Must really JAA CPL training be made in same country as ATPL theory?

[N-X211]

Hi there,

I have recently passed the ATPL written exams at CAA in the UK.

When contacting one of the training schools in Spain for CPL training the school wrote me back:

"I am sorry to say that you should do the CPL in the same country as you have done the ATPL theory (JAR rules). You are welcome to come here and do the MEIR if you are interested after getting your UK JAR CPL."

I thought it is the other way round, i.e., it is the IR training that can not be done in a different country.

Can anyone clarify, where this rule really come from? ...

Many thanks

[Whirlygig]

It's in JAR-FCL and they're right. A commercial licence, along with the required theory, is a stand-alone licence and should all be taken in the same country i.e. theory and flying in the UK (in your case).

You may be able to get an exemption or transfer of the theory provided both the UK and Spanish CAAs agree.

An Instrument Rating is another rating and can be taken in any JAA country.

Cheers

Whirls

[wannabe15]

Using an illustration as an example:

ATPL Theory (Bristol Ground School, UK)
CPL flying (25 hrs) in UK
Assuming min 200hrs attained, i supposed my CPL license will be a CAA regulated

If thereafter i decide to go Spain to complete the rest, i.e MEIR, who will then be my licensing authority? UK or Spain?

[Whirlygig]

Assuming you'll live and work in the UK, then it'll be a UK JAA licence.

Cheers

Whirls

[wannabe15]

Thanks Whirlygig,

unfortunately i'm from half way around the world in the Far East. It's just that i'm comtemplating going the modular route, ie ATPL theory with Bristol, then CPL training in Australia (only JAA approved school in this part of the world). I may just end up with UK CPL first without the 55hr IR course (too expensive!) thereafter i'm looking for the MEIR rating, probably in Australia or Malaysia or Singapore, 3 countries which is more realistic for me (in terms of work and living)

cheers

[N-X211]

wannabe1 wrote:

ATPL theory with Bristol, then CPL training in Australia (only JAA approved school in this part of the world). I may just end up with UK CPL first

I understand from what you wrote that IT IS POSSIBLE to pass the ATPL exams in one country (here: UK) and do the JAA CPL training in another one (here: JAA approved school in Australia) ..

"I am still confused, but on a much higher level"
.. please explain

Cheers

[Whirlygig]

Australia isn't in the JAA; therefore, in order for a JAA school in Australia to have JAA status, it will have to be affiliated with a JAA country's regime; probably the UK.

However, SPain is in the JAA and it's schools will be under the regulations of the JAA via the Spanish CAA.

Therefore, although you must check, the Australian JAA school will have a partnership with a UK ATPL ground school.

You cannot do a JAA IR anywhere other than JAA airpsace. If you do a non-JAA IR, you must convert it.

Cheers

Whirls

[N-X211]

Thank you Whirlygig.

That means I am allowed to get a UK CPL OUTSIDE the UK in places like US or Australia (at a correspondingly affiliated school) .. but not in JAA airspace ..

hmmm ... .. sorry .. I couldn't help ..

[EIPCW]

Would I be correct in thinking that the UK CAA and IAA in Ireland have an agreement in which they accept eachother's ATPL exam credits?

I ask this because I wish to take the IAA ATPL's and then travel to the US to do the CPL in a UK JAA approved school

Can somebody please correct me if I am wrong in thinking this is ok to do

Cheers

[redout]

I know a guy who done his 14 ATPLs in Spain under the DGAC and got permission to do the CPL in the UK so its possible once you get permission that is. IR can be done in any JAA country.

[INNflight]

Same here, you can do ATPL exams in Austria and the UK CAA accepts them.

Yet another glorious standard of JAR..?!

[irishpilot1990]

Hello,

I am in the same boat...I have irish IAA ATPL exam results..and want to do my CPL the CAA route..from my reading of LASORS this is ok....but i am trying to get clarification from the CAA and IAA about this.
via phone calls they both have clearly stated,this is done,and had been done before.I am trying to get this in writing before i start to hopefully prevent any confusion when i apply for my CPL license.

[EIPCW]

irishpilot,

I would be interested to hear if you do get clarification on this. I have started my IAA Atpl's thinking that it is ok to then take the CAA route

[LH2]

ATPL Theory (Bristol Ground School, UK)
CPL flying (25 hrs) in UK

Assuming you'll live and work in the UK, then it'll be a UK JAA licence.

And assuming you don't, it'll still be a UK JAA licence (ask me how I know )

You may be able to get an exemption or transfer of the theory provided both the UK and Spanish CAAs agree.

Correct, that's it. Some countries do accept that sort of arrangement regularly (e.g., Finland, Greece, UK), others have been known to accept foreign sittings (from what I read here, Austria is one of them), yet others will never contemplate this sort of thing (France).

So to emphasise Whirly's point: it's technically possible to do what you suggest, but you have to do some legwork.

FWIW, I once met someone who had completed his theory in the UK and the flying bit in Spain. I'm not sure I would recommend it though, as you will end up with a Spanish licence, meaning that all your licence-related dealings will be with the DGAC. Now, I've never had any contact with them whatsoever so I can't speak from personal experience, but I know a couple dozen Spanish-licenced pilots and they all agree the DGAC is crap. There was even a thread in the Spanish section of Pprune a while ago discussing the various options to transfer their licences to other countries, and I know one pilot whose type rating had already expired by the time he received it from the DGAC.

[wannabe15]

N-X211,

Sorry for the late reply. i guess Whirlygig has answered for me. Thanks.

From my research, yes you can get your UK CPL in Australia but the IR has to be done in UK.

LH2: i'm interested in your idea. Care to share with us?

cheers

[skamil]

ATPL exams

Whether I can do the ground training in one country for example UK, Spain but examinations to write in other JAA country?


Thanks for help.

[redbar1]

Skamil:

For a licence, splitting the theoretical gnd school and the theoretical exams is pushing it a bit far...

This should not happen (unless in a totally abnormal case), the intent in JAR-FCL was never anything like this. Just being able to POSSIBLY do the theory in one state, and the flying in another, took years to establish.

So, sorry mate.
Cheers,
Redbar1

[tigermagicjohn]

ATPL exams in the UK, would not be possible to use in Norway - exams has to be taken in the country of license issue for the CPL.

I was also told had to do the IR in Norway too! Because of the program the CPL school offered.

[CarbHeatIn]

You can obtain a UK CPL through FTE in Jerez, Spain.

IAA and CAA mutual recognition of ATPL (Theory)

[MartinCh]

For a licence, splitting the theoretical gnd school and the theoretical exams is pushing it a bit far...

That's exactly what I'm going to do once I do my fixed wing ICAO CPL or PPL with plenty hours and convert (whichever way) to JAA. Also will sit the exams in English :-D

Do you guys really want to pay these crazy UK CAA fees and charges??
Studying and living in the UK at the mo and can't see myself doing FW training in Europe (= most of it). So will simply use CATS for theory and sit exams far away.

So, technically, JAA/EASA airspace and theory exams and CPL LST in the same country.

BTW, I had it all authorised from the authorities in two countries, one JAA and the other will be EASA (and JAR compliant anyway)