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My dream - advice please (collective thread)

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My dream - advice please (collective thread)

Old 30th Aug 2014, 08:39
  #121 (permalink)  
Join Date: Aug 2014
Location: Dibden purlieu
Age: 22
Posts: 3
Thanks GFORCE made it clearer that il attempt to get on a graduate scheme post college as I have had planned for a number of years, I know their hard to come by and such but I feel as if I can do it. Thanks for your help
JSFerrier is offline  
Old 3rd Sep 2014, 20:27
  #122 (permalink)  
Join Date: Sep 2014
Location: United Kingdom
Posts: 2
My Plan (Help & Advise could help)

Hi, From my profile you ca see I'm very new, however this is what I want to do in terms of later on it life, I'll give you a background.

I'm currently 17 years old, 18 in January 2015. I'm studying A-Levels at my Sixth Form and studying Geography, Psychology and BTEC ICT, I have the needed 5 C's or above at GCSE.

My dream is to become a commercial airline pilot, so I had a look at CTC's airline programmes. Ones that caught my eye were Monarch and British Airways. However, at such a young age, my fear of the cost of the training being so high, what would you do. I know both Monarch and BA use the bank loan from BBVA, do you think that's a good way to go?

Out of the two programmes, at this moment in time I think that Monarch's programme would be best in terms of entry requirements.

My family also do not simply understand how much I want this dream to become a reality, but with how much the training costs, they won't even think about it.

Any help or advise is welcome.

Philip G is offline  
Old 5th Sep 2014, 19:23
  #123 (permalink)  
Join Date: Jun 2014
Location: Philippines
Posts: 6
hi, first of all i would like to be an airline pilot but i'm too confused if i'm going to start my training. since i'm not sure if i can hit the job right after the training. i'm already turning 25 this year still in the middle of yes or no.
rehpej is offline  
Old 6th Sep 2014, 02:20
  #124 (permalink)  
Join Date: Jul 2013
Location: Cambridge
Age: 23
Posts: 21
First off - keep working on your A Levels - many schemes require two or more A Level grades at C or above, with the British Airways one requiring BBC or above at A Level. The British Airways scheme could be regarded as the most foolproof, as once you have completed training you have the sum paid back to you in full over seven years, however this makes it very popular and even getting to the interviews stage can be a challenge. I'm about to start applying for the Atlantic Airways scheme, which requires no funding up front but does require you to have a PPL before applying, and costs will be paid back once a position is secured. As I have been told many times, and it is good advice, find something that makes you stand out from the crowd and do it. I'm sure that interviewers get bored of hearing the same old stuff, and having a unique or interesting hobby or interest can help grab their attention.

The fact is, this is not an easy career to get into - but don't let that stop you from having a damn good go at it. I'll be 18 a month after you, but I have the benefit of a funding source. Sometimes however, money is the least of the issue, you first have to find a scheme that you get far enough in to actually need to pay for. The other ways in which fledgling careers are started are numerous. Whether it's bush flying (something many younger wannabes seem to be getting more and more interested in) or crop spraying, it seems that aspiring airline pilots are finding even more ways to make their dreams a reality.

My advice to you? Same as many peoples advice to me. Have fun, and for this great bit of your life that exists between 18 and 21, don't let the prospect of a future career dominate. By all means, apply to every scheme you can find and fly in smaller aircraft at every opportunity just for the experience, but make sure you remember to have fun. I hate the saying with a passion, but you do only live once, and it's very difficult to do the kind of things you do at this age once you've retired (do with that as you will...)

If you have any more questions don't hesitate to ask
LukePilot152 is offline  
Old 6th Sep 2014, 09:55
  #125 (permalink)  
Join Date: Dec 2011
Location: UK
Posts: 291
Philip - continue to work hard at those a-levels and get the best grades you can. For many the BBVA loan is the only way to go, hence why the terms of the loan are shocking, if you have the money then great!

