What can you do with a CPL?
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What can you do with a CPL?
Hi learned peoples!
I know the question sounds silly, but what jobs can you actually get with a CPL (Apart from FI)?
I've looked around, and it seems that every employer requires an ATPL, is there actually any employability that comes with a CPL?
Thanks in advance for your answers!
WH
I know the question sounds silly, but what jobs can you actually get with a CPL (Apart from FI)?
I've looked around, and it seems that every employer requires an ATPL, is there actually any employability that comes with a CPL?
Thanks in advance for your answers!
WH
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CPL for?
As I am sure that you already know in an ideal world there would be, air taxi, banner towing, agricultural, parachute dropping and aerial survey in addition to pleasure flying on an AOC A to A or A to B and of course as you mentioned flight training but the openings are so few and far between that it is practically nil.
It is not the place it was and the legislation is gradually killing the various operations. But then that is probably part of the plan to get open skies without us cluttering it up for scheduled stuff.
It is not the place it was and the legislation is gradually killing the various operations. But then that is probably part of the plan to get open skies without us cluttering it up for scheduled stuff.
I've looked around, and it seems that every employer requires an ATPL
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Whopity, that's what I understood too. What is commonly referred to as a "frozen ATPL" is just a CPL+MCC+IR+ME+Type Rating+all ATPL theory exams passed. But technically it's just a CPL.
You use that to build your hours and once you get to a certain number (I thought 1500? But it might be 500 too.) the whole lot is converted ("unfrozen") into an ATPL.
So yes, with a CPL you can fly RHS of an airliner but if it's just a CPL you have no hope of ever becoming the captain, and without that outlook there's not a lot of airlines that will take you on board.
So if your intention is to become a career pilot, then an ATPL is virtually the only viable option. However, I know quite a few guys (and girls) who only have a CPL and do various odd jobs next to their main (non-aviation) job, and are having a tremendous time. Flight instruction is of course the biggest example, but also a lot of banner towing, parachute dropping, sightseeing flights and so forth are done by people with just a CPL. And they got that CPL, amongst other reasons, so they didn't have to 'cost share' every time but could get their flying, at the very least, reimbursed fully. And maybe make some money to pay for the trip to the airfield and the beer afterwards.
You use that to build your hours and once you get to a certain number (I thought 1500? But it might be 500 too.) the whole lot is converted ("unfrozen") into an ATPL.
So yes, with a CPL you can fly RHS of an airliner but if it's just a CPL you have no hope of ever becoming the captain, and without that outlook there's not a lot of airlines that will take you on board.
So if your intention is to become a career pilot, then an ATPL is virtually the only viable option. However, I know quite a few guys (and girls) who only have a CPL and do various odd jobs next to their main (non-aviation) job, and are having a tremendous time. Flight instruction is of course the biggest example, but also a lot of banner towing, parachute dropping, sightseeing flights and so forth are done by people with just a CPL. And they got that CPL, amongst other reasons, so they didn't have to 'cost share' every time but could get their flying, at the very least, reimbursed fully. And maybe make some money to pay for the trip to the airfield and the beer afterwards.
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Hi BackPacker,
That's pretty much what I want to do, already in a pretty good (non-aviation) career, but end up with quite a bit of time-off for months at end, and wanted to work towards being able to enjoy flying, whilst also making enough to pay for it.
Thanks, as always, to everybody for their responses.
WH
That's pretty much what I want to do, already in a pretty good (non-aviation) career, but end up with quite a bit of time-off for months at end, and wanted to work towards being able to enjoy flying, whilst also making enough to pay for it.
Thanks, as always, to everybody for their responses.
WH
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The answer hangs on your age and other stuff like that. On the assumption that you are not going for an airline job, and have a CPL/IR, a JAA CPL is good for
1. Instructing (and getting paid for it, but you will never make anything like real money doing that)
2. Ferrying EU-reg planes (not sure how much work there is for that as most planes serious enough to be worth ferrying somewhere tend to be N-reg)
3. Being a paid pilot for a plane owner who gets you to fly him (and his family etc) around the place, in an EU-reg plane (but again not too many privately owned turboprops and jets flown by a paid crew are EU-reg, unless operated on an AOC i.e. for charter work)
4. Being a "permanent instructor" who flies more or less constantly with the wealthy owner of a turboprop or a jet. Many of the pilot-owners of these (and very very few jets are owner-flown) do far too few hours to stay really current so they fly with freelance instructors a lot. But to get into this line you need to have the right experience and be kicking around for a while, building contacts.
A CPL without an IR is completely useless except for 1.
Maybe other options? Can't think of any right now. For options 2 and 3 and 4 you would improve your chances by getting an FAA CPL/IR as well. But I know from friends who have been down this road that there is not exactly a lot of work there and what there is tends to go to experienced pilots.
