Ryanair Scam!!
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Ryanair Scam!!
What the hell is going on when an airline makes you pay for an apliation form! Not only do they charge for this but also the interview, sim ride and type rating. I know that there are pilots out there willing to pay for this but these select few are ruining it for us all!!!! <img src="mad.gif" border="0">
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twisted if you're suggesting that Ryanair is representative of all airlines in the capitalist world, you're way off the mark, mate!. .Ryanair is building up a dam of resentment and ill-feeling that will surely burst when the market starts to free up. In the meantime, they are exploiting the Wannabe fraternity ruthlessly, with charges for application, interview, simulator assessment, and training, and then restricted pay on employment! Frankly, I'd rather work in MacD's - at least you get free food!
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Has anyone applied online yet and payed the rediculous application fee? I did, in one of my minutes of madness, but as of yet not received any form of acknoledgement.
Q. Are they actually getting back to people, or are they just taking our hard earned cash?
Q. Are they actually getting back to people, or are they just taking our hard earned cash?
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The Ryans are charging £50 stg just for the privaledge of apllying to them, then £150 stg for the sim ride, then £15,000 for the 737 type rating, and finally pocket money for wages if your lucky enough to get accepted. It's all on their website.
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And they reckon it's cutting out a lot of CV's that they no longer receive from pilots they'll never employ - ie those without a 737 type-rating in the first place. More than just a slightly bad attitude but it certainly isn't a sellers market out there. Btw, they've never really been into taking people on as a first job, so you're not missing out on much.
They may be building up a dam of resentment amongst the wannabe community but remember that in good times, whenever they employ a 737 rated pilot or even one with some previous experience, another vacancy opens up further down the line, which may just get you your first job.
Good luck
They may be building up a dam of resentment amongst the wannabe community but remember that in good times, whenever they employ a 737 rated pilot or even one with some previous experience, another vacancy opens up further down the line, which may just get you your first job.
Good luck
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its economics, not very honourable economics but economics nonetheless, supply and demand springs to mind.
Sure it sux, but you do get 737 hoop-la time, and when the market picks up you can leave... <img src="smile.gif" border="0">
I recall talking to a Ryanair FO in '96 who was delighted at the arrival of the new Ryanair airbuses next year, well they musta got lost cos leprechaun O'Reilly is going to fly the 737's until they fall apart, I think it's called zero depreciation curve...what a t**l.
F4
"oops , its never done that before ??? "
Sure it sux, but you do get 737 hoop-la time, and when the market picks up you can leave... <img src="smile.gif" border="0">
I recall talking to a Ryanair FO in '96 who was delighted at the arrival of the new Ryanair airbuses next year, well they musta got lost cos leprechaun O'Reilly is going to fly the 737's until they fall apart, I think it's called zero depreciation curve...what a t**l.
F4
"oops , its never done that before ??? "
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Actually what MOL doesn´t realize is that in a few months...a year or two, when things pick up again, alot (and I mean ALOT) of pilots are going to leave. And what does that mean. Of course he say´s there will be many pilots who will be out there, but not with enough experience to become capt. Now this is a dilemma. Too many FO´s but no Capt. It seems to me that he has shot himself in the foot, especially with the ones recruited after sept. 11. What happens then ... No 25 % expansion each year, No new sectors, No new bases, etc... What I want to know is if things will start to pick up thiis year will he restore sectorpayments back or what( this is suppose to be answered by Theflyingirishman which does seem to know things from the inside). .Any comments?
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The website promises a confirmation of receipt of your application within five days. I’d suggest that if you don’t receive this confirmation, have your credit card company cancel the payment.
I know a couple of people who went into FR five years ago with very little experience and both are now captains, flying their ar$es off and earning good salaries. Doesn’t seem to bad to me!
Gash
I know a couple of people who went into FR five years ago with very little experience and both are now captains, flying their ar$es off and earning good salaries. Doesn’t seem to bad to me!
Gash
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I appreciate the problem of having to pay to have your application read and for the interview/simulator, especially when they can then turn around and say thanks but no thanks. My problem is this:
- As a new License holder if I don’t go for schemes like this how do I keep current? How do I build the multi engine and multi crew hours required by the other carriers and perhaps just as important how do I achieve the 500 hours multi crew time needed to un-freeze my ATPL? If there is an alternative please let me know.
Even if the pay is reduced at the moment it is still better than temping pay and you still build time on a 737. Surely this is better than nothing. Also if the trade picks up the pay will have to improve for retention reasons. If people do leave then time to command must reduce, not only are you now building 737 time you are doing it in the left hand seat.
Please tell me – am I being irrational or do I have a bit of a point.
I would like to know more about the rest of the employment contract not included on the web site. I remember seeing some snippets of it on a post a while back.
- As a new License holder if I don’t go for schemes like this how do I keep current? How do I build the multi engine and multi crew hours required by the other carriers and perhaps just as important how do I achieve the 500 hours multi crew time needed to un-freeze my ATPL? If there is an alternative please let me know.
Even if the pay is reduced at the moment it is still better than temping pay and you still build time on a 737. Surely this is better than nothing. Also if the trade picks up the pay will have to improve for retention reasons. If people do leave then time to command must reduce, not only are you now building 737 time you are doing it in the left hand seat.