Immerse yourself in as many activities as possible, get a part time job, visit your local airfield, attend FTO open days (take what is said at these with a huge pinch of salt), visit the flyer exhibition at Heathrow, and ask to visit the flight deck on flights that you are on. These activities will help to demonstrate your motivation to become a pilot, of which recruiters will want to see evidence. This should also help demonstrate to your family how much you want this job. If you want to do it and get the loan you will need to have them onboard. However I would ask yourself if you feel comfortable with using your parent’s home as security for a loan?

Most importantly before you spend any money, get yourself down to Gatwick for the initial class 1 medical – without this you will never be able to fly commercially.

I think it’s worth bringing yourself up to speed with what’s currently happening in the aviation industry. In the current state of affairs Monarch will most likely not be recruiting cadets for a while. BA on the other hand probably will. Look at airlines and see how they recruit their pilots, what do they look for when hiring new pilots? The low hour market is flooded with people that all have the license, what makes you stand out?
average-punter is offline  
Old 8th Sep 2014, 21:31
  #126 (permalink)  
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Essex
Posts: 4
To fly or not to fly!!

I completed my PPL(H) in 2008 but haven’t flown for 4 years due to work and financial commitments.
For these 4 years I have thought about nothing apart from flying again and have really missed it. I am disillusioned with my job so now I have decided to carry out my dream and continue with flying helicopters again.
My issue is the old favorite of money and spending money with no guarantee of a job at the end.
I read on all the flying schools websites that there is or will be a shortage of chopper pilots within the next year or so. This maybe propaganda to take my money and give me false hope but naively and optimistically I hope this is true and they are not the scammers of the century!
I’ve looked online to see what jobs there are and this may have been my first mistake. On looking there doesn’t seem to be many jobs and the ones I have seen seem to have everybody and their dog going for it.
Are there jobs out there or am I for a major disappointment?
I’m still going to push on with my dreams but the question now is where to go to learn?
I am English but do I train in the UK where I would have to sell every organ in my body or go somewhere warm like the good old US of A??
I know I would have to put travel and accommodation into my funding but it still seems to come out cheaper by the hour compared to good old blighty.
If I get my FAA exams all the way from hour building, IFR, CPL, CFI and then CFII, it’s going to cost me a fortune to change back to the new EASA.
Sooooooo, if it costs me a lot to change my licenses over, would it be a waste of time going the US way and just bite the proverbial bullet and do my licenses in England?
Also where is the best place to learn and hopefully be taken on at the end?
If you wish you can PM me.
Thanks guys.
Helihopefull is offline  
Old 9th Sep 2014, 04:25
  #127 (permalink)  

Join Date: Nov 2000
Location: White Waltham, Prestwick & Calgary
Age: 68
Posts: 3,842
First of all, take with a pinch of salt any promises of employment after training. Next, don't forget you need immigration if you train and intend to work in another country, and that you have to think many years ahead in this business.

Having said all that - there are indeed shortages of helicopter pilots, but in the mid range. That is to say, there are lots of low time guys (and gals) and lots of high timers, but not much in the middle. As the average age of the industry is quite high (57 in the GOM a few years ago), I can see that over the next few years most of the industry will have to retire, which should nicely take you to the end of your training.

Your licence is not the only hurdle - that is actually the easy part - you need some sort of specialisation (IR or longlining, mountain course) or hours in the book, so your budget needs to be quite high for the extras.

If you want to go that route I would also recommend another language (Spanish, etc), which is a cheap upgrade for a low hours pilot.
paco is offline  
Old 13th Sep 2014, 17:07
  #128 (permalink)  
Join Date: Sep 2014
Location: United Kingdom
Posts: 2
Thanks for all the suggestions and help. I am trying to apply for a part time job to earn some money, however I do need more help to persuade my family that this is what I want to do, it's what I want. They keep explaining that it's a lot of money, which I understand. any more help?

Philip G is offline  
Old 21st Oct 2014, 08:05
  #129 (permalink)  
Join Date: Oct 2014
Location: Birmingham United Kingdom
Posts: 1
Thinking about becoming a pilot

Hi guys,

My first post here, hope its in the correct section.

