How often do you practice emergencies?
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How often do you practice emergencies?
Inspired by the EFATO thread, a general question, with some sub-parts!
How often do you as a PPL/CPL/little-flying-machine-pilot practice emergencies. For example...
- PFL
- Stall recovery in cruise
- Stall recovery from a simulated approach
- Cable break
- Fire
- EFATO
- Inadvertent flight into IMC?
- Anything else?
And which emergencies do you practice?
I'll kick-off:
- PFL about once per month
- Range of stalls every 1-2 months (more if I'm teaching them)
- Don't fly gliders, so don't do cable breaks
- Fire drills every couple of months
- EFATO from a PFL co-around maybe every third month, EFATO from the runway maybe twice per year (again, more if I'm teaching them).
- Flapless approach every 2-3 months
G
How often do you as a PPL/CPL/little-flying-machine-pilot practice emergencies. For example...
- PFL
- Stall recovery in cruise
- Stall recovery from a simulated approach
- Cable break
- Fire
- EFATO
- Inadvertent flight into IMC?
- Anything else?
And which emergencies do you practice?
I'll kick-off:
- PFL about once per month
- Range of stalls every 1-2 months (more if I'm teaching them)
- Don't fly gliders, so don't do cable breaks
- Fire drills every couple of months
- EFATO from a PFL co-around maybe every third month, EFATO from the runway maybe twice per year (again, more if I'm teaching them).
- Flapless approach every 2-3 months
G
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twive
PFL: I think about them, but not a lot. However, this was a subject we covered during our last sim. session.
Stalls - These are to be covered in our next session.
Cable Breaks: N/A
Fire: Considered mentally every day. Tested once a year.
EFATA: Considered and briefed every flight, even if just one word. Tested twice a year.
Inadvertent IMC: Every circling approach.
Anything else: Emergency stops, Go-arounds considered and briefed every flight. Handling of minor problems considered and sometimes discussed.
Other Emergencies: We work our way through all that can be imagined (either by instructor's or ourselves) over a period of a few years.
PM
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If you don't teach these, I guess not very often :
I tend to do these only when getting checked out in a new airplane, when doing a check ride, or when doing a biannual. This gives an average of about once every 6-9 months for me.
- Engine Out (i.e. PFL or Feathering one)
- Stall recovery in cruise
- Stall recovery from a simulated approach
- Fire
- EFATO
+ Departure Stall
+ VMC demo
+ Vacuum Pump Failure (i.e. a partial panel)
+ GPS failure
I tend to do these only when getting checked out in a new airplane, when doing a check ride, or when doing a biannual. This gives an average of about once every 6-9 months for me.
- Engine Out (i.e. PFL or Feathering one)
- Stall recovery in cruise
- Stall recovery from a simulated approach
- Fire
- EFATO
+ Departure Stall
+ VMC demo
+ Vacuum Pump Failure (i.e. a partial panel)
+ GPS failure
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Good day,
Well, my instructor banged the lever to idle a few times, teaching me to try only 1 engine "re-start"; and to then concentrate on a suitable landing spot while flying the airplane at all time!
For fire it would be similar, albeit with power.
In my microlight we never practised stalls as we simply don't know the aircraft well enough.
In my new aircraft I'd love to give that a regular go.....
My old plane didn't have flaps so I guess the new one would fly a similar landing speed with 0 degrees flap. I will practise that in due time.
Brake failure I recently practised.....as my brake lever failed.
GPS failure, well we fly local flights without GPS anyway and for X-country I have 3 independant GPS's installed. Plus, we fly visual so I'd make my way home.
I have a double Pitot tube; but I guess I'd like to practise a landing without air speed indicator.
Anything else you could recommend for a Rotax 914 LSA with glass cockpit!??
###Ultra Long Hauler###
Well, my instructor banged the lever to idle a few times, teaching me to try only 1 engine "re-start"; and to then concentrate on a suitable landing spot while flying the airplane at all time!
For fire it would be similar, albeit with power.
In my microlight we never practised stalls as we simply don't know the aircraft well enough.
In my new aircraft I'd love to give that a regular go.....
My old plane didn't have flaps so I guess the new one would fly a similar landing speed with 0 degrees flap. I will practise that in due time.
Brake failure I recently practised.....as my brake lever failed.
