What issues need to be reported in post flight debrief? PPL student question

[MileHighPP]

Hi, I am not certain if this is the right thread to post this. As a student pilot, I am struggling with the issue of what needs to be reported. As on my recent flight QXE, I experienced severe turbulence out of nowhere, weather otherwise was almost perfect, 5 to 10kts winds and 9K vis. The result was that my passenger door flung open on C152 and had some of my paperwork that quite literally flew out fo the door. On my return, I only mentioned that I experienced some turbulence on the route and not that my stuff was flying out the door. Before that final leg I had checked that all the doors as part of the checklist. So do i need to report this or what's the scale of these reports one needs to do. Where do I find what needs to be reported and what doesn't?

[B2N2]

Well...
Severe turbulence doesn't come out of nowhere.
Clouds, wind over hills and other aircraft couod have been the reason.
If it was severe enough to pop the door I'd recommend a maintenance engineer has a look at it.
This is why I'm hesitant to fly old(er) airplanes as you never know what hasn't been reported.

[Yaw String]

I knew I shouldn't have flown that Dc3..Just asking for trouble..LOL

[JEP]

I Denmark, loosing anything (out) of an aircraft should be reported to AAIB.

We had a similiaer incident in a C150 during a CAA check ride once, the student lost his map, but what failed the student was climbing out of the CTR into the TMA without clearance.
He passed the following check ride.

[B2N2]

Originally Posted by Yaw String

I knew I shouldn't have flown that Dc3..Just asking for trouble..LOL

I was talking spam cans but yeah..you have any idea how many times that wing has been overstressed?

[MileHighPP]

Originally Posted by B2N2

Well...
Severe turbulence doesn't come out of nowhere.
Clouds, wind over hills and other aircraft couod have been the reason.
If it was severe enough to pop the door I'd recommend a maintenance engineer has a look at it.
This is why I'm hesitant to fly old(er) airplanes as you never know what hasn't been reported.

No such flight was reported but then I was on basic service and Farnborough seemed overloaded at the time by downgrading Trafic to Basic for others as I heard. I suspect it was a bad patch of air that shook the plane and that happens right on a good weather day as well?

Originally Posted by Airgus

Taimur, report in such a way that someone get a benefit out of your (bad) experience.
Today it was an event, tomorrow a coincidence and next time an accident can be prevented thanks to the reports.
In your case is up to you what to report and how. Be neutral and objective.
CAP 795 my help you as guidance

[I]Hazard identification
A hazard is any condition that can cause or contribute to an aircraft incident or
accident. A hazard identification process enables the collecting, recording, ........
industry trade associations or the CAA Safety Plan.
Safety Reporting
A confidential reporting system should be established to encourage safety reporting. This
should be supported with a just culture providing appropriate protection for the reporter.
This should also include an effective feedback process to the individual and to the wider
organisation where appropriate. This approach should encourage staff at all levels to
proactively report errors, near misses and hazards.
Staff need to have confidence in the just culture and the reporting system. They must
know that confidentiality will be maintained and that the information they submit will be
acted upon, otherwise they will decide that there is no benefit in their reporting.

Have a coffee break with your instructor and explain your concern...

I was thinking that but I also msg my old instructor who's flying to a major airline now as a PIC. He said this has happened before on C152's. I'll definitely have a chat with my instructor tomorrow. Though I don't want to be penalized for not reporting it sooner!

[Intruder]

Originally Posted by taimur

As a student pilot, I am struggling with the issue of what needs to be reported. . .
So do i need to report this or what's the scale of these reports one needs to do. Where do I find what needs to be reported and what doesn't?

Since you are a student pilot, your best resource is your flight instructor. You should have sought him out IMMEDIATELY after the flight and told him the situation IN DETAIL. Then you should have discussed what needed to be done in your case, and the thresholds for formal reports.

If you do NOT consider your instructor as your best resource, then you need to find a new instructor.

[B2N2]

There is no such thing as bad air.
Try and visualize aerodynamics as if they were hydrodynamics and consider air to behave like water.
Currents and up and down drafts can certainly be caused by wind over terrain. Just visualize water flowing.
Another ship ( airplane) will leave disturbed air behind.
I'm suspecting you may just have hit a strong thermal.
Everytiing has a cause and effect.
Nothing comes out of nowhere being just 'bad air'.
It's ok. Don't feel bad.
But do still talk to your instructor about it.
This is why you're a student pilot.
You're learning.