For a long time I have wanted to be a pilot, scared of heights but love being in the air (yeah as crazy as it sounds). Until recently i have never had the cash to do the training. Now I am able to afford to pay for the training outright i am considering doing it however there are a number of things putting me off. If possible i would like to hear the views of people with more experience on the following points:

Are pilots salaried or paid per flight hour? I have read conflicting things on the internet.
Also is it true pilots can start on as little as 20k a year? Again i have read different things. Many websites state being a pilot is one of the best paying jobs earning 70k + per year however others say you can start on around 20k.
I currently earn 32k (+OT taking it to around 40k) repairing the EEC for trent 700 & 800 engines. I dont really want to spend 60k on training to walk into a 20k a year job.

Job Prospects:
Is it really that hard to get a job with a decent airline? Due to the high cost of training id have thought pilots are hard to come by, however many sites on the internet are saying there are loads of pilots and few jobs.

I understand being a pilot is not exactly a 9-5 job. I have no problem working unsociable hours, however I have also read that pilots have to commute 100's of miles or get a flight to another airport before starting their shift, that some sleep in airport lounges and even the planes themselves. What is the reality of this?

I have read articles at the following link however it seems to be very US orientated. How does this compare to flying for UK airlines?:
The Truth About the Profession - Home

All advice greatly appreciated.
leemp5 is offline  
Old 21st Oct 2014, 10:06
  #130 (permalink)  
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: UK
Posts: 302
IF you manage to get a job, the starting salary for most newbie pilots I know (myself included) is 20-25000 If you have paid for your type rating, it might be towards the top end. If you are bonded for your type rating, it's towards the bottom end. I took a pay cut of nearly 10000 to do the job I'm in now.

I expect to be in this kind of pay bracket for several years until I have gained enough experience to be able to move to a larger operator where the progression to higher pay scales is possible.

That's the realistic picture, particularly since you seem to be heading for the modular route rather than the integrated route. There are those who do get straight into an airliner job, and over the course of a few years their financial position does eventually get somewhere decent.

Commuting - it's a 2.5 to 3 hour commute from my home to where I work. I work some pretty strange hours, but nowhere near as bad as some. That said, the worst of the "flying to fly" commuting seems to happen in the USA and not so much in Europe. Bear in mind you have to go where the jobs are. Would you move to Inverness, or Newquay, or Norwich, or London, to follow a 6 month contract? If you have a house established and a mortgage, this makes it a lot more complicated since paying mortgage on your own house and then rent on a hardly used room near to your current place of work makes life very financially stretched. If you're a 20 year old living at mum and dad's hotel, your options are clearly much greater for renting something near to where you're working.
fwjc is offline  
Old 23rd Oct 2014, 21:57
  #131 (permalink)  
Join Date: Oct 2014
Location: stevenage
Posts: 22
Advice (stepping stones)

Hello all,

I am now 20 years old and in the final year of my Bsc hons degree in sport with a predicated grade of 2:1/1st. My whole life (especially more recently) i have dreamed of one day perusing a career in aviation as a pilot. I have a fully functional Boeing and Cessna flight simulator at my university which i use on a weekly basis (all hours logged) so even though its not substantial, i am currently gaining some aviation training. I just wondered whether there was any advice on what next steps i should take to start being more serious about aviation and start training to become a pilot? I have researched aviation training for some time now and am aware of the substantial financial investment i must make!

If anyone could offer any advice then please post as it will be much appreciated!
dannybuckley8 is offline  
Old 24th Oct 2014, 07:01
  #132 (permalink)  
Join Date: Feb 2000
Location: UK
Posts: 13,807
Basically - fly something.

I'm guessing as a final year undergrad, you're up to your eyeballs in debt, and also fairly busy. However, not all flying needs to be expensive.

