hard to get where I am and have about 2000 hours TT and about 600 multi crew hours.
I am a very youthful 40 years old and now I would like to consider trying to get into the airlines. From talking to colleagues it seems hardly anyone has made the jump from biz jet to airline!
Rather than spend £20k on a biz jet rating I am considering spending that on a 737 or A320 rating. Whilst it's still a gamble it makes more sense for obvious reasons. I don't like the fact that I may have to pay unfront for a rating but if I don't someone else will and their career moves on and mine gets stuck in neutral! It's a fact guys and gals straight out of flight school are paying for type ratings left, right and centre and what's for sure I can't beat them sitting on my moral high horse!
So what I am after is some advice from anyone, especially if you've been in a similar position whether it be corporate or airline pilots stuck on an outdated type!
Thanks all!
Last edited by Ray Ban; 20th Sep 2010 at 20:07.
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I am pretty much fed up of living my life subject to the whims of either the plane's owner or the operator!
Airlines do this all the time.
Have a look at the EK/EY threads in the middle east section, for possible reasons.
Frying pan to fire...comes to mind.
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I hear what you're say but I'm fairly certain there is more job security in airlines even if it's poor compared to the old days when you were young
411A!
I used to think no matter what happens during a recession my owner with his many millions would keep flying as he could afford to!! I couldn't have been more wrong and this was the case across the small to medium size cabin market. Many sold up and cut their losses no matter how well you did your job and made your plane gleam and your passengers feel extra special!
Terms and conditions may not be great in the airline world but I bet they are a damn sight better than corporate aviation. A decent roster would be a good start and trust me any airline roster is better than being on call pretty much all the time!
411A!
I used to think no matter what happens during a recession my owner with his many millions would keep flying as he could afford to!! I couldn't have been more wrong and this was the case across the small to medium size cabin market. Many sold up and cut their losses no matter how well you did your job and made your plane gleam and your passengers feel extra special!
Terms and conditions may not be great in the airline world but I bet they are a damn sight better than corporate aviation. A decent roster would be a good start and trust me any airline roster is better than being on call pretty much all the time!
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Corporate to airline flying trasition..... yes I've done that.
Ray Ban,
I am a little late to the thread. You hit on one of the reasons I left a good corporate flying job for the airlines. In the corporate/business world it does not matter how well you fly; nor how well you perform your job as a corporate pilot, somebody in the accounting department thinks you are a waste of money. The jet is among the first thing to go when the economy turns, or the management is under pressure and scrutiny. If the business that generates the money isn’t about making money by using airplanes, then the airplane is a luxury.
To be sure there are some good corporate jobs out there and I am grateful for the experience and friends I made along the way. For me the airline has been a much better job; more money (after the first year; that 50% pay cut was painful), a dependable schedule, less politics (as long as you stay out of management) and much more time off. Plus, I do not have to deal with keeping ice and snow off the jet on layovers, arranging deicing and maintenance when I need it, catering, rental cars and dozens of other details. Not that I minded at the time as it was part of the job. When you walk away from the airliner and go to the layover or home you do not take the job with you to any comparable degree that you do when you are flying for a corporation. The jobs require very different mindsets, and it took me several years to fully appreciate that.
I miss the camaraderie of a tight knit well run flight department, the opportunity to get to know our passengers personally (over years of service) and flying brand new corporate jets to new places every month. Considering pay and schedules I would have to rank the airline job above the corporate flying job. Realize the airline is no panacea either; I have been furloughed twice (made redundant). And there are “difficult people” everywhere you go.
Wishing every success for you!
Respectfully,
Northbeach
I am a little late to the thread. You hit on one of the reasons I left a good corporate flying job for the airlines. In the corporate/business world it does not matter how well you fly; nor how well you perform your job as a corporate pilot, somebody in the accounting department thinks you are a waste of money. The jet is among the first thing to go when the economy turns, or the management is under pressure and scrutiny. If the business that generates the money isn’t about making money by using airplanes, then the airplane is a luxury.
To be sure there are some good corporate jobs out there and I am grateful for the experience and friends I made along the way. For me the airline has been a much better job; more money (after the first year; that 50% pay cut was painful), a dependable schedule, less politics (as long as you stay out of management) and much more time off. Plus, I do not have to deal with keeping ice and snow off the jet on layovers, arranging deicing and maintenance when I need it, catering, rental cars and dozens of other details. Not that I minded at the time as it was part of the job. When you walk away from the airliner and go to the layover or home you do not take the job with you to any comparable degree that you do when you are flying for a corporation. The jobs require very different mindsets, and it took me several years to fully appreciate that.
I miss the camaraderie of a tight knit well run flight department, the opportunity to get to know our passengers personally (over years of service) and flying brand new corporate jets to new places every month. Considering pay and schedules I would have to rank the airline job above the corporate flying job. Realize the airline is no panacea either; I have been furloughed twice (made redundant). And there are “difficult people” everywhere you go.
Wishing every success for you!
Respectfully,
Northbeach
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Let's continue this discussion seeing as the recession still bites!!
So I am going to revive this discussion and see who has any words of wisdom.
I am a corporate pilot with a well paid job but one where I am sometimes spending over a month without flying and just getting tired and bored of the slow progress. Still a co-pilot with under 2000hrs after five years and at a point where I am seriously considering the airlines. I'm in my late twenties.
I started out thinking of the airlines when I decided to be a pilot and kind of fell into corporate by chance which was no bad thing. But I have always wondered and pondered about the airlines and now after being made redundant several times and having to live in a different country in order to keep a job, I am thinking it might be wise to apply to a regional in the UK or something similar or better if possible.
Yes I love the fun down route in corporate, the countries we fly to from Shanghai to Toronto and everywhere in between, but I feel I now need something more progressive and stable.
I have concerns, the main two being the big pay cut I will have to take and the possibility of being located in a far flung corner of the UK when London is my home and preferred place to live...albeit hours closer to home than I am now!!
Thinking it is wise to make the move now rather than later when the pay cut will be even worse.
Has anyone else done the same recently and did your concerns and unknowns turn out to be worth it in order to get into the airlines? Has it met your expectations?
Appreciate any insights and experiences!
I am a corporate pilot with a well paid job but one where I am sometimes spending over a month without flying and just getting tired and bored of the slow progress. Still a co-pilot with under 2000hrs after five years and at a point where I am seriously considering the airlines. I'm in my late twenties.
I started out thinking of the airlines when I decided to be a pilot and kind of fell into corporate by chance which was no bad thing. But I have always wondered and pondered about the airlines and now after being made redundant several times and having to live in a different country in order to keep a job, I am thinking it might be wise to apply to a regional in the UK or something similar or better if possible.
Yes I love the fun down route in corporate, the countries we fly to from Shanghai to Toronto and everywhere in between, but I feel I now need something more progressive and stable.
I have concerns, the main two being the big pay cut I will have to take and the possibility of being located in a far flung corner of the UK when London is my home and preferred place to live...albeit hours closer to home than I am now!!
Thinking it is wise to make the move now rather than later when the pay cut will be even worse.
Has anyone else done the same recently and did your concerns and unknowns turn out to be worth it in order to get into the airlines? Has it met your expectations?
Appreciate any insights and experiences!
