Modular route, CAA qualifications and overseas opportunities
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Modular route, CAA qualifications and overseas opportunities
Hello, I've recently acquired a UK CAA PPL and am now embarking on the modular route to ATPL: I'm 31 and making a career change into aviation having worked overseas for the past eight years. My ultimate goal is to return to the Middle East and/or South East Asia as an airline pilot, but am unclear as to how easy this now is with UK based CAA qualifications (whose use (worryingly) have been likened by some on this forum to Russian qualifications...)? I notice that European airlines are stipulating EASA qualifications although this is a moot point with me being a UK passport holder only and with little desire to forge a career in Europe, but how does it work with the Gulf and particularly South East Asian carriers? Are they still hiring UK qualified pilots and if so what additional qualifications and experience are usually required? I understand that this longer term plan will require working in the UK for some time before any move but how easy it to transfer to different jurisdictions once qualified and with a bit of experience behind you?
Last edited by CAVU2; 18th Feb 2024 at 20:44.
My only experience in the Middle East is UAE, where they accept ICAO licences, so no problem with a UK issued one once you have the required experience. Pretty sure it’s the same with most of the other ME states.
No personal experience in SEA , but unless you’re in Europe there is no difference between UK part FCL and EASA licences.They are both ICAO
licences and both acceptable for validations or conversions for all the jobs I’ve seen advertised recently. Good luck.
No personal experience in SEA , but unless you’re in Europe there is no difference between UK part FCL and EASA licences.They are both ICAO
licences and both acceptable for validations or conversions for all the jobs I’ve seen advertised recently. Good luck.
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My only experience in the Middle East is UAE, where they accept ICAO licences, so no problem with a UK issued one once you have the required experience. Pretty sure it’s the same with most of the other ME states.
No personal experience in SEA , but unless you’re in Europe there is no difference between UK part FCL and EASA licences.They are both ICAO
licences and both acceptable for validations or conversions for all the jobs I’ve seen advertised recently. Good luck.
No personal experience in SEA , but unless you’re in Europe there is no difference between UK part FCL and EASA licences.They are both ICAO
licences and both acceptable for validations or conversions for all the jobs I’ve seen advertised recently. Good luck.
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The guys in Dubai accepted my UK ATP and a Canadian IR, go figure. You should be OK as the UK licence is well above ICAO standard, and they look to the UK for other standards as well. Russian qualifications? The words talking and a*se spring to mind.
My ultimate goal is to return to the Middle East and/or South East Asia as an airline pilot, but am unclear as to how easy this now is with UK based CAA qualifications (whose use (worryingly) have been likened by some on this forum to Russian qualifications...)? I notice that European airlines are stipulating EASA qualifications although this is a moot point with me being a UK passport holder only and with little desire to forge a career in Europe, but how does it work with the Gulf and particularly South East Asian carriers? Are they still hiring UK qualified pilots and if so what additional qualifications and experience are usually required? I understand that this longer term plan will require working in the UK for some time before any move but how easy it to transfer to different jurisdictions once qualified and with a bit of experience behind you?
You have the right to live and work in the UK and Ireland, so you'll need a UK licence and preferably an EASA licence as well. I recommend getting an easa medical and both sets of exams. You don't necessarily need to do both flight tests initially, the medical is good for 5 years (before you need to do anything) and the Exams are good for at least 7 years. The flight test for an ATPL is a raw data ILS and takes about 5 minutes to do tagged onto an LPC which is A LOT easier than doing a CPL and IR flight test.
Getting the licence is the easy bit. Getting the first job is harder. You'll be considered a cadet. Someone (possibly you) will need to pay for a type rating, base training (that's take offs and landings in an empty plane) and line training of anywhere from 40 to 100 sectors. That's a huge investment of training and equipment and no ME airline will train foreigners from scratch, only locals. They want experienced guys who are exempt base training and need maybe 10 sectors of line training so your route to the ME will most likely start in the British Isles somewhere, Ryanair being probably the biggest cadet airline, but DHL, Jet2, Tui, even BA now etc etc are all options. If you're lucky you'll get 737 or A320 at Ryanair/Jet2/Easy etc straight away. If you're really lucky you'll get 757, 767 or even 777 at DHL. If not you might end up with a turbo prop job like ATR or Q400. That's still very useful - you'll get your ATPL out of it and you'll probably be a better pilot as well, but you'll need to jump ship at around 2000 hours to one of the airlines that didn't want to touch you as a cadet. You didn't want to be in a turboprop so you'll be looking for Jet jobs from day one anyway. Don't be tempted to stay for a command, your priority is jet time, preferably over 50 tons and preferably glass cockpit.