Most universities have a university gliding club - go and join them. Get some time with air under the tyres: at this early stage it really doesn't matter what, and actually gliding does tend to create good "stick and rudder" pilots which should help counteract the bad habits you've probably been developing from unsupervised mucking about on computer flight emulators.

Once you do have time and money, then the next stage is to do a PPL. It really doesn't matter what that is in - microlights, gliders, motorgliders, helicopters will all serve the basic function. That said, if you do it on light aeroplanes, then the hours are most portable to civil professional licences. The main issue here is that you need to learn:-

(1) Whether you have an aptitude for real flying (and don't think that simulator time has told you that, it hasn't).

(2) Whether you have enough real passion for flying to keep going through the exams and training.

(3) How the real world flying environment works - from contact with the various professional pilots who will be teaching you.

Once you have a private flying qualification of some description, then you're in a position to decide if you want to go pro or not.

And don't forget at your relatively young age, everything is open to you - not just the standard default of airline pilot that is all most people see. Military careers in particular - either as (say) a PT Officer with access to service flying clubs, or as a military pilot.
Genghis the Engineer is offline  
Old 24th Oct 2014, 11:44
  #133 (permalink)  
Join Date: Feb 2000
Location: gashbag
Age: 49
Posts: 557
Like i said before, step one is a class 1 medical. Until you have that, any effort or money spent might be entirely wasted.
PURPLE PITOT is offline  
Old 3rd Nov 2014, 07:58
  #134 (permalink)  
Join Date: Oct 2014
Location: stevenage
Posts: 22
Thank you for your advice it is much appreciated, I have gained few 'real world' flight time but will keep looking at gaining more after I graduate as like you said I am up to my eyeballs in work!
dannybuckley8 is offline  
Old 20th Nov 2014, 16:51
  #135 (permalink)  
Join Date: Nov 2014
Location: UK
Posts: 8
Question Where do I start?


I am fairly new to these forums. I've been snooping around them for the last couple of days...

To cut a long story short I am a bloke in his early 20s born and bred in the US who has had a burning desire to become an airline pilot ever since he was a little kid etc etc etc. Unfortunately I sort of gave up on the idea in high school when I realized that there was no way I could ever back my dream with the adequate amount of mulah or achieve it via the military route. So I had to think of something else to do in the mean time...

Fast forward a few years and I am now a professional firefighter in one of the biggest cities in the UK. A bit random I know but I feel very blessed and also very content to be where I am now, doing what i'm doing BUT... I still always find myself looking up at the clouds etc etc etc [insert cheesy dream stuff here].

Now I am beginning to feel like I am in a position where I can actually start thinking about pursuing my ultimate dream of being in the right seat of an airliner. I am not saying i've got the money to do it this very moment but at least I am making decent money which I can save towards my dream. Plus I hopefully also have time on my side. Maybe?

From what I can tell these are my options...

A) Save around 30k, go and do all my training in the US. However I know this will not get me anywhere near the amount of hours or experience I will need to apply for any airline job. So if I went this route would there be any part-time flying jobs I could do in the UK to make me competitive for an airline flying job?


B) Go the integrated flight school route like CTC, get lucky and get hired for easyJet flexicrew or something similar. However it is a terrifying thought that I might be nearly 100k in debt and be making less than I am now.

Now money is not everything to me. I do not want to be a pilot for the big $$$ but obviously we all need to be making enough to look after our families and not be in a load of debt.

Oh and before I forget there are also things like BAs future pilot program but I don't want to put all my eggs in one basket, get rejected by these excellent programs and not be any closer to becoming an airline pilot because I didn't do any training myself. But then again you can't be a fully certified pilot and apply to these programs...

Heck, what about becoming a bush or mission pilot? But you need a load of hours for those jobs too.

So that brings me back to the title of this thread, where do I start?

Let me specify I do love my job and would be quite happy doing it till the day I die but that doesn't mean I don't want to give my ultimate life long dream the big old try otherwise I will always wonder, what if?

I fully appreciate anyone's input in advance!

And let me just specify that I attempted to get my PPL a few years back so I know I love to fly. Never achieved because I ran out of money.

