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Flying England to Stockholm

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Flying England to Stockholm

Old 14th Mar 2016, 15:29
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Flying England to Stockholm

Hi Guys,

I am planning one of the longer routes that I have flown to date, taking off from Biggin Hill, and landing somewhere very close to Stockholm.

I will be flying an arrow, which cruises around 130/135kts with long range tanks. I am not crazy enough (or just not suicidal) to fly over the North Sea, and really its much more fun to fly over the coast. My plan would be flying across The Channel, into Belgium (Oostend area), and then follow the coast up through the Netherlands, Germany, Denmark and finally Sweden.

I will need to stop around 3hours / 3hours30mins in, for food, loo, a bit of a break, and maybe some fuel. This amount of time in the air would put me somewhere around North Germany, somewhere which I believe is called Schleswig-Holstein (north of Hamburg, up to Sylt / Flensburg area). Having never been there, let alone flown there.

Can anyone please recommend somewhere to land around Schleswig-Holstein area for a good lunch, with cheap (ish) fuel, cheap(ish) landing fees, no (crazy) handling fees, somewhere we could sit outside if sunny not far from the airfield (as we get another 3+hours after lunch). In that area? I would need around 750m grass, or much less if on a hard runway.

Later on in the flight, we would want to land as close to Stockholm as possible, does anyone fly around there? I have contacted Bromma (ESSB) as a backup should we require to land at an airport with ILS / instrument approach procedures, but having been told that it would cost €250 just for handling and €90 odd Euros for parking for 4 days, I would (surprisingly) be VERY keen to stay away from these kind of fees if at all possible. [The funny thing is that the airport fee is only €32 including navigation fee (which is on top of what I was quoted) weird how they are legally able to do that!] Does anyone know if there is still an aeroclub or maintenance facility or person based there? Could they sort out the handling for us? Alternatively - I have seen that there is an airfield called Ska Edeby, which is quite close, does anyone know what that place is like? Does it have any fuel there?

I would much rather land somewhere nice and welcoming than a boring faceless airport, but should the clouds close in on us, we'd need to go somewhere - preferably not where they rob you in plain daylight!

Also on a side note - I was thinking of perhaps attempting to do a touch and go in every country on the way to Stockholm, perhaps as a little feature added to an incredible trip. Does anyone know how that works? Do we first need to land at a customs airport, and then touch and go everywhere? Would we be able to pay them by phone? How does this work?

ALSO : anyone recommend particular things that we must see from the air on the way, please let me know!

Any suggestions much appreciated!
Best
Alex90

Last edited by alex90; 14th Mar 2016 at 15:30. Reason: added an ALSO
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Old 14th Mar 2016, 22:26
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Join Date: Feb 2007
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Your first stop on mainland Europe should be a customs airport. I would recommend Texel (EHTX) which has ~1100m well-maintained grass. Very friendly, good restaurant, customs available (check AIP and website for customs availability; best to call in advance anyway).

If you intend to follow the coast all the way, beware of the restricted zone near Vlieland, EH-R4. If it's active (weekdays, but check NOTAMs for weekend activations as well) it's better to remain south of the EHKD CTR, then cross from Den Oever to Kornwerderzand and proceed to the coast again by way of Ameland (EHAL).

A significant portion of the Dutch leg will be underneath the Schiphol TMA, which starts at 1500' (class A). But that part of the country is mostly below sealevel so 1000' AMSL is considered normal & safe.

Further down the route, a lot of the German islands actually have airfields as well. Hopping from island to island is an extremely scenic route to get to Denmark.
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Old 14th Mar 2016, 23:31
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Thanks BackPacker,

Really appreciate the insight. I have already flown into Schiphol, and personally am really happy at 1000', I was hoping on doing most of the "near land" bits around 1500' to 2500' or below on the way there, I am there to enjoy the flight and the wonderful scenery - not just to get from A to B! :-)

I'll plan south of EHKD, and bear in mind EH-R4 as well. But I am no stranger to request transit clearances from Military &/ controlled zones!

Thanks for the tip for EHTX, I was hoping to stop a little further along the route as you may have guessed - but will most definitely bear it in mind!

I was planning on following the islands, so I guess that this is a good decision! Thanks for the tips!!

Best
alex
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Old 15th Mar 2016, 09:12
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Originally Posted by alex90 View Post
Thanks BackPacker,

Really appreciate the insight. I have already flown into Schiphol, and personally am really happy at 1000', I was hoping on doing most of the "near land" bits around 1500' to 2500' or below on the way there, I am there to enjoy the flight and the wonderful scenery - not just to get from A to B! :-)

I'll plan south of EHKD, and bear in mind EH-R4 as well. But I am no stranger to request transit clearances from Military &/ controlled zones!

Thanks for the tip for EHTX, I was hoping to stop a little further along the route as you may have guessed - but will most definitely bear it in mind!

I was planning on following the islands, so I guess that this is a good decision! Thanks for the tips!!

