Oxford V The other Modular Schools
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Before I start...I'm not connected with OAT or any other school...yet!
Was at the Flight School trade show on Manchester a few months back. At the end, all the CEO's/important people from each of the schools were at the top of the room for a Q and A session. Also present was a bloke from a charter airline that flies to Malaga (fleet of 75's I think)....can't remember his name or the airline. But he was their chief captain in charge of hiring and firing.
I decided to put the cat among the pidgeons by asking the panel does a school's name influence the decision to take on pilot's. As you can imagine, this was an uncomfortable question for the panel. But the chief pilot guy piped up and the first thing out of his mouth was "Well the airlines would look at where you trained, fro example Oxford..."....long pause...then "....or any other school of course !".
Oxford was the first thing on this guy's head...and he's responsible for hiring for his company.
Take from that what you will....but is it all in the name?
Was at the Flight School trade show on Manchester a few months back. At the end, all the CEO's/important people from each of the schools were at the top of the room for a Q and A session. Also present was a bloke from a charter airline that flies to Malaga (fleet of 75's I think)....can't remember his name or the airline. But he was their chief captain in charge of hiring and firing.
I decided to put the cat among the pidgeons by asking the panel does a school's name influence the decision to take on pilot's. As you can imagine, this was an uncomfortable question for the panel. But the chief pilot guy piped up and the first thing out of his mouth was "Well the airlines would look at where you trained, fro example Oxford..."....long pause...then "....or any other school of course !".
Oxford was the first thing on this guy's head...and he's responsible for hiring for his company.
Take from that what you will....but is it all in the name?
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Somebody above has asked whats more important, you or where you trained.....
Errrrrrr....................HIYA!!!
The Airline interview is a filtration process....
Who's going to be employed ??
Wannabe A
Aces sim check, totally confident with the sim, shows impressive learning capability and is a total complete smart arse who treats his co-applicant co pilot with contempt Went to Oxford/Cabair/Jerez
or
Wannabe B
Struggles a little with the sim, porpoises down the ILs for the first and second times and gets it 1/2 right the third time. Has a
laugh at himself outwardly and inwardly shows an ability to learn by the end of the session, can run a checklist and has the sort of personality conducive to a four hour night flight to somewhere hot with no ILS. Who incidentally studied at home and trained modular method in the back of beyond
If you are a muppet you will not be employed, having an atmosphere in the flight deck and/or a captain that has little confidence in his co -crew is one of the single biggest factors affecting safety.
Im guessing but somebody could back me up.... when you initially get type rated on a large passenger jet you are probably about as much use as t1ts on a bull (especially with low hours i.e. less than a 1000 especially with less than 250). This is why you fly with a training captain who can accept your cockups.
Hopefully after 30-60 sectors line training you are probably putting more into the equation than taking out and can only then be let lose with "regular" captains.
Please dont expect to be up to speed even at that point if you are any good you will probably only appear like you are.
To me if you are the sort of person expecting "preferential" treatment because of where you trained then ask yourself are you more likely to fall into Cat A or Cat B....?
Rant over..........
Errrrrrr....................HIYA!!!
The Airline interview is a filtration process....
Who's going to be employed ??
Wannabe A
Aces sim check, totally confident with the sim, shows impressive learning capability and is a total complete smart arse who treats his co-applicant co pilot with contempt Went to Oxford/Cabair/Jerez
or
Wannabe B
Struggles a little with the sim, porpoises down the ILs for the first and second times and gets it 1/2 right the third time. Has a
laugh at himself outwardly and inwardly shows an ability to learn by the end of the session, can run a checklist and has the sort of personality conducive to a four hour night flight to somewhere hot with no ILS. Who incidentally studied at home and trained modular method in the back of beyond
If you are a muppet you will not be employed, having an atmosphere in the flight deck and/or a captain that has little confidence in his co -crew is one of the single biggest factors affecting safety.
Im guessing but somebody could back me up.... when you initially get type rated on a large passenger jet you are probably about as much use as t1ts on a bull (especially with low hours i.e. less than a 1000 especially with less than 250). This is why you fly with a training captain who can accept your cockups.
Hopefully after 30-60 sectors line training you are probably putting more into the equation than taking out and can only then be let lose with "regular" captains.
Please dont expect to be up to speed even at that point if you are any good you will probably only appear like you are.
To me if you are the sort of person expecting "preferential" treatment because of where you trained then ask yourself are you more likely to fall into Cat A or Cat B....?
Rant over..........
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G-Spot's Lost,
I had a few swifts the other day with an FO who flies 737's around Europe and I can back you up re: training captains and the sector time invloved to get it dialed.
However, he falls in Wannabe C category!
I had a few swifts the other day with an FO who flies 737's around Europe and I can back you up re: training captains and the sector time invloved to get it dialed.