Last edited by Scyther; 20th Nov 2014 at 18:22. Reason: more info
Scyther is offline  
Old 20th Nov 2014, 18:58
  #136 (permalink)  
Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: UK
Posts: 394
I think you should apply for sponsored schemes and see where they take you. You have a good job from which I'm sure you'll have demonstrated lots of qualities that airlines are looking for. You're also still young enough that if they don't work out over the next few years then you can try the alternatives.

Hope it's helpful.
G-F0RC3 is offline  
Old 20th Nov 2014, 20:02
  #137 (permalink)  
Join Date: Nov 2014
Location: UK
Posts: 8
Cheers for that G-FORC3!

Are there any sponsored schemes you can recommend? The best one i've seen is BAFPP which will be up again in 2015.

The reason I ask this is because I see an application for easyJet open on CTC and am not sure if it's even worth applying for.

I know I need to have a look myself as i've only just got back on board with this stuff but I also appreciate tips from those more experienced...
Scyther is offline  
Old 21st Nov 2014, 17:43
  #138 (permalink)  
Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: UK
Posts: 394
Any mentored scheme with a reputable airline is a golden opportunity. The BAFPP is the best in my humble (and entirely unbiased ) opinion. But a scheme that gets you to the RHS of an Easyjet A320 is an excellent one too.
G-F0RC3 is offline  
Old 21st Nov 2014, 18:30
  #139 (permalink)  
Join Date: Nov 2014
Location: UK
Posts: 8
Ha, and my fire station is the best and busiest in the world!

Yeah, after having spent quite a bit of time reading the stuff on these forums i've decided to throw myself off a bridge...

Kidding... no... instead over the coming years I will attempt to save a giant mound of money as well as apply for all the best sponsored schemes I can. And if I don't ever get into any of those then I will hopefully have saved enough to go the modular route. And then at least I will still have my job and be able to look for flying jobs without the debt.

Advice heeded!
Scyther is offline  
Old 4th Dec 2014, 22:17
  #140 (permalink)  
Join Date: Nov 2014
Location: UK
Posts: 8
USA or UK and other stuff

Hi everyone,

I was wondering... if you had the choice of pursuing an airline career in either the USA or the UK where would you go and why?

From what I can tell, the modular route in the USA seems to be a much more acceptable route to the flight deck for those of us who will never have a spare 100k lying around. The only catch is that you will most likely need a bachelors degree to be competitive for a major airline.

UK seems to offer a more direct route to the cockpit (integrated ATPL OAA/CTC) but only if you have the cash and you don't even get a PPL out of them? You are also stuck with your airline? Factor in a high degree of luck and being in the right place at the right time. The cadet programs are definitely worth as many shots as you can give them though as they are not available in the US.

I personally feel that America would be the best way to go if you factor out the cadet programs. You get all your licences (including PPL) and all options are open to you unlike in integrated ATPL/MCC programs. It is cheaper and you can work your way up the ladder.

And if you already loved your job would you give it up to pursue a career in the flight deck of a major? Or would flying Cessners for fun on the weekends satisfy? Is flying a big jet ACTUALLY much more exciting and enjoyable than flying a small prop plane and going on flying adventures around the world. I understand that there are A LOT of variables in this one but general thoughts would be appreciated... If you don't want to fly for money than why are you flying for money? Do you get more of a buzz from flying a big jet? Are the views much better?

I just can't shake off the feeling I get when I think about being in control of a large multi-million dollar jet aircraft, full of passengers that are relying on my skills and professionalism to get them from point A to point B safely and efficiently. But as I said, I can only imagine, I don't know what it actually feels like... I just can't get rid of that, "WOW, I wanna do that" feeling (shiny jet syndrome). Do you airline pilots still get that feeling?

Lastly, are you ever too old to become an airline pilot (bearing in mind you have to give your license back when your 60)? Will you still get a fair shot as anyone else starting out in your mid to late 30s?

I would highly appreciate your response!
Scyther is offline  

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