Advantages of having a PPL?
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: england
Age: 28
Posts: 38
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
That's the reason I started this post because I know how much it costs and that we really don't have that much money. I want to try for a scholarship (I know it's unlikely I'll get one but still) and I want to persuade mum to let me do that. I know lots of you are saying it's a hobby but if I want to be a pilot it is something I shoulddo and if I start now I'm not going to need lessons that often as I can't get my liscense for 2 years yet. I was planning to go to the library as it's half term- does anyone have any suggestions for books tahr would be useful for a beginner? X
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Amsterdam
Posts: 4,598
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Hannah, even if you don't become a professional pilot, learning to fly will teach you important skills for success in your future life:
- you learn not only to plan strategically and proactively, but also to optimise your plans in real time, making small adaptations as you go;
- you learn to process several streams of information in parallel and verify them against each other.
These skills are especially valuable if you ever decide to run your own business.
- you learn not only to plan strategically and proactively, but also to optimise your plans in real time, making small adaptations as you go;
- you learn to process several streams of information in parallel and verify them against each other.
These skills are especially valuable if you ever decide to run your own business.
If you really want to fly, and need to do it cheaply, gliding is probably the way to go. And I also know a boy who got involved in the real flying world by flying simulators on-line, acting as ATC. He regularly visits our club, particularly if we have events, brings his simulator, demonstrates things, and generally gets a free ride out of that.
Hannah,
I don't think you need to justify any benefits of having a PPL its simply that you want to do it. its like sailing boats or climbing mountains. If your parents are not aviation minded they will probably see it as a danger and make excuses not to let you. If they won't let you fly, they probably wouldn't let you ride horses either.
You need to gain exposure to aeroplanes, the ATC is an excellent way and will provide opportunities. Apply for as many scholarships as you can find, GAPAN, the Air League and the Royal Aero Club. Somebody has to win them!
Go to your nearest airfield probably Sleap and see if you can get a Saturday job doing anything associated with aeroplanes. When you get your opportunity at school to do Work Experience see if you can get it at the local aerodrome.
I don't think you need to justify any benefits of having a PPL its simply that you want to do it. its like sailing boats or climbing mountains. If your parents are not aviation minded they will probably see it as a danger and make excuses not to let you. If they won't let you fly, they probably wouldn't let you ride horses either.
You need to gain exposure to aeroplanes, the ATC is an excellent way and will provide opportunities. Apply for as many scholarships as you can find, GAPAN, the Air League and the Royal Aero Club. Somebody has to win them!
Go to your nearest airfield probably Sleap and see if you can get a Saturday job doing anything associated with aeroplanes. When you get your opportunity at school to do Work Experience see if you can get it at the local aerodrome.
Last edited by Whopity; 4th Jun 2010 at 12:25.
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: EuroGA.org
Posts: 13,787
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
The way to get a PPL most cost effectively (apart from doing a JAA PPL in California in about 6 weeks; let's not start that one again 
) is to find a pilot friend/mentor who lets you fly with him/her and who shows you the ropes, including all the ground stuff like flight planning. Then, you will know everything practical before even starting the course, will finish in the minimum time (45hrs), and it will be easier all round because you won't spend the first 20 hours coping with a brain overload.
You won't be able to log any of that time but that doesn't matter.
) is to find a pilot friend/mentor who lets you fly with him/her and who shows you the ropes, including all the ground stuff like flight planning. Then, you will know everything practical before even starting the course, will finish in the minimum time (45hrs), and it will be easier all round because you won't spend the first 20 hours coping with a brain overload.You won't be able to log any of that time but that doesn't matter.
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: UK, US, now more ɐıןɐɹʇsn∀
Age: 41
Posts: 889
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Hi there.
The first page of this thread contains all the important links. You can get plenty free or very cheap flying given your age. Air League, later on UAS etc.
If you're not one of the (nothing but jet won't do and piston is necessary evil to get there) wannabes, sure, this may not be that great.
