Olympic Airpsace Restrictions
Joined: Feb 2006
Posts: 1,466
Likes: 188
From: 11 GROUP
Airspace Restrictions
Well you could "emigrate" to the west country for a couple of months and not put up with all this nonsense.
Devon and Cornwall is a fantastic place to fly and plenty of "non radio" places still around.
Its just like the "firearms" issue, it stops the law abiding citizens, but does not prevent criminals getting what they want.
Nothing to do with security all to do with huges fees being paid to consultants to come up with something that looks like it is important.
I know someone who flew a very old aircraft through one of the "hottest" areas in the world "protected" by a massive and in its day up to date system, result the first they knew he was there was when he called finals !!
Nothings changed they would be better off using the "bush telegraph" system and the B.....y Spotters to really know what is going on.
What are they going to do about all the white vans driving around !!!
Its all a big excuse of a joke to pretend they have it under control.
Devon and Cornwall is a fantastic place to fly and plenty of "non radio" places still around.
Its just like the "firearms" issue, it stops the law abiding citizens, but does not prevent criminals getting what they want.
Nothing to do with security all to do with huges fees being paid to consultants to come up with something that looks like it is important.
I know someone who flew a very old aircraft through one of the "hottest" areas in the world "protected" by a massive and in its day up to date system, result the first they knew he was there was when he called finals !!
Nothings changed they would be better off using the "bush telegraph" system and the B.....y Spotters to really know what is going on.
What are they going to do about all the white vans driving around !!!
Its all a big excuse of a joke to pretend they have it under control.
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 649
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From: .
From The Horse's Mouth
So, there you are then - it's the Government with their leaden fists again screwing everything up.
If it's security that Dave, Nick, George and the other hateful tossers are so worried about, I'd be more concerned about what retribution a certain cheesed-off Libyan dictator might be planning, as opposed to paralysing the activities of private aviators in the South...
Smithy
If it's security that Dave, Nick, George and the other hateful tossers are so worried about, I'd be more concerned about what retribution a certain cheesed-off Libyan dictator might be planning, as opposed to paralysing the activities of private aviators in the South...
Smithy
A little less conversation,
a little more aviation...
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 696
Likes: 0
From: Bracknell, UK
So, there you are then - it's the Government with their leaden fists again screwing everything up.
If it's security that Dave, Nick, George and the other hateful tossers are so worried about, I'd be more concerned about what retribution a certain cheesed-off Libyan dictator might be planning, as opposed to paralysing the activities of private aviators in the South...
Smithy
If it's security that Dave, Nick, George and the other hateful tossers are so worried about, I'd be more concerned about what retribution a certain cheesed-off Libyan dictator might be planning, as opposed to paralysing the activities of private aviators in the South...
Smithy
1) Regulatory body publishes outrageously draconian proposals, conceived in-house on the basis of vague mandate from political management.
2) Affected community goes ballistic. Preparations are made for lawsuits. Community girds loins to apply heat direct to political management.
3) Attention is brought to how regulator inflicted massive damage on another section of the community less than 24 months ago on the basis of an equally unsubstantiated safety case.
4) Regulatory body has collective trouser-accident, wheels out spin-doctor to try and shift the focus of blame elsewhere.
Last edited by eharding; 10th March 2011 at 17:58. Reason: Timing
Joined: Jan 2011
Posts: 335
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From: New Zealand
doesn't an aircraft carrier need to be doing X knts to have the wind over the nose for take offs? even with the steam cats?
I'd love to see an aircraft carrier try and do 30kts up the thames :-)!!!
Hope they don't park it of Canvey Island, they'd wake up to a floating metal skeleton after the locals were done :-)
I'd love to see an aircraft carrier try and do 30kts up the thames :-)!!!
Hope they don't park it of Canvey Island, they'd wake up to a floating metal skeleton after the locals were done :-)
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 649
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From: .
Think you're forgetting eharding that politicians/Whitehall have been involved, as we all know whenever these serpents get their grubby hands on anything it's bound to get hopelessly buggered beyond comprehension. 
CAA/NATS were commanded from on high to implement this at the wishes of HMG, I am led to believe.
Smithy
CAA/NATS were commanded from on high to implement this at the wishes of HMG, I am led to believe.
Smithy
Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 158
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From: Near the end of a long, long road
doesn't an aircraft carrier need to be doing X knts to have the wind over the nose for take offs? even with the steam cats?
Oh no, I forgot, we got rid of those as we thought we'd never need them
.
A little less conversation,
a little more aviation...
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 696
Likes: 0
From: Bracknell, UK
Think you're forgetting eharding that politicians/Whitehall have been involved, as we all know whenever these serpents get their grubby hands on anything it's bound to get hopelessly buggered beyond comprehension.
CAA/NATS were commanded from on high to implement this at the wishes of HMG, I am led to believe.
Smithy
CAA/NATS were commanded from on high to implement this at the wishes of HMG, I am led to believe.
Smithy
I don't see NATS as the villain here - the proposed CAS(T) changes to cope with anticipated extra demand published last month seem perfectly reasonable.
Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 3,991
Likes: 8
From: UK
So surprise, surprise it's the Home Office/Dept of Transport that have come up with this nonsense.
It's shows what the politicians and civil servants really think of general aviation. Remember that research that AOPA did about how much GA pumped into the UK economy and how many people are employed in GA?
The government in the UK still think GA flying is a rich man's sport and this is clearly demonstrated by these draconian restrictions.
I propose a day of (legal) protest of some sort. Any ideas?
It's shows what the politicians and civil servants really think of general aviation. Remember that research that AOPA did about how much GA pumped into the UK economy and how many people are employed in GA?
The government in the UK still think GA flying is a rich man's sport and this is clearly demonstrated by these draconian restrictions.
I propose a day of (legal) protest of some sort. Any ideas?
Joined: Nov 2010
Posts: 232
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From: London
fireflybob. I'm all for protests, but isn't it worth trying to get our representative bodies involved, and do a bit of lobbying? I think I'll write a letter to my MP, email to BMAA, and perhaps make a couple of calls to local flying schools. The more businesses affected that stand up and complain, the more likely something will happen (or at least, that's what I think).
But I'm open to suggestions. Any ideas?
But I'm open to suggestions. Any ideas?
Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 3,991
Likes: 8
From: UK
Perhaps another point that should be made is that at a time when many businesses are struggling for survival, limiting GA flying for this period of time, especially when the hours of daylight are longer and the weather factor is better, may be enough to tip some FTOs into insolvency.
Surely these FTOs and other GA organisations should get some sort of compensation from the EU funds which UK taxpayers contribute to on a fairly massive basis?
Surely these FTOs and other GA organisations should get some sort of compensation from the EU funds which UK taxpayers contribute to on a fairly massive basis?
Joined: Sep 2004
Posts: 20
Likes: 0
From: UK
Two points to add to this debate:
1) I have heard that the normally Class G areas of this zone will apparently be manned by RAF air traffickers rather than civvy (despite EGLF LARS covering most of it).
2) According to the AOPA website, after a meeting in March there was 'loose talk' of AWACS, Typhoons and Apaches being used for any unknown traffic entering the zone. If you were to fly non-squawking and unannounced, as AOPA says, brush up on your interception procedures.
1) I have heard that the normally Class G areas of this zone will apparently be manned by RAF air traffickers rather than civvy (despite EGLF LARS covering most of it).
2) According to the AOPA website, after a meeting in March there was 'loose talk' of AWACS, Typhoons and Apaches being used for any unknown traffic entering the zone. If you were to fly non-squawking and unannounced, as AOPA says, brush up on your interception procedures.
Joined: Nov 2010
Posts: 232
Likes: 0
From: London
Hi,
Did anyone get a copy of the restricted and prohibited areas map? I was going to spend some time this weekend listing out which airfields are hit by it, but when I went to the website just now, it was gone (not just the map, but the whole web site!)
Ta, IPZ
Did anyone get a copy of the restricted and prohibited areas map? I was going to spend some time this weekend listing out which airfields are hit by it, but when I went to the website just now, it was gone (not just the map, but the whole web site!)
Ta, IPZ
Joined: Jul 2004
Posts: 13
Likes: 0
From: UK
Perhaps the goons have realized that:-
1. closing South East England's airspace for 2 months for a 2 week event is just a little OTT. (I know it wouldn't technically be closed but in my neck of the woods Farnborough would be responsible and they can't really cope now)
2. Forcing the VIPs out of their helicopters and onto the roads is not a good security move
1. closing South East England's airspace for 2 months for a 2 week event is just a little OTT. (I know it wouldn't technically be closed but in my neck of the woods Farnborough would be responsible and they can't really cope now)
2. Forcing the VIPs out of their helicopters and onto the roads is not a good security move
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 13,787
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From: EuroGA.org
It sounds like somebody has screwed up their server. It happens. The bigger the organisation, the more likely it is that nobody is in charge of keeping tabs on the hosting 
The CAA has also stopped dealing with emails. You get the auto-responder reply but no response thereafter.
The CAA has also stopped dealing with emails. You get the auto-responder reply but no response thereafter.
Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 3
Likes: 5
From: Wor Yerm
I detect the edict of person who has their finger fully on the pulse of aviation security. We can all rest easy now because no naughty person with evil intent will be allowed to fly over the Olympic site, because it will be illegal. I'm sure a stiff penalty will persuade the very hottest militant to behave. And if they do go flying, I'm sure they'll be intercepted and shot down by... Errm... Er? How do we actually enforce this?
It's an excellent move. Make the buggers use the Tube like every other poor sod. With any luck, a few will get mugged. And you'll have to excuse me for being a bit anti-Olympic. The whole thing stinks and the sooner its over and done with the better. It's piss poor value for money, incredible disruption, only benefits a few and yet again, I'll be paying for another bloody fiasco.
PM
Forcing the VIPs out of their helicopters and onto the roads is not a good security move.
PM