1. Instructing (and getting paid for it, but you will never make anything like real money doing that)
2. Ferrying EU-reg planes (not sure how much work there is for that as most planes serious enough to be worth ferrying somewhere tend to be N-reg)
3. Being a paid pilot for a plane owner who gets you to fly him (and his family etc) around the place, in an EU-reg plane (but again not too many privately owned turboprops and jets flown by a paid crew are EU-reg, unless operated on an AOC i.e. for charter work)
4. Being a "permanent instructor" who flies more or less constantly with the wealthy owner of a turboprop or a jet. Many of the pilot-owners of these (and very very few jets are owner-flown) do far too few hours to stay really current so they fly with freelance instructors a lot. But to get into this line you need to have the right experience and be kicking around for a while, building contacts.
A CPL without an IR is completely useless except for 1.
Maybe other options? Can't think of any right now. For options 2 and 3 and 4 you would improve your chances by getting an FAA CPL/IR as well. But I know from friends who have been down this road that there is not exactly a lot of work there and what there is tends to go to experienced pilots.
A few thoughts:
- To get a type rating on a multi-crew aeroplane you need CPL + ATPL writtens + IR
- You can add an IMC to a CPL with (in theory anyhow) 5 hrs training + test, no written exam. In UK airspace, that does give you a lot more capability.
- Realistically, you are up against shedloads of hour builders who'll work for nothing in things like parachute dropping.
- Glider tugging will almost always only go to pilots with significant gliding experience, and most won't get paid for it.
- The best add-on (apart from the IMC) to a CPL is probably the CRI; but that is only really useful if you have a lot of true flying experience (types, places, types of flying...) that pilots will actually want to tap into. If all your experience is on standard club-type flying and types, it's probably of limited use. If you have a few hundred hours on vintage taildraggers, you're a bit better off.
- Single pilot aircraft, being flown double pilot within an AOC (say, a Do228) do not require ATPL+IR to fly right hand seat, but they will still require an expensive type rating.
G
- To get a type rating on a multi-crew aeroplane you need CPL + ATPL writtens + IR
- You can add an IMC to a CPL with (in theory anyhow) 5 hrs training + test, no written exam. In UK airspace, that does give you a lot more capability.
- Realistically, you are up against shedloads of hour builders who'll work for nothing in things like parachute dropping.
- Glider tugging will almost always only go to pilots with significant gliding experience, and most won't get paid for it.
- The best add-on (apart from the IMC) to a CPL is probably the CRI; but that is only really useful if you have a lot of true flying experience (types, places, types of flying...) that pilots will actually want to tap into. If all your experience is on standard club-type flying and types, it's probably of limited use. If you have a few hundred hours on vintage taildraggers, you're a bit better off.
- Single pilot aircraft, being flown double pilot within an AOC (say, a Do228) do not require ATPL+IR to fly right hand seat, but they will still require an expensive type rating.
G
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I've been given the impression that in the paradropping world it is quite common to have a PPL flying the plane... (and get paid for it somehow, or possibly just by getting free flying which is probably OK because who can put a value on the hour building aspect)?
Photography is hard to do at all well unless you have a specially adapted plane.
Photography is hard to do at all well unless you have a specially adapted plane.
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Photos
IO540 I have to take issue with you even though you are a wise chap.
Aerial photos in the oblique field can be a very worthwhile activity if you are geared up for it but it is not cheap to set up.
Nowadays with professional digital, image stabilised, zoom, wide angle and telephoto lenses, the results can be better than the previous results from traditional film cameras.
Of course we are not talking full or half plate cameras but it is no longer necessary either.
Image gathering is still developing and merging with computing in some areas. The main problem is that there is quite a bit of competition in UK.
Aerial photos in the oblique field can be a very worthwhile activity if you are geared up for it but it is not cheap to set up.
Nowadays with professional digital, image stabilised, zoom, wide angle and telephoto lenses, the results can be better than the previous results from traditional film cameras.
Of course we are not talking full or half plate cameras but it is no longer necessary either.
Image gathering is still developing and merging with computing in some areas. The main problem is that there is quite a bit of competition in UK.
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Sure one can do photography well, through a normal clean and scratch-free window. I have managed to get many many excellent pics doing just that. This one was even taken through the prop, which is not easy. I just don't think there is a vast business opportunity for that kind of low grade work, due to the amount of competition caused by close to top-notch camera+lens equipment available for under say £2k, and it is obviously difficult or impossible (in a normal airplane) to get shots looking straight down.
I also think somebody doing that is not going to worry too much about having a CPL
I also think somebody doing that is not going to worry too much about having a CPL