Gliding clubs offer very cheap, even cheaper flying for teenagers. Some do 'dirty work' help hours against launches or flight time (if that's not free already for so young). Ideally, for initial training, winch launches are cheaper, practicing circuits.
UK cons - if you fly a lot, you can't solo before your 16th birthday on glider.
Did I mention, after suitable training, you can help out driving golf cart or some old car helping to retrieve gliders to the launch point :-D Even before having DL.
Not exactly racing, though.
Gliding will teach you to appreciate many things about flying you may take for granted with the spinning thing in front of you. Also, these scholarships available for teenagers, are for motorgliders as well. Well known Grob Tutor G109, Falke, T61 etc. You can get free hours, while learning the stuff, having engine experience etc.
While there are not as many 'exemptions' for full JAA PPL for gliding and motorgliders, going the NPPL route, you can find yourself with day only VFR simple single/motorglider/microlight licence that lets you enjoy flying.
As mentioned, GAPAN offers full PPL scholarships as well, although you're too young for it now. If you have some air experience, you'd show commitment and serious interest for the application, not just a passing interest.
Gliding and motorgliders will definitely help you with many aspects of flying power later on (or, SEP as some prefer). Had I been your age in the UK now or earlier, I'd make the most of it. DO NOT think that you're not likely to succeed in the more lucrative scholarship applications. Too many think the same. You can't win if you don't join.
AFAIK, you can't log SEP time towards PPL right now, due to your age. Gliding is fine, although the solo age restriction. Many youngsters solo on their 16th birthday, weather permitting. Nice Bday to remember.
If you don't hurry, but stick to your plans/dreams, it's easily achievable, it just takes time. Something people your age aren't best at. Waiting.
Had I known how much fun and more 'flexible' regular gliding is, and getting a misconception shattered years ago, I wouldn't have bothered saving money as teenager for paragliding kit. It just wasn't used enough without me having car/transport. I thought gliding is more expensive, more elitist, one has to own glider etc. How wrong.
Have fun. Amazon is good for cheap second hand books, as you're likely to know.
The first page of this thread contains all the important links. You can get plenty free or very cheap flying given your age. Air League, later on UAS etc.
If you're not one of the (nothing but jet won't do and piston is necessary evil to get there) wannabes, sure, this may not be that great.
Gliding clubs offer very cheap, even cheaper flying for teenagers. Some do 'dirty work' help hours against launches or flight time (if that's not free already for so young). Ideally, for initial training, winch launches are cheaper, practicing circuits.
UK cons - if you fly a lot, you can't solo before your 16th birthday on glider.
Did I mention, after suitable training, you can help out driving golf cart or some old car helping to retrieve gliders to the launch point :-D Even before having DL.
Not exactly racing, though.
Gliding will teach you to appreciate many things about flying you may take for granted with the spinning thing in front of you. Also, these scholarships available for teenagers, are for motorgliders as well. Well known Grob Tutor G109, Falke, T61 etc. You can get free hours, while learning the stuff, having engine experience etc.
While there are not as many 'exemptions' for full JAA PPL for gliding and motorgliders, going the NPPL route, you can find yourself with day only VFR simple single/motorglider/microlight licence that lets you enjoy flying.
As mentioned, GAPAN offers full PPL scholarships as well, although you're too young for it now. If you have some air experience, you'd show commitment and serious interest for the application, not just a passing interest.
Gliding and motorgliders will definitely help you with many aspects of flying power later on (or, SEP as some prefer). Had I been your age in the UK now or earlier, I'd make the most of it. DO NOT think that you're not likely to succeed in the more lucrative scholarship applications. Too many think the same. You can't win if you don't join.
AFAIK, you can't log SEP time towards PPL right now, due to your age. Gliding is fine, although the solo age restriction. Many youngsters solo on their 16th birthday, weather permitting. Nice Bday to remember.
If you don't hurry, but stick to your plans/dreams, it's easily achievable, it just takes time. Something people your age aren't best at. Waiting.