GPS failure, well we fly local flights without GPS anyway and for X-country I have 3 independant GPS's installed. Plus, we fly visual so I'd make my way home.
I have a double Pitot tube; but I guess I'd like to practise a landing without air speed indicator.
Anything else you could recommend for a Rotax 914 LSA with glass cockpit!??
###Ultra Long Hauler###
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Thread Starter
In my microlight we never practised stalls as we simply don't know the aircraft well enough.
Anything else you could recommend for a Rotax 914 LSA with glass cockpit!
G
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- PFL - every couple of months, more if I remember, but rarely to the airfield i.e. all the way down. Must try harder.
- Stall recovery in cruise - twice a year? not very often
- Stall recovery from a simulated approach ditto, always when I do stall recovery in cruise
- Cable break N/A
- Fire - never, must get one of my passengers to surprise me
- EFATO (Engine Failure After Take-Off) - rarely
- Inadvertent flight into IMC? - never but I am IMC rated and fly regularly on instruments so a non-event. The real issue for me is decision making (when do I accept that I am not in VMC, what do I do) which is best practised in practice...
- Anything else?
Tim
- Stall recovery in cruise - twice a year? not very often
- Stall recovery from a simulated approach ditto, always when I do stall recovery in cruise
- Cable break N/A
- Fire - never, must get one of my passengers to surprise me
- EFATO (Engine Failure After Take-Off) - rarely
- Inadvertent flight into IMC? - never but I am IMC rated and fly regularly on instruments so a non-event. The real issue for me is decision making (when do I accept that I am not in VMC, what do I do) which is best practised in practice...
- Anything else?
Tim
- PFL
Maybe once a month - it's what I do when I want to go flying and don't have anything in particular I want to do. Find an empty airport (Marina, KOAR, works great), pull the power a few miles out, aim to land on the numbers, then a couple more times from the pattern.
- Stall recovery in cruise
Non event in my plane. Do them every now and then anyway. SOP for any kind of checkout in the acro planes I fly.
- Stall recovery from a simulated approach
Also a non event. Did plenty of them during my CPL training and confirmed they're a non event.
- Cable break
Not sure how you'd actually practice for this.
- Fire
Ditto. Did plenty of emergency descents during CPL training. They're quite fun.
- EFATO (Engine Failure After Take-Off)
You mean "impossible turns"? 'Cos otherwise it's just "land straight ahead" which isn't really that hard! I've been working on those lately, more out of curiosity to see what is really possible.
- Inadvertent flight into IMC?
How would you practice this? Do you mean recurrent instrument training? Of course with an IR I do this anyway.
- Anything else?
Spins - usually do one on the way back home in the Pitts. Good way to lose a bit of altitude.
Autorotations - most times when I fly the heli.
Maybe once a month - it's what I do when I want to go flying and don't have anything in particular I want to do. Find an empty airport (Marina, KOAR, works great), pull the power a few miles out, aim to land on the numbers, then a couple more times from the pattern.
- Stall recovery in cruise
Non event in my plane. Do them every now and then anyway. SOP for any kind of checkout in the acro planes I fly.
- Stall recovery from a simulated approach
Also a non event. Did plenty of them during my CPL training and confirmed they're a non event.
- Cable break
Not sure how you'd actually practice for this.
- Fire
Ditto. Did plenty of emergency descents during CPL training. They're quite fun.
- EFATO (Engine Failure After Take-Off)
You mean "impossible turns"? 'Cos otherwise it's just "land straight ahead" which isn't really that hard! I've been working on those lately, more out of curiosity to see what is really possible.
- Inadvertent flight into IMC?
How would you practice this? Do you mean recurrent instrument training? Of course with an IR I do this anyway.
- Anything else?
Spins - usually do one on the way back home in the Pitts. Good way to lose a bit of altitude.
Autorotations - most times when I fly the heli.
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In my microlight we never practised stalls as we simply don't know the aircraft well enough.
As an instructor, these emergencies are taught or demonstrated once a week at least, a lot of pilots do not practice on their own a lot though. A lot of the biannial flights I do are the only PFL that pilot will do in 2 years, no matter how much I ask them to practice more often.
I often teach students when returning from a nav to postition overhead the field and perform a PFL - subject to traffic obviously. There is no reason why a licence holder could not do this every other flight, keeping their judgement of the glide range sharp, and getting used to gliding it in in different wind conditions with the option of a go around if need be.