However, he falls in Wannabe C category!
Thread Starter
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Then there was the Visa
So I decided which school to go with then I had to get the visa.
What a pain in ar*e that was!!!
I had fill out 5 forms are they having a laugh or what.
The school in the UK hardly helped at all. Is this normal?
Did anyone else have the same sort of problems as me?
Any views
What a pain in ar*e that was!!!
I had fill out 5 forms are they having a laugh or what.
The school in the UK hardly helped at all. Is this normal?
Did anyone else have the same sort of problems as me?
Any views
Jet Blast Rat
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The school should be helpful with general advice. However we have the problem that we have to cover ourselves form immegration point of view - remember 50 Nigerians booking into the British Open Golf and not turning up? Your school has to be sure you are coming on the course, otherwise when people start using you just to get a visa (as we think one tried recently with us) the Home Office will start getting suspiscious about handing our real students visas. Therefore most schools want at least a deposit before they'll write you a letter confirming that you are booked on the course.
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I've just read through this thread, and am very disappointed on coming across the reply from WWW. It is penned in a vitriolic and infamatory manner, unbecoming of a moderator. The implication was that, if you'r a student pilot who has gone through an ab initio full time course, that you will leave, thinking that the world owes you a living. I think you closed a thread the other day to stop inflammtory comments....
Whilst it is well known that WWW did it the modular route, I know of very few Oxford et al students who put their school's reputation before there own abilities.
In fact, coming back to the subject, I think that the vast majority of graduates, ab-initio or modular, in the last year, are still scratching for jobs, which are virtually non- existant at present. Considering that the ab- initio graduates are finishing with 180 hours, they are not well placed in the present (virtually non- existant) job market. Whilst instructing is a possibility, at further additional cost, to get this total up to the minimum of 500 hours demanded as minimum by quite a few airlines would cost a further £15000 to £30000 in hour building.
Whilst it is well known that WWW did it the modular route, I know of very few Oxford et al students who put their school's reputation before there own abilities.
In fact, coming back to the subject, I think that the vast majority of graduates, ab-initio or modular, in the last year, are still scratching for jobs, which are virtually non- existant at present. Considering that the ab- initio graduates are finishing with 180 hours, they are not well placed in the present (virtually non- existant) job market. Whilst instructing is a possibility, at further additional cost, to get this total up to the minimum of 500 hours demanded as minimum by quite a few airlines would cost a further £15000 to £30000 in hour building.
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tim - class one took about a week, but they pretty much told me at the end of the day that assuming the chest xray was fine I had passed. Give them a call as they have a "check on the progress" type thing going.
Tosh, you have misread the tone and intent of my brief post:
The ONE thing you can be sure of is that there is no best school out there. Each one is different and suits you to a lesser or greater degree. Then there is the lottery of which instructor you get, the weather on your day and the classmates you end up with. All these factors can make the same school great or rubbish for you and they are truly random.
I have seen and heard too many otherwise excellent students let themselves down by appearing unctious pillocks (make a not of that phrase Darling, I want to use it more in converstaion) when pontificating that 'their' school was better than others. Or indeed that they would have an advantage at some mythical intereview in the future etc. etc.
More a friendly piece of advice than a vitriolic rant. Its all in the reading
Cheers
WWW
The only thing one can be sure of is this:
The pilot Wannabe who thinks his schools 'reputation' gives him an edge is most usually regarded as an unctious pillock by others.
WWW
The pilot Wannabe who thinks his schools 'reputation' gives him an edge is most usually regarded as an unctious pillock by others.
WWW
I have seen and heard too many otherwise excellent students let themselves down by appearing unctious pillocks (make a not of that phrase Darling, I want to use it more in converstaion) when pontificating that 'their' school was better than others. Or indeed that they would have an advantage at some mythical intereview in the future etc. etc.
More a friendly piece of advice than a vitriolic rant. Its all in the reading
Cheers
WWW
Again I say it is in the reading. You have read it knowing that I was a self improver and felt that it was a dig at CAP509 folk.
Nothing could be further from the truth.
My advice of not using your school as a trumpet to your own merit applies whichever route you took. You seem to infer that only 509/Integrated graduates would trumpet their training background. This is not so.
As an ex-Integrated instructor in Jerez and an ex-Self Improver I have a foot in both camps and no axe to grind with either.
That said I do like to use colourful turns of phrase and thus invite such missreadings. But hey.
Cheers,
WWW
Nothing could be further from the truth.
My advice of not using your school as a trumpet to your own merit applies whichever route you took. You seem to infer that only 509/Integrated graduates would trumpet their training background. This is not so.
As an ex-Integrated instructor in Jerez and an ex-Self Improver I have a foot in both camps and no axe to grind with either.
That said I do like to use colourful turns of phrase and thus invite such missreadings. But hey.
Cheers,
WWW