Best
alex
I did this trip about three years ago, from Yorkshire. Our first leg was to Texel, to clear customs. In Sweden, I would strongly recommend Vasteras airport, which Ryanair use for Stockholm. It is a moderate bus ride into Stockholm, but excellent facilities for GA, Avgas, and if you join as a temporary member of Vasteras flying club, the landing fees may well be waived.

Last edited by A le Ron; 15th Mar 2016 at 09:14. Reason: Typo
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Old 15th Mar 2016, 11:01
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But I am no stranger to request transit clearances from Military &/ controlled zones!
The issue with R4 is that it will be very hard to impossible to get a clearance through, if they are active.

At the moment Dutch Mil Info (your initial contact if you'd want a crossing) is severely understaffed. Between managing IFR and VFR military traffic, and IFR civil traffic in their TMA, they won't have time to provide FIS or crossing services for VFR GA traffic.

And even if you manage to get through and transferred to the local range controller for the Vliehors (the shooting range on Vlieland and the main reason for R4), then they may not be able to fit you in. There's F16s there doing low-level bombing runs, sometimes with live ammunition.

So in case of EH-R4 it's best for all concerned if you don't try to cross, but plan to circumnavigate.

BTW there's a big military exercise ("Frisian Flag") coming up in a few weeks time. During that time, large parts of Dutch airspace, particularly in the North, will be off-limits to civil aircraft. There is a whole AIC on that subject. Check your NOTAMs! And if you happen to be transiting during that exercise, you may want to plan your route no further north than approximately the line Rotterdam-Zwolle.
https://www.defensie.nl/english/orga...sian-flag-2016
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Old 15th Mar 2016, 13:03
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Here's another vote for Vasteras, a lovely town in a beautiful Lakeland landscape. The pumps take regular credit cards and I've never been charged for landing or parking.

There is a train to Stockholm although the bus is cheaper and some say quicker!

Skavsta has good bus connections to Stockholm timed for Ryanair flights and a hotel right on the airport, but it is expensive and has friendly but deeply irritating security. In the North, Gavle is about 1 1/2 hours from Stockholm by train and (a couple of yeasrs ago) no landing charges, but no busses either.

I've stopped many times at Bromma and there's no more spectacular way to visit Stockholm than to land there. But apart from the charges which I've not bothered to investigate recently, they also have some pre-reservation nonsense for parking which means you have to pay even if you don't go. Bromma is a Swedish tragedy.

HOWEVER, By far the most convenient way to visit Stockholm is to fly on to Finland landing at the fantastic and soon to be gone Malmi airport. (Less than 3Hrs from Vasteras by PA-28). From there it's a 25 min cab ride to the harbour and the cruise ferry 'Baltic Serenade' which leaves around 5pm and arrives Stockholm around 9 the following morning, within walking distance of the Vasa. You keep your cabin for the round trip which has similar return timings, all for less than one night in a Hotel!!!

Edited to add that a nice mid way stop would be St Peter Ording EDXO, a lovely field with modest fees and a nice restaurant. But I've no idea about customs there - I always land at Texel first.

Regarding R4 ('Cornfield approach'), Texel usually have a good idea of what's going on there and will ring them up for you. I've never had a problem getting through there but I don't know anything about the exercises mentioned above and there's a first time for everything...

Last edited by Victorian; 15th Mar 2016 at 13:30.
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Old 16th Mar 2016, 11:30
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Sweden Trip Report

I came across this...it goes a little bit further than Stockholm, but a good read.
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Old 16th Mar 2016, 12:33
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I can heartily recommend Marcus at Air Ace at Groningen Eelde airport for refuelling and handling. They can also pick up a delicious packed lunch for you if you're tight on time, and have excellent coffee. If you choose to stay in Groningen, it's a quiet, pretty academic town with lots of pleasant bars and eateries. It's also just south of the main military operations areas which makes navigating the restricted areas somewhat easier. It's about 10 minutes by air from the German border.
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Old 16th Mar 2016, 18:50
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Alex

I started flying at ESSB, Bromma when I was 19. Back in those days it was a brilliant mixed used field with both small and big iron in a happy mix. Then the GA hating politicians got in control and today the capital is a disastrous mess. They have kicked out everyone from GA except airlines and shut down Barkarby (ESKB) and Tullinge (ESCN), two brilliant GA fields. Now there is nowhere to land in the capital for GA unless you want to pay Grafair's ESSB handling and highway robbery prices.

Except one little grass field.

Skå-Edeby (ESSE) is a grass field with very cheap landing and parking fees just outside of ESSB. Might be a good option if you don't mind grass. In the spring the grass can get a bit water logged, so best is to call and ask beforehand.
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Old 16th Mar 2016, 21:06
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For somewhere a little out of the ordinary en route you might like to think of Helgoland-Dune EDXH. It has a good restaurant and a side benefit is that avgas is tax free, hence significantly cheaper than Netherlands and mainland Germany.

