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So, I want to fly a jet

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So, I want to fly a jet

Old 18th Jul 2017, 15:41
  #21 (permalink)  
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Do I come here often?
Posts: 896
Go and buy a nice aeroplane to fly, one that excites you and arouses aviation passions, then when you want a jet hire one and find that there are plenty of idiots like me around who make a living flying corporate jets.

You can get a lot of aeroplane for the price of a mustang and hire decent kit when you need to go somewhere, You can turn up when you want (at least thats what my customers think) with extra pax, extra bags, p###ed and anounce that youve changed your mind and that rather than Malaga you fancy Malta and can we please get airborne asap, oh and here's my extra bag and dog to carry, and why aren't we airborne yet?

A long time ago I flew a King Air 200 and a Citation 11SP around Europe single pilot and it was quite hard work with antiquated systems, a modern jet with avionics failures is worse. You may find insurers insisting on min hours, safety pilot and as many qualifications as possible.

A Citation Mustang is P51/Spitfire money new, get a P51/spitfire. Get more from the flying, and probably fly it more. You can get a P51 out of the hangar and ready to fly in a couple of hours, a Citation Mustang is not the sort of steed where you're going to call the airport and say "get my plane out, I fancy flying for an hour."

Use the cash to hire a more comfortable jet, with more ramp presence, take more people, enjoy the trip with a nice hostie bringing you cold champagne and canapes. I was recently doing the walkround at an airport known for the wealth and glitz of it's clientele, on the next stand was a Citation Mustang, and as the Mustang pilots were shoe horning them into their seats I heard the wife complaining that when her husband told her he'd hired a private jet, she thought he meant something like the one I was doing the walk round on (99' long, 99' span, 29' tall) not a airfix toy, and how embarrasing, everyone knowing they were poor!

Forget the jet, go serious warbird, or even serious helicopter.

Sir Niall Dementia is offline  
Old 18th Jul 2017, 16:38
  #22 (permalink)  
Join Date: Jul 2012
Location: Barbados
Posts: 401
Just been reading Flyer for July 2017 - very good review of the Cirrus Vision jet - suggest it is not difficult to fly and an easy step up from a 22.

A tiny jet - hoping to see one down here soon.

If I had the dosh I would but a Paris Jet - not so expensive and look serious fun.

If I had someone down here to maintain it I would buy a Provost tomorrow just for the sound.
Ebbie 2003 is offline  
Old 18th Jul 2017, 17:32
  #23 (permalink)  
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: LFBZ (for a while)
Posts: 732
Just to put an opposing point of view... if you want to fly a jet, go for it.

A friend of mine came to flying quite late in life (40 ish), did his PPL, and told me he wanted a jet. He did CPL, multi, IR all in a very intense fashion (CPL in a long weekend, most of his IR in a coast-to-coast and back journey).

He suddenly came into a lot of money (entirely through his own efforts) and bought a Phenom, which he flies with great satisfaction around the US and occasionally further.

He is very, very happy with his Phenom. Is it a good use of money, or his time? Of course not, he'd be much better off with Netjets and pootling round in his Cirrus at weekends. But he is very happy.

As for warbirds and the like - these are really a much more effective way than a small jet to get yourself dead. Lots of fun, but the fatality rate for amateur pilots in these things is horrifying.
n5296s is offline  
Old 18th Jul 2017, 20:26
  #24 (permalink)  
Join Date: Nov 2016
Location: 57 North
Posts: 78
When I got my PPL, the old brown, CAA, ICAO compliant one, I recall my examiner asking if I understood what that allowed me to do. She went on to say that if I had enough money or found someone foolish enough to let me, I could even fly a light, single engine jet, and that to me with a long standing liking for the Folland Gnat. It wouldn't be sensible, she said, but it would be quite legal.
Chuck Glider is offline  
Old 18th Jul 2017, 21:27
  #25 (permalink)  
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Join Date: May 2015
Location: London
Posts: 51
It's funny how different establishments and points-of-view will offer different pre-requisites. It's not well-defined, so I appreciate everyone's comments.

I'm in absolutely no rush so I'm more than happy to study for and sit the ATPL's, for example. In fact, I just purchased all the manuals as to begin warming up at least. (It should be noted that whilst obtaining potential superfluous licenses (see ATPL, CPL, MCC) would inevitably help the insurance premium, I strive to be as knowledgeable as one can be. That's the main reason I want to complete them. That's what counts.

I have been in touch with FlightSafety International and they are currently assisting training routes and ATO's.

Once again, I'm thankful to this community.
BatteriesNotIncluded is offline  
Old 18th Jul 2017, 22:25
  #26 (permalink)  
Join Date: Jun 2001
Location: England
Posts: 1,001
I think sir Niall dementia has said it all.