From here you have 2 routes to the ME: you take your 2-3000hours jet time and join as an FO, or you get a command in Europe, wait until you have 6-7000 hours and apply as a direct entry captain. You'll make more money as an FO in the ME than you will as a captain in Europe, and a better/different quality of life. Just don't get your maid pregnant.
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The UK licence, along with EASA, FAA etc are considered the gold standard. To get paid to fly you need the right to live and work where the plane is based, and you need the licence to match the registration. Hence a US license would generally be worthless to a UK airline and vice versa.
You have the right to live and work in the UK and Ireland, so you'll need a UK licence and preferably an EASA licence as well. I recommend getting an easa medical and both sets of exams. You don't necessarily need to do both flight tests initially, the medical is good for 5 years (before you need to do anything) and the Exams are good for at least 7 years. The flight test for an ATPL is a raw data ILS and takes about 5 minutes to do tagged onto an LPC which is A LOT easier than doing a CPL and IR flight test.
Getting the licence is the easy bit. Getting the first job is harder. You'll be considered a cadet. Someone (possibly you) will need to pay for a type rating, base training (that's take offs and landings in an empty plane) and line training of anywhere from 40 to 100 sectors. That's a huge investment of training and equipment and no ME airline will train foreigners from scratch, only locals. They want experienced guys who are exempt base training and need maybe 10 sectors of line training so your route to the ME will most likely start in the British Isles somewhere, Ryanair being probably the biggest cadet airline, but DHL, Jet2, Tui, even BA now etc etc are all options. If you're lucky you'll get 737 or A320 at Ryanair/Jet2/Easy etc straight away. If you're really lucky you'll get 757, 767 or even 777 at DHL. If not you might end up with a turbo prop job like ATR or Q400. That's still very useful - you'll get your ATPL out of it and you'll probably be a better pilot as well, but you'll need to jump ship at around 2000 hours to one of the airlines that didn't want to touch you as a cadet. You didn't want to be in a turboprop so you'll be looking for Jet jobs from day one anyway. Don't be tempted to stay for a command, your priority is jet time, preferably over 50 tons and preferably glass cockpit.
From here you have 2 routes to the ME: you take your 2-3000hours jet time and join as an FO, or you get a command in Europe, wait until you have 6-7000 hours and apply as a direct entry captain. You'll make more money as an FO in the ME than you will as a captain in Europe, and a better/different quality of life. Just don't get your maid pregnant.
You have the right to live and work in the UK and Ireland, so you'll need a UK licence and preferably an EASA licence as well. I recommend getting an easa medical and both sets of exams. You don't necessarily need to do both flight tests initially, the medical is good for 5 years (before you need to do anything) and the Exams are good for at least 7 years. The flight test for an ATPL is a raw data ILS and takes about 5 minutes to do tagged onto an LPC which is A LOT easier than doing a CPL and IR flight test.
Getting the licence is the easy bit. Getting the first job is harder. You'll be considered a cadet. Someone (possibly you) will need to pay for a type rating, base training (that's take offs and landings in an empty plane) and line training of anywhere from 40 to 100 sectors. That's a huge investment of training and equipment and no ME airline will train foreigners from scratch, only locals. They want experienced guys who are exempt base training and need maybe 10 sectors of line training so your route to the ME will most likely start in the British Isles somewhere, Ryanair being probably the biggest cadet airline, but DHL, Jet2, Tui, even BA now etc etc are all options. If you're lucky you'll get 737 or A320 at Ryanair/Jet2/Easy etc straight away. If you're really lucky you'll get 757, 767 or even 777 at DHL. If not you might end up with a turbo prop job like ATR or Q400. That's still very useful - you'll get your ATPL out of it and you'll probably be a better pilot as well, but you'll need to jump ship at around 2000 hours to one of the airlines that didn't want to touch you as a cadet. You didn't want to be in a turboprop so you'll be looking for Jet jobs from day one anyway. Don't be tempted to stay for a command, your priority is jet time, preferably over 50 tons and preferably glass cockpit.