Please tell me – am I being irrational or do I have a bit of a point.
I would like to know more about the rest of the employment contract not included on the web site. I remember seeing some snippets of it on a post a while back.
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They must be DESPERATE for CASH at Ryanair.. .Or is it just the way things are going?
The PR implications of this scam will, as. .Scroggs rightly points out, only become . .manifest when the market picks up.
People will vote with their feet..
The contast between BA who stump up. .£100,000 to train cadets and this airline. .who are not investing in any pilot training. .is interesting. In fact they expect pilots to pay them.
Where will this trend take us ? It may be that. .as has happened in the US one is expected to pay some low cost carriers for the priviledge of a job ultimately? Build Turbine time for X dollars etc....
It all makes for cheap seats for Jo Bloggs. .on a lads weekend in AMS I suppose - its . .a form of subsidy...
The whole thing relies on pilots obsession . .with the pursuit of their career...
The PR implications of this scam will, as. .Scroggs rightly points out, only become . .manifest when the market picks up.
People will vote with their feet..
The contast between BA who stump up. .£100,000 to train cadets and this airline. .who are not investing in any pilot training. .is interesting. In fact they expect pilots to pay them.
Where will this trend take us ? It may be that. .as has happened in the US one is expected to pay some low cost carriers for the priviledge of a job ultimately? Build Turbine time for X dollars etc....
It all makes for cheap seats for Jo Bloggs. .on a lads weekend in AMS I suppose - its . .a form of subsidy...
The whole thing relies on pilots obsession . .with the pursuit of their career...
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Love them or loathe them, have you checked out the latest on R&N, 100 new aircaft (reportedly) on order from Boeing between now and 2010, estimating the need for a further 800 pilots.
I'd cautiously say it has to be a good sign for the industry, if nothing else to generate interest amongst the competitors regarding expansion.
Any good news has to be welcome, maybe albeit cautiously at this stage.
I'd cautiously say it has to be a good sign for the industry, if nothing else to generate interest amongst the competitors regarding expansion.
Any good news has to be welcome, maybe albeit cautiously at this stage.
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Let me clarify my original point, Of course it is good news that an airline is expanding and wanting to hire new pilots, BUT airlines know that there are guys willing to fly for food and water and these guys that are wanting to jump the que (Pottster) are ruining it for the vast majority with that attitude.
Is it right that an airline is doing this = NO.
Is it right that there are guys willing to pay for this = NO
Let us all remember we are Professional ie Airlines pay for our professional skills it should not and must not work the other way!!!! <img src="mad.gif" border="0"> <img src="mad.gif" border="0">
Is it right that an airline is doing this = NO.
Is it right that there are guys willing to pay for this = NO
Let us all remember we are Professional ie Airlines pay for our professional skills it should not and must not work the other way!!!! <img src="mad.gif" border="0"> <img src="mad.gif" border="0">
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If that is your attitude Sky Guy then I may well be served a big Mac by you one day! It is all very well moaning about things but at the end of the day if you want a job you have to do something about it. I can't afford to sit around for a couple of years paying to keep myself current, can you? I don't believe I am jumping the line, indeed I have not decided whether or not to apply yet. I am just looking for a way to get ahead. Nobody is going to come and offer me a job because I boycott Ryanair!
Also although the wages have dropped and you have to pay for the rating, I still don't consider £30-35 k as me paying to fly!!! It would certainly start to pay some of my debts off.
Also although the wages have dropped and you have to pay for the rating, I still don't consider £30-35 k as me paying to fly!!! It would certainly start to pay some of my debts off.
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While not necessarily agreeing with Ryanair, just trying to widen up the discussion....
Why should an airline pay for your type rating, training, etc when you're going to leave anyway? Asking for application fees is quite common in the USA where there is *zero* loyalty to the company (granted, it goes both ways).
This is an eternal dilemma. What is a humane way to bond people to the company for a couple of years so there's a sporting chance of getting the money back? I remember having to do two years for my IR way back when, but there was no enforceable contract.
What do the panel think?
phil
Why should an airline pay for your type rating, training, etc when you're going to leave anyway? Asking for application fees is quite common in the USA where there is *zero* loyalty to the company (granted, it goes both ways).
This is an eternal dilemma. What is a humane way to bond people to the company for a couple of years so there's a sporting chance of getting the money back? I remember having to do two years for my IR way back when, but there was no enforceable contract.
What do the panel think?
phil
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15k for the typre rating. Latest rumour is 25k if your future is on the -800 series. They may be making money on your typre rating? Sign a contract guaranteeing only 50 sectors and you'll see no sector pay for those 50. A friend has 5 to go and still no sign of a 'new' contract. Be very carefull what you wish for...
MAX <img src="cool.gif" border="0">
MAX <img src="cool.gif" border="0">
I neither agree or dis-agree with the posts on this topic, but I do know one thing:
When i get to the point of having my CPL/IR, Flying makes me happy, I love it, so as long as i would have enough pay to cover my food and rent I would be over the moon
When i get to the point of having my CPL/IR, Flying makes me happy, I love it, so as long as i would have enough pay to cover my food and rent I would be over the moon