If you want to fly a jet, don't bother with any licences, go and rent one with a savvy pilot and just fly it. Probably cost you 2000-3000/ hour via net jets and no stress. Then try the spitfire, jet provost etc. Face it, going solo in these things is possible but hugely expensive and at the end of the day a first class seat in a jumbo is a far cheaper and safer way of crossing the Atlantic.

If you want a real one arm paper hanging challenge try a multi piston ir or landing a Pitts special or aTiger Moth. That will make you sweat. Any aircraft that has a pilot that has 'got your back' is just too easy to fly. For a real challenge become an instructor.

If I had 'jet money' I would buy a big mcLaren, instruct at weekends, fly at boultbee all week on their spitfire, fly my mates to Vegas on ba business class every other month and still have change for ponies horses and stuff. ( but I'm guessing you probably do all this already??).

Last edited by 18greens; 18th Jul 2017 at 22:49.
18greens is offline  
Old 18th Jul 2017, 23:23
  #27 (permalink)  
Join Date: Feb 2000
Location: UK
Posts: 13,952
I think that perhaps for our friend Batteries, this isn't about cost, ease or efficiency. It's about personal challenge and satisfaction. I get that.

Genghis the Engineer is offline  
Old 19th Jul 2017, 10:10
  #28 (permalink)  
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Posts: 51
Originally Posted by Genghis the Engineer View Post
I think that perhaps for our friend Batteries, this isn't about cost, ease or efficiency. It's about personal challenge and satisfaction. I get that.

It's all about the personal challenge. Absolutely.

I'd love to own a jet, but as the thread title suggests, I want to fly one. Hiring probably is the way I will ultimately go. I've realised since posting that I'm not actually interested in the bare minimum anymore. For me, I just want to put myself through the paces - and bring it on - to fly one. I've never been interested in "just enough"
I've decided that earning a CPL, even if I'm not going to ever fly "commercially" and studying for the ATPL's, even if I won't require their entitlements (it's all TK though) and obtaining an MCC, even though the RHS will only occupy the other half, is all worthwhile. It's the satisfaction of it. Earning those entitlements. Maintaining those ratings. Being constantly good enough to do so. Keeping myself sharp.

I crave that.

Yeah, I get flying warbirds and planes with older avionics is much more of a challenge. Maybe one day I'll be interested in that. For now, I've set my goals.

Thanks for all replies. You've all played a part in steering my decision here.
BatteriesNotIncluded is offline  
Old 19th Jul 2017, 11:26
  #29 (permalink)  
Join Date: Feb 2015
Location: Spain
Posts: 9
Go for it man, youve got to where you are by following your ideas, not everyone elses. Its not an outright dangerous or foolish idea, so if you can afford it, go for whatever makes you happy!
Drav is offline  
Old 20th Jul 2017, 00:44
  #30 (permalink)  
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: not where I want to be
Posts: 291
We've a few jets available in my part of the world, if you feel like travelling. Presently there's the odd L-29 for sale, and a friend of mine was flying one on a PPL ok (VMC only!).

My passion was never jets, I was lucky enough to fly and be 'rated' on a large machine (>5700kg) just with a PPL at the time. Given the answers you've had I'm slightly confused as to what you can do there but it seems you're taking a sensible route to fulfilling your dream, I trust it works out!

First_Principal is offline  
Old 20th Jul 2017, 09:05
  #31 (permalink)  
Join Date: May 2001
Location: Escrick York england
Posts: 1,627
Can you still fly single jet. Provest, gnat l29 on a basic ppl vfr with some sort of difference training
md 600 driver is offline  
Old 20th Jul 2017, 09:40
  #32 (permalink)  
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: UK,Twighlight Zone
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Originally Posted by md 600 driver View Post
Can you still fly single jet. Provest, gnat l29 on a basic ppl vfr with some sort of difference training
It's a type rating and they have to go onto a UK national licence.

As for the original question. To fly an SPA type rated jet you will need an IR and the Type Rating. This can be done with the IR only exams and the HPA exams or with ATPL exams. The IR would need to be an ME so done on an MEP first.

There is no need for MCC or JOC.
S-Works is offline  
Old 20th Jul 2017, 11:22
  #33 (permalink)  
Join Date: Sep 2009
Posts: 852
Start small. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PAdCt6qgj9k
Flyingmac is offline  
Old 20th Jul 2017, 12:36
  #34 (permalink)  
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: east ESSEX
Posts: 3,996
MD,Bose, it is not a type rating to fly ex-mil jets; it is an `Exemption` from the ANO,by the CAA,as outlined in CAP632.Must have an SEP or MEP,`x` hours,do an `approved course,etc,etc...
sycamore is offline  
Old 20th Jul 2017, 13:23
  #35 (permalink)  
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Originally Posted by Flyingmac View Post
BatteriesNotIncluded is offline  
Old 13th Oct 2021, 19:44
  #36 (permalink)  
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: Warwickshire
Age: 57
Posts: 35
Out of interest Batteries, still charged or gone flat?

How is your plan going?

Gazzer1uk is offline  

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