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PFL - Every 3/4 months probably, I practise the drills often when I get time in an aircraft before the flight, but I do need to fly them more often.
Stall recovery in cruise - If I'm carrying a passenger who wants be shown what a stall looks and feels like I'll demonstrate it (once or twice a month...)
Stall recovery from a simulated approach - Couple of times a year.
Cable break - N/A
Fire - I make sure I'm confident in doing all the drills.
EFATO - Every club check out
Inadvertent flight into IMC - I do need to book a flight with an instructor to get a bit more instrument time.
Never thought about doing that (mainly because parachuting where I fly prevents many overhead joins). Will give that a go traffic permitting!
Stall recovery in cruise - If I'm carrying a passenger who wants be shown what a stall looks and feels like I'll demonstrate it (once or twice a month...)
Stall recovery from a simulated approach - Couple of times a year.
Cable break - N/A
Fire - I make sure I'm confident in doing all the drills.
EFATO - Every club check out
Inadvertent flight into IMC - I do need to book a flight with an instructor to get a bit more instrument time.
There is no reason why a licence holder could not do this every other flight, keeping their judgement of the glide range sharp, and getting used to gliding it in in different wind conditions with the option of a go around if need be.
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What about Flap failure or Flap control failure (so full flaps when you don't want them / no flaps when you want them). Obviously you need a long enough runway depending on the plane...
What about Clean stalls vs full flap stalls (or is that what you mean by stall recovery from a simulated approach?).
What about taking emergency avoiding action (fun to get a passenger to suddenly say "F16 approaching 12 o'clock") - should ensure that turning right 90deg at a v.high bank angle is instinctive (although I suspect it is more fun in the bulldog than a PA28).
Since I'm still doing my PPL I can't talk about currency (as my instructor has me doing most of them regularly and has recently had me going out on my own to practice PFLs, stalls, etc) but to me practising clean and full flap stalls is a non-event also. I'm not sure why some people seem scared of them?
What about Clean stalls vs full flap stalls (or is that what you mean by stall recovery from a simulated approach?).
What about taking emergency avoiding action (fun to get a passenger to suddenly say "F16 approaching 12 o'clock") - should ensure that turning right 90deg at a v.high bank angle is instinctive (although I suspect it is more fun in the bulldog than a PA28).
Since I'm still doing my PPL I can't talk about currency (as my instructor has me doing most of them regularly and has recently had me going out on my own to practice PFLs, stalls, etc) but to me practising clean and full flap stalls is a non-event also. I'm not sure why some people seem scared of them?
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- PFL -2 months
- Stall recovery in cruise -2 months
- Stall recovery from a simulated approach -2 months
- Cable break N/A
- Fire -Think it through every flight
- EFATO (Engine Failure After Take-Off) -2 months
- Inadvertent flight into IMC? - When I can
Rod1
- Stall recovery in cruise -2 months
- Stall recovery from a simulated approach -2 months
- Cable break N/A
- Fire -Think it through every flight
- EFATO (Engine Failure After Take-Off) -2 months
- Inadvertent flight into IMC? - When I can
Rod1
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How do you propose to get to know the aircraft better if you do not fly at the lower speed ranges? The microlights I have flown have the most docile stall characteristics I've ever encountered, nothing to get worried about. If you're unsure then book some time with an instructor.
My instructor did them alone, but when we started flying it together we obviously concentrated on circuits, landings etc. I asked for a stall once or twice, but by the time I got to solo-ing etc; plans changed and the engine went from this plane into another; and a new airframe was purchased.
My instructor did point out that he would not be comfortable doing stalls in the home-built kit because he did not "know" the strength of the airframe / wings . I´m not sure about the details……will ask when I´m back.
Now with the new project--> we will definitely be doing stalls!!
Aero patriot Industria Aeronáutica
###Ultra Long Hauler###
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I have to say ULH, that I think your instructor is I think a bit misguided. Nobody should be doing circuits in an aeroplane they don't understand the low speed handling of. If either the low speed handling or structural strength are suspect then it probably shouldn't be flown at-all, and certainly not used for teaching.
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G
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Last weekend I did a PFL, the first one since Sept last year. I made a right mess of it, and had it have been for real would probably have ended up in heap.
I intend practicing them more frequently from now on.
I intend practicing them more frequently from now on.