[Sillert,V.I.]

If a correctly-latched door came open in flight, I'd report it to maintenance.

[ETOPS]

I once dived a Cessna 150 to VNE, as part of the old C of A test flight, and both doors popped open simultaneously

As my observer was the engineer who had signed the aircraft as fit to fly I was able to "report" instantly.

As everyone here suggests - let your instructor know any concerns you have, you are unlikely to be the first student to experience these incidents.

[Martin_123]

I also have experience of c150 doors opening up mid flight, doesn't take much of a bump for some of them

[noflynomore]

Moral of the story, don't tuck anything against the door.
Makes you jump though, doesn't it? I don't think it is at all uncommon in small Cessnas.

[Gertrude the Wombat]

Originally Posted by Sillert,V.I.

If a correctly-latched door came open in flight, I'd report it to maintenance.

C'mon, this was a 152, they do that. Not a big deal, student should have been warned before being sent solo (if it hadn't previously happened in a dual lesson).


That is, not a big deal provided that the student had been briefed on how to deal with it, as people have killed themselves faffing around trying to shut doors unnecessarily whilst their attention should have been on more important things.


Unexpected turbulence, report to instructor, try to work out why it happened, and how to improve the chances of it not being unexpected next time.


Stuff falling out of an aircraft needs reporting, at least to the instructor if not the CAA, surely?

Oh, and, when you've got your licence, if you take passengers in a 152 the passenger briefing includes:


"If your door comes open, do let me know, but don't worry about it. The door is, after all, only there to keep the draught off - it's the seat belt that stops you falling out."

[n5296s]

The door is, after all, only there to keep the draught off - it's the seat belt that stops you falling out.

Gravity plays a role too. Though it's probably best to avoid RH knife edges even with a seat belt.

I was always under the impression that the airflow in flight tended to keep the doors shut rather than open - though I've never tried to open them.

I rather like the idea of bad air, just hanging around on the airborne equivalent of street corners waiting for some unsuspecting pilot to come along so it can trip it up while whistling an innocent tune.

[Gertrude the Wombat]

Originally Posted by n5296s

I was always under the impression that the airflow in flight tended to keep the doors shut rather than open - though I've never tried to open them.

152 doors hang open an inch or so in the slipstream, and it's part of the forced landing preparation to open the doors before touchdown (so you don't get burnt to death through lack of being able to force open a jammed bent door).


The same is officially true of 172 doors but, unlike in a 152, I haven't actually had a 172 door come spontaneously open on me, so I don't have any personal experience of flying them with a door open.

[Maoraigh1]

Severe turbulence doesn't come out of nowhere.

I know something causes it, but I sometimes encounter it where I didn't expect it and can't figure out what caused it.

[Gertrude the Wombat]

Originally Posted by Maoraigh1

I know something causes it, but I sometimes encounter it where I didn't expect it and can't figure out what caused it.

I had ATC explain it to me once, after a go-around! - "with the wind in that [unusual] direction you can get a lot of turbulence on the threshold from such-and-such landscape features, suggest you land long", which worked fine.

[MileHighPP]

Originally Posted by Gertrude the Wombat

C'mon, this was a 152, they do that. Not a big deal, student should have been warned before being sent solo (if it hadn't previously happened in a dual lesson).

Stuff falling out of an aircraft needs reporting, at least to the instructor if not the CAA, surely?

It was my papers so nothing heavy. Good, I had my phone in the back and map in between the seats. Without those, I would have had to ask Farnborough for headings back to base.

It never happened before so was the first thought I have been told about this on C152s. reminder to keep stuff tucked away.

[tmmorris]

I'm not very good at aerodynamics but surely the Bernoulli effect would tend to suck the doors open, but not very far as the slipstream would then push them shut? So the default position would be just cracked open a bit. My own experience with C152 doors would bear that out.

[Maoraigh1]

I'm not high hours on C150/152, but over 30 years of occasionally renting them I've never experienced or heard of a door problem.
I have experienced a Pa28 door opening in flight, due to top latch not catching.