From here you have 2 routes to the ME: you take your 2-3000hours jet time and join as an FO, or you get a command in Europe, wait until you have 6-7000 hours and apply as a direct entry captain. You'll make more money as an FO in the ME than you will as a captain in Europe, and a better/different quality of life. Just don't get your maid pregnant.
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Airline funded cadet programmes
Hello all!
Is anybody familiar with fully funded cadet programmes with an ATPL route?
If so, I’d really speculate your guidance as a beginner with no experience apart from two hours flight time through Virgin Experience's.
I’m aware of BA supporting white tail training for the first time this year through SpeedBird academy but their open day is fully booked which spent seen very promising for me 😅.
Can anyone give some guidance for an aspiring commercial pilot looking for the first step on the ladder, who doesn’t have £100k spare for licensing?
Is anybody familiar with fully funded cadet programmes with an ATPL route?
If so, I’d really speculate your guidance as a beginner with no experience apart from two hours flight time through Virgin Experience's.
I’m aware of BA supporting white tail training for the first time this year through SpeedBird academy but their open day is fully booked which spent seen very promising for me 😅.
Can anyone give some guidance for an aspiring commercial pilot looking for the first step on the ladder, who doesn’t have £100k spare for licensing?
Hello all!
Is anybody familiar with fully funded cadet programmes with an ATPL route?
If so, I’d really speculate your guidance as a beginner with no experience apart from two hours flight time through Virgin Experience's.
I’m aware of BA supporting white tail training for the first time this year through SpeedBird academy but their open day is fully booked which spent seen very promising for me 😅.
Can anyone give some guidance for an aspiring commercial pilot looking for the first step on the ladder, who doesn’t have £100k spare for licensing?
Is anybody familiar with fully funded cadet programmes with an ATPL route?
If so, I’d really speculate your guidance as a beginner with no experience apart from two hours flight time through Virgin Experience's.
I’m aware of BA supporting white tail training for the first time this year through SpeedBird academy but their open day is fully booked which spent seen very promising for me 😅.
Can anyone give some guidance for an aspiring commercial pilot looking for the first step on the ladder, who doesn’t have £100k spare for licensing?
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You arent going to get a fully funded anything. You might as well ask for the lotto numbers. If you want to be a pilot it's really simple: Get a job. Get a weekend job. Give up smoking, drinking and snagging. Move in with your parents. Spend everything you make on flying and you'll have a PPL in a year and a fATPL in 3 years.
Hello all!
Is anybody familiar with fully funded cadet programmes with an ATPL route?
If so, I’d really speculate your guidance as a beginner with no experience apart from two hours flight time through Virgin Experience's.
I’m aware of BA supporting white tail training for the first time this year through SpeedBird academy but their open day is fully booked which spent seen very promising for me 😅.
Can anyone give some guidance for an aspiring commercial pilot looking for the first step on the ladder, who doesn’t have £100k spare for licensing?
Is anybody familiar with fully funded cadet programmes with an ATPL route?
If so, I’d really speculate your guidance as a beginner with no experience apart from two hours flight time through Virgin Experience's.
I’m aware of BA supporting white tail training for the first time this year through SpeedBird academy but their open day is fully booked which spent seen very promising for me 😅.
Can anyone give some guidance for an aspiring commercial pilot looking for the first step on the ladder, who doesn’t have £100k spare for licensing?
Best bet is to assume you won’t get a sponsored role, so work 60 hours a week saving every penny under the sun and eating no more than rice and (for an occasional treat) beans. That’s how you’ll do your modular training. Whilst you’re saving up the first chunk of cash and getting the PPL someone like BA or TUI might sponsor you. In which case bang out of the Modular route and go down the sponsored route.
You have to make yourself an incredible attractive candidate to get an airline to throw £100K at you. Working yourself into the ground to save for the Modular route shows a bucket load of commitment, making you a better candidate. So really it’s a no brainer as to the first step, get cracking!