If you have time to spare you can walk round the whole island of Dune in less than an hour which will provide a close view of several hundred seals and numerous sea birds. Crossing to the main island will take somewhat longer because of the need to catch a ferry.

Not the longest of runways, 480m tarmac and it looks like the ramp can become very congested at weekends in the holiday season. Well worth the visit in my opinion or even an overflight if you can fit it in.
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Old 17th Mar 2016, 21:54
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Thanks everyone,

Really appreciate the suggestions!

Tagron - I looked at EDXH, it looked like a really nice place. Being 4 in the arrow, and ideally wanting to get full fuel (with long range tanks), I would need to check the takeoff charts to make sure that we'd be able to takeoff safely from 480m. My gut feeling says its too short.

AdamFrisch - oh that sounds like it used to be wonderful... I fear Biggin Hill is trying to edge that way more and more each year. I still don't understand the motivation to do so, neither from a personal or business objective. Kicking out the GA doesn't mean you'll get more jet business, it just means you'll become another boring faceless airport amongst the hundreds! Anyway - I contacted the airport themselves, and said that they would be able to accept me, and not require me to go through a handling agent. I think the charges came down to around 600 SEK for 48 hours parking and landing. This will most likely be my backup should weather close in, or should Ska Edeby not be suitable for landing. I have seen Ska Vallentuna a little further north - have you been there?

Taybird - I'll keep that one in mind! I would be really keen to at least get a good 3 hours run before making my first stop which would put me a bit further East - but should weather or plans change - definitely bear it in mind! Thanks.

FloppyLink - Thanks for that. I enjoyed reading it!! Gave me a little insight!

Victorian & A Le Ron - Thanks for that. I hadn't considered Vasteras because we'll be staying with a friend who lives just outside Stockholm (South East I believe). The bus ride I've been told is a good 2hours to 2hours30, then from central Stockholm, it would be another 45minutes to my friend's house which I think would just be too much travelling for me. I really liked your idea of taking the ferry - I think I may well just do that one day! Perhaps not this time though.

Backpacker - Yes, I will definitely plan to fly around it. I would give them a call on the phone if I wanted to shave some time off my route but that prior to flight! I won't be flying until a little later in the year when the weather is a little bit better and less unpredictable.

Thanks again for all this, I really appreciate it!
Alex
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Old 18th Mar 2016, 12:06
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Glad the information was helpful. If you do decide on Ska Edeby, perhaps you could let us know. I've not been able to contact anyone there on the occasions I've looked into it. I did discover there's a bus stop nearby.

But at that price Bromma would be your best option. Just watch the time of day - the taxi ride into town can take longer than the train from Vasteras! Maybe there are buses there now.
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Old 19th Mar 2016, 22:59
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I have not landed in Vallentuna, but it's a good field. A friend's father used to keep (and maybe still does) his old DC-3 there! Vallentuna is reasonably close to Stockholm - you can be in town in about 1hr.

You can chose not to use Grafair at ESSB and because I just checked, the prices are as follows:

Landing 250 Skr.
Parking 281 Skr/24hr period.

But they do charge you a to- and from apron fee of 450 Skr (you're not allowed to walk), which is kinda criminal. But all in all, perhaps worth it for a shorter visit. Would put it around 1000 Skr if you stay one day, which is compared to many other airports in Europe not that bad. Parking will for sure be cheaper at Skå Edeby if you plan on extended stay...
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Old 19th Mar 2016, 23:11
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I fly quite often from Fairoaks to Oslo, and stop for Avgas at EDWI.
Customs AirPort although the hey new show up and ILS equipped Aerodrome and Good Resto at the flying club on the ramp!
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Old 20th Mar 2016, 21:49
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Another vote for Västerås outside Stockholm. They have a couple of Hunters, an Invader, some Texans and lots of other goodies for you to ogle while you're there, too

On the way there, Groningen is a good stop. Great food there. EDXW Sylt is another beautiful place. In the summer the place feels almost Mediterranean.

EKRK, Roskilde, just outside Copenhagen, is also a nice place to stop, with good food.

If you want to take a detour on the way home, pop into Norway, and visit me at ENKJ, Kjeller, outside Oslo. We have quite a decent aircraft collection, with Tiger Moths, one of three flying PT-19s in Europe, and Europe's only flying Norseman, among other goodies. It's a 40-minute flight down to the Swedish border, and you're on your way home again.

PM me if you need any details

Last edited by semmern; 21st Mar 2016 at 21:34.
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Old 14th Apr 2016, 13:19
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…and if you're likely to end up at Siljansnäs, PM me as well.

We're here at the moment - It was almost 20 degrees outside two days ago. Today it's snowing.
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Old 14th Apr 2016, 19:00
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The island of Sylt EDXW has customs (on request, 2 hour notice according to AIP). That should be round about in the middle of your trip. You could have lunch where wealthy Germans fancy their vacations. :-)
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