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- PFL - Every second landing or so I try do do as a PFL if traffic permits. And from different heights, positions, alternating left/right hand patterns as to not get used to a specific path, windeffect or similar.
- Stall recovery in cruise - A bit of a non event in my aircraft, but I do every now an then a few stalls in different configurations and attitudes.
- Stall recovery from a simulated approach - See above.
- Cable break - Actually I was thinking of control cables here rather than towing cables. Yes, sometimes I pretend that either my rudder, elevator or ailerons has failed, and try do do the circuit without any input with the selected controls.
- Fire - When I do PFL's I try to "surprise" myself with different reasons for the engine failure. Sometimes it happens to be an engine fire. After a simulated shutdown I also go through different smoke scenarios that requires excercising of the vents, cabin heat, and maybe sideslipping.
- EFATO - If we're talking about engine failure just after rotation I don't do this as my normal field is a bit too short to do it safely. In the climb-out I try to think about an engine failure every time but rarely practise unless I fly as an instructor. I think the excercise is a bit pointless whithout the surprise factor. At my regular field I have my well briefed emergency fields for this event.
- Inadvertent flight into IMC? - I fly IFR regularly.
- Anything else?
When I haven't flown for a while I use to do a couple of circuits. At least once I make a balked landing at a late stage. I've more than once had to do this for real at my uncontrolled strip due to people or animals (mostly deers) crossing the runway. My current aircraft doesn't have any flaps but otherwise that would be included in my own refresher as well.
I absolutely agree. I've been doing a few refresher flights with people flying like this and the results is inevitably that they fly the approach and landing with far too high speeds and making very long landings.
- Stall recovery in cruise - A bit of a non event in my aircraft, but I do every now an then a few stalls in different configurations and attitudes.
- Stall recovery from a simulated approach - See above.
- Cable break - Actually I was thinking of control cables here rather than towing cables. Yes, sometimes I pretend that either my rudder, elevator or ailerons has failed, and try do do the circuit without any input with the selected controls.
- Fire - When I do PFL's I try to "surprise" myself with different reasons for the engine failure. Sometimes it happens to be an engine fire. After a simulated shutdown I also go through different smoke scenarios that requires excercising of the vents, cabin heat, and maybe sideslipping.
- EFATO - If we're talking about engine failure just after rotation I don't do this as my normal field is a bit too short to do it safely. In the climb-out I try to think about an engine failure every time but rarely practise unless I fly as an instructor. I think the excercise is a bit pointless whithout the surprise factor. At my regular field I have my well briefed emergency fields for this event.
- Inadvertent flight into IMC? - I fly IFR regularly.
- Anything else?
When I haven't flown for a while I use to do a couple of circuits. At least once I make a balked landing at a late stage. I've more than once had to do this for real at my uncontrolled strip due to people or animals (mostly deers) crossing the runway. My current aircraft doesn't have any flaps but otherwise that would be included in my own refresher as well.
Nobody should be doing circuits in an aeroplane they don't understand the low speed handling of.
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As somebody else pointed out, not frequently enough.
- PFL - probably every 3 or 4 months - out in the wild, rather than at an airfield. I do very regularly review possible fields as I cruise.
- Stall recovery in cruise
- Stall recovery from a simulated approach. Both rarely - stalls are pretty much a non-event, and I fell comfortable with the recovery. Probably means I ought to do more
- Cable break - N/A
- Fire. This one worries me, and I want to review at my next biennial
- EFATO (Engine Failure After Take-Off) - not enough! Mind not a lot to do except look for something ahead, or within 30 degrees
- Inadvertent flight into IMC? Not really thought about this for a while - probably another for the biennial
- Anything else? Frequently think through scenarios when I cant fly
- PFL - probably every 3 or 4 months - out in the wild, rather than at an airfield. I do very regularly review possible fields as I cruise.
- Stall recovery in cruise
- Stall recovery from a simulated approach. Both rarely - stalls are pretty much a non-event, and I fell comfortable with the recovery. Probably means I ought to do more
- Cable break - N/A
- Fire. This one worries me, and I want to review at my next biennial
- EFATO (Engine Failure After Take-Off) - not enough! Mind not a lot to do except look for something ahead, or within 30 degrees
- Inadvertent flight into IMC? Not really thought about this for a while - probably another for the biennial
- Anything else? Frequently think through scenarios when I cant fly