Had I known how much fun and more 'flexible' regular gliding is, and getting a misconception shattered years ago, I wouldn't have bothered saving money as teenager for paragliding kit. It just wasn't used enough without me having car/transport. I thought gliding is more expensive, more elitist, one has to own glider etc. How wrong.
Have fun. Amazon is good for cheap second hand books, as you're likely to know.
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: england
Age: 28
Posts: 38
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Well I think I'm getting there!! Dad has basically said yes to a trial lesson- well he said it's up to your mum and she's more likely to say yes... Eventually. Lol I'm going to go tobthe library and get some books tomorrow (any suggestions) and show her I'm serious about wanting to learn and if I ever get to the club I might have a headstart right? I've been looking at gliding and the places are no nearer so that doesn't help and mum said they're nothing like flying as there is no engine so she doesn't see how it could help even though I explained in shows an interest in aviation (and my sister goes huh?) haha. Martin, are you serious about being able to drive?? Theta so cool- I wanted to do it at pgl over summer but they said it wad too dangerous!
Also I'm a shy sorta person so how would Igo about asking about working at an airfield? Won't people think it's rude? Thanks to everyone who's already answered lots of my questions.
xx
Also I'm a shy sorta person so how would Igo about asking about working at an airfield? Won't people think it's rude? Thanks to everyone who's already answered lots of my questions.
xx
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: UK
Posts: 78
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
A father's perspective
My only daughter had her first glider flight when she was 14, started to learn when she was 15, and went solo when she was 16. And there's nothing remarkable about that - at the same club another 16yo went solo that same year, we have several younger people flying regularly and I believe there's a 9yo (11yo?) that pays for the occasional lesson out of her pocket money.
So, from a father's perspective, what do I think it has done for her?
Costs are minimal for youngsters at my club: ~£40/year membership and ~£6/flight. Typically you'll have 3 flights/day while training so a day out costs <£20 - or alternatively a single hour-long flight costs ~£21. (A trial lesson costs £35/45). And as others have mentioned, there are bursaries available for pre-solo pilots, e.g.How much use is learning to glide as opposed to getting a PPL? I don't know, but it certainly won't do any harm and it definitely helped an 18yo at our club get through the selection processes to join the Fleet Air Arm to train as a pilot.
After you've been part of the club for a while you won't be self-consciously shy because you'll be part of the team and will have some significant achievements under your belt. You'll be able to say "I'm interested in doing X, and I can demonstrate that by having done Y and Z, so you can see my interest and dedication". If somebody acts as if that is rude then you probably don't want to work for them anyway!
Very difficult to quantify and, IMHO, probably a question that should be "unasked". Fundamentally there's risks in doing everything - what's important is to accurately assess what you're capable of in the current conditions. Personally I'm much happier about my daughter doing gliding that I would be about her horse riding.
"Oil leaks etc"? Well there's much less to go wrong in a glider, and before you go solo (and afterwards) you'll have to repeatedly demonstrate that you can safely deal with "eventualities" including winch failure or cable breaks (equivalent to engine failure), and "departure from controlled flight" i.e. stalls and spins. If you can't demonstrate you're safe, you won't go solo - very simple and very reassuring.
The best way to understand this how things work is to go to a gliding club, spend several hours at the launchpoint just watching and chatting to the members and the instructors. And then have a trial lesson, preferably a winch launch because it is much cheaper and more fun.
Alternatively, I'm quite happy to discuss "a father's perspective".
So, from a father's perspective, what do I think it has done for her?
- when she started she thought shopping malls were interesting and exciting places - now she knows there's far more to life, provided that she works at it. (Judging by some of her classmates, I'm very glad she came to that conclusion before making awkward personal mistakes)
- it saves money on trips to Alton Towers etc - they've become boring now she builds her own rollercoasters in the sky
- motorbikes have little attraction (which relieves me somewhat) after the adrenaline of a winch launch
- she's learned a good approach to the dangers she will undoubtedly encounter in life: listen, recognise and understand the dangers, then apply the relevant procedures to minimse the dangers
- because she helps out at the club, she can add many demonstrable skills onto her CV, e.g. keeping legal documents (the logbook), supervising visitors, organising the grid including persuading other people to "do the right thing", demonstrating the continued application and achievement and general maturity required to be allowed to go solo. Plus it is a very good talking point during interviews!
- from a purely selfish viewpoint, it has extended the time that she wants to do things with me (as opposed to going off with her friends)
Costs are minimal for youngsters at my club: ~£40/year membership and ~£6/flight. Typically you'll have 3 flights/day while training so a day out costs <£20 - or alternatively a single hour-long flight costs ~£21. (A trial lesson costs £35/45). And as others have mentioned, there are bursaries available for pre-solo pilots, e.g.How much use is learning to glide as opposed to getting a PPL? I don't know, but it certainly won't do any harm and it definitely helped an 18yo at our club get through the selection processes to join the Fleet Air Arm to train as a pilot.
Also I'm a shy sorta person so how would I go about asking about working at an airfield? Won't people think it's rude?
Me n mum talked abut and she decides it's now too dangerous with crashing and oil leaks etc. So I said way more cars crash than airplanes. Was I right? Are airplanes just as safe as cars?
"Oil leaks etc"? Well there's much less to go wrong in a glider, and before you go solo (and afterwards) you'll have to repeatedly demonstrate that you can safely deal with "eventualities" including winch failure or cable breaks (equivalent to engine failure), and "departure from controlled flight" i.e. stalls and spins. If you can't demonstrate you're safe, you won't go solo - very simple and very reassuring.
The best way to understand this how things work is to go to a gliding club, spend several hours at the launchpoint just watching and chatting to the members and the instructors. And then have a trial lesson, preferably a winch launch because it is much cheaper and more fun.
Alternatively, I'm quite happy to discuss "a father's perspective".
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: england
Age: 28
Posts: 38
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Everyones given loads of useful information and so I've finally convinced them to give me a lesson for my birthday but.. I feel bad because I've been going on about it loads and they were like "whatever if you really want to you can bug you're not getting anything else" so I go "fine I don't want anything else" which is true but I still feel bad. 
also lots of people have mfntioned gliding so I've been googling it and it seems just as fun, easier to do and cheaper but I still really want to fly a 'proper' plane. Last time I mentioned gliding though mum said it's got nothing to do with flying so I don't think I can just change my mind now. My nearest club, sleap, offers both flying and gliding (I think) so would I be able to try both and choose then? Has anyone tried both and got a favourite? And can you gel a lisence for gliding like you can for flying? I got a book on gliding but it wasn't to good as I didn't understand a lot as i've never seen inside a glider and other things I already knew from the Internet. X
also lots of people have mfntioned gliding so I've been googling it and it seems just as fun, easier to do and cheaper but I still really want to fly a 'proper' plane. Last time I mentioned gliding though mum said it's got nothing to do with flying so I don't think I can just change my mind now. My nearest club, sleap, offers both flying and gliding (I think) so would I be able to try both and choose then? Has anyone tried both and got a favourite? And can you gel a lisence for gliding like you can for flying? I got a book on gliding but it wasn't to good as I didn't understand a lot as i've never seen inside a glider and other things I already knew from the Internet. X
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: UK
Age: 35
Posts: 94
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I've done/still do both gliding and powered flying. I really enjoy the both of them for different reasons. I get more of an adrenalin rush out of gliding, but powered flying is where my heart truly lies.
I started gliding as an initial way into flying, I was about your age and could not afford flying lessons in powered aircraft. I got a scholarship to start gliding (offered by the Royal Aeronautical Society, not sure if they are still doing them or not, might be worth a look though). I soloed in the glider and 16, and what I learned helped massively when I did start my PPL, I sailed through the first few lessons on basic aircraft control, because there are a lot of similarities.
Gliding is a great way to start off in a flying hobby (or even career if you want to head down that road), it's way cheaper than powered flying and there are a lot of skills you learn that you can take across.
Feel free to PM me if you want to anything specific about gliding, or my own personal experiences.
I started gliding as an initial way into flying, I was about your age and could not afford flying lessons in powered aircraft. I got a scholarship to start gliding (offered by the Royal Aeronautical Society, not sure if they are still doing them or not, might be worth a look though). I soloed in the glider and 16, and what I learned helped massively when I did start my PPL, I sailed through the first few lessons on basic aircraft control, because there are a lot of similarities.
Gliding is a great way to start off in a flying hobby (or even career if you want to head down that road), it's way cheaper than powered flying and there are a lot of skills you learn that you can take across.
Feel free to PM me if you want to anything specific about gliding, or my own personal experiences.
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: UK
Posts: 78
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
also lots of people have mfntioned gliding so I've been googling it and it seems just as fun, easier to do and cheaper but I still really want to fly a 'proper' plane.
Better not show your mother this video of a standard pre-solo exercise YouTube - Segelflug, Trudeln mit Fox
Last time I mentioned gliding though mum said it's got nothing to do with flying so I don't think I can just change my mind now.
If you have new information then it is, IMHO, entirely reasonable to re-evaluate opinions and decisions.
My nearest club, sleap, offers both flying and gliding (I think) so would I be able to try both and choose then?
See British Gliding Association - UK Map for your nearest clubs. Midland Gliding Club on the Long Mynd seems to be a similar distance from Shrewsbury.
Has anyone tried both and got a favourite?
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Worcs/Glos border
Posts: 229
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Definitely try gliding. It's not only one of the cheapest ways to get into the air, it's really good fun, and it will teach you a great deal about flying which will very likely make you a better pilot if you later want to fly power.
If you enjoy it and stick with it you could be flying solo in a couple of years, and for pocket money costs (well, maybe Saturday job costs...)
Your mum is definitely wrong to say it's nothing to do with flying!
Remember the airliner which made a forced landing in the Hudson River? The pilot is a glider pilot (he obtained a glider pilot's licence at the age of 14!) and it's my guess that without his experience in gliders the outcome might have been a whole lot worse.
By the way, in this country, there is no gliding licence. You will be allowed to fly solo when your instructor thinks you are ready (not before you're 16 though).
If you enjoy it and stick with it you could be flying solo in a couple of years, and for pocket money costs (well, maybe Saturday job costs...)
Your mum is definitely wrong to say it's nothing to do with flying!
Remember the airliner which made a forced landing in the Hudson River? The pilot is a glider pilot (he obtained a glider pilot's licence at the age of 14!) and it's my guess that without his experience in gliders the outcome might have been a whole lot worse.
By the way, in this country, there is no gliding licence. You will be allowed to fly solo when your instructor thinks you are ready (not before you're 16 though).
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Portsmouth UK
Posts: 8
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Lots of options and lots of advice.
Whatever you choose to do I'm sure we'd all wish you good luck in your new venture.
Having done gliding many years ago you'll find the real fun comes when you are able to master soaring and spend more than a few minutes in the air on a circuit, unless you pay for an aerotow. The only down side was that I have spent many days on the airfield helping to launch and recover aircraft without getting a flight due to the weather changing or some priority booking which wasn't in the book, however the fact that I was willing to help out all the time meant I did get some bonus flights. Just remember though that with a glider you only get one shot at landing (unless it has a motor)
I'm not gliding anymore as I've moved onto other things but I think the experience made me a better pilot with regards to 'stick and rudder' flying.
Enjoy your flight when you get it
Whatever you choose to do I'm sure we'd all wish you good luck in your new venture.
Having done gliding many years ago you'll find the real fun comes when you are able to master soaring and spend more than a few minutes in the air on a circuit, unless you pay for an aerotow. The only down side was that I have spent many days on the airfield helping to launch and recover aircraft without getting a flight due to the weather changing or some priority booking which wasn't in the book, however the fact that I was willing to help out all the time meant I did get some bonus flights. Just remember though that with a glider you only get one shot at landing (unless it has a motor)
I'm not gliding anymore as I've moved onto other things but I think the experience made me a better pilot with regards to 'stick and rudder' flying.
Enjoy your flight when you get it
