Crossing MATZ in the UK
Thread Starter
Joined: Jan 2006
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From: London
Crossing MATZ in the UK
I have a couple of questions regarding the Matz control zone in the UK.
Having regained my PPL here in the UK, I would like to know anyone could please give me some information regarding entering MATZ control zone.
First when planning a navigation trip in the UK, the map is full of MATZ zones, I understand I need to request clearence to enter, however can I cross a MATZ anywhere? Or is there only certain parts of the MATZ zone I am able to enter?
Can I fly directly over the airfield, or can I only cross MATZ on outer limits?
And what about week-ends, when the MATZ ATC is normally closed, if no response is recieved from their ATC, can I then fly anywhere over the MATZ?
Many places you have 2 - 3 MATZ zones all connected together, I would like to fly in a straight line if possible, and not Zigg - Zagg trough the UK, any advice regarding this. An example would be Honnington, Lakenheath, Mildenhall.
If given clearance, can a MATZ penetration be made anywhere in the MATZ zone, including across airfield at safe altitude?
Having regained my PPL here in the UK, I would like to know anyone could please give me some information regarding entering MATZ control zone.
First when planning a navigation trip in the UK, the map is full of MATZ zones, I understand I need to request clearence to enter, however can I cross a MATZ anywhere? Or is there only certain parts of the MATZ zone I am able to enter?
Can I fly directly over the airfield, or can I only cross MATZ on outer limits?
And what about week-ends, when the MATZ ATC is normally closed, if no response is recieved from their ATC, can I then fly anywhere over the MATZ?
Many places you have 2 - 3 MATZ zones all connected together, I would like to fly in a straight line if possible, and not Zigg - Zagg trough the UK, any advice regarding this. An example would be Honnington, Lakenheath, Mildenhall.
If given clearance, can a MATZ penetration be made anywhere in the MATZ zone, including across airfield at safe altitude?
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From: UK
Joined: Oct 2008
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From: suffolk
With respect, How have you just got your licence back if you don't understand basic airspace rules?
Yes, you can go over (at a min height) under (a stub at max height) etc.
But I suggest you spend a little time with an instructor to brush up .
The Yanks get very very iffy if you go overhead their runways,(plenty of them in my neck of the woods) and knowing the old addage of shoot first and ask afterwards ,it pays to know the rules!
Yes, you can go over (at a min height) under (a stub at max height) etc.
But I suggest you spend a little time with an instructor to brush up .
The Yanks get very very iffy if you go overhead their runways,(plenty of them in my neck of the woods) and knowing the old addage of shoot first and ask afterwards ,it pays to know the rules!
Joined: Jul 2004
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From: On the wireless...
From ENR 2.2 'civil recognition of a MATZ is not mandatory, pilots are to comply with the provisions of the current Rules of the Air Regulations in respect of the ATZ.'
A MATZ is unregulated Class G airspace therefore 'clearance' is not required.
A MATZ will, however, contain a separate, embedded, regulated, Government aerodrome ATZ which requires compliance with Rule 45.
A MATZ is unregulated Class G airspace therefore 'clearance' is not required.
A MATZ will, however, contain a separate, embedded, regulated, Government aerodrome ATZ which requires compliance with Rule 45.
Thread Starter
Joined: Jan 2006
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From: London
Yes I have just recently got my PPL back, after 16 years of no flying. Most of my flying I have done in Scandinavia - where there is little problem with MATZ.
Even flying in controlled airspace is little problem. Reading the theory and checking the AIP is not a problem, just adapting with basics of flying in UK airspace. Thanks.
Even flying in controlled airspace is little problem. Reading the theory and checking the AIP is not a problem, just adapting with basics of flying in UK airspace. Thanks.
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From: 18nm NE grice 28ft up
I would recommend you call the MATZ ATC at least five miles out even if overflying.(3000+ ft QFE is normally above the zone) Most give an excellent service and will keep you clear of their traffic. The frequency is on the chart so there is no confusion even if it is combined with another MATZ.
Many are closed at the weekend, check the AIP, but don't assume there is no activity. Many have gliders or air experience flights going on.
One that springs to mind is Church Fenton who often seem to be at home even when promugated closed.
DO.
Many are closed at the weekend, check the AIP, but don't assume there is no activity. Many have gliders or air experience flights going on.
One that springs to mind is Church Fenton who often seem to be at home even when promugated closed.
DO.
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From: Oxford
People overcomplicate MATZ - I operate from inside one...
1. It's not controlled airspace. But treat it as if it were - unless they say you can't go inside, in which case it's up to you if you do so anyway. But tell them. (See 3.)
2. They will ask you to fly on QFE. Humour them.
3. It's a busy place with (usually) lots of fast pointy things. See 1.
4. The boundaries thereof are often not in GPS databases, so be prepared to use a map for a change. (They may ask you to report MATZ boundary depending on whether you are receiving a radar service or not.)
Tim
1. It's not controlled airspace. But treat it as if it were - unless they say you can't go inside, in which case it's up to you if you do so anyway. But tell them. (See 3.)
2. They will ask you to fly on QFE. Humour them.
3. It's a busy place with (usually) lots of fast pointy things. See 1.
4. The boundaries thereof are often not in GPS databases, so be prepared to use a map for a change. (They may ask you to report MATZ boundary depending on whether you are receiving a radar service or not.)
Tim
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From: Mornington Crescent
Mate, this is a bit of an old chesnut, with people falling on either side of the fence, with varying degrees of strength of feeling. If there is a partictular MATZ which is giving you concern, may I suggest you phone the base and ask to speak to the ATC Supervisor? They'll be the best person to get the bottom line from!
Joined: Feb 2003
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From: Berks, UK
Question for all of you with far more hours than me...
Surely a bit of common sense airmanship is required here? Having re-read 2.2 of the AIP:
if you were routing North of Reading and just clipping Benson MATZ, if you follow the letter of the AIP you would make calls to Benson for a MATZ penetration (potentially blind calls at the week-end) - but would it not be better to be getting a service from F'Boro Radar and listening for other traffic on that frequency? Obviously if going near the ATZ itself that would be a different matter or spending significant time within the MATZ (and if Class D airspace zone that is obviously very different matter). But do you not want to be listening on the frequency on which the most traffic relevant to your actual route would be talking?
Surely a bit of common sense airmanship is required here? Having re-read 2.2 of the AIP:
if you were routing North of Reading and just clipping Benson MATZ, if you follow the letter of the AIP you would make calls to Benson for a MATZ penetration (potentially blind calls at the week-end) - but would it not be better to be getting a service from F'Boro Radar and listening for other traffic on that frequency? Obviously if going near the ATZ itself that would be a different matter or spending significant time within the MATZ (and if Class D airspace zone that is obviously very different matter). But do you not want to be listening on the frequency on which the most traffic relevant to your actual route would be talking?
Last edited by mjc123; 7th August 2009 at 12:20. Reason: typos
Joined: Jan 2008
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From: UK
People overcomplicate MATZ - I operate from inside one...
<snip>
4. The boundaries thereof are often not in GPS databases, so be prepared to use a map for a change. (They may ask you to report MATZ boundary depending on whether you are receiving a radar service or not.)
<snip>
4. The boundaries thereof are often not in GPS databases, so be prepared to use a map for a change. (They may ask you to report MATZ boundary depending on whether you are receiving a radar service or not.)
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From: suffolk
I had an engine failure in a matz a long time ago. I did the obvious and landed on the runway underneath me.After the obligatory " you can't land that 'ere !" .. "oh yes I can- I just did! " joke, the RAF were OK.
I got tea and buns and was shown around the tower. Radar were highly embarrased, they had no idea I was there !
Other than letting me fix it and fly it out ( they insisted on dismantling it and trailor it out ) they were fine.
My mate had a similar situation with a US base and was manhandled out of the plane, spread eagled on the runway face down with a fecking great gun in the back of his head. (and that was pre 9/11).
I got tea and buns and was shown around the tower. Radar were highly embarrased, they had no idea I was there !
Other than letting me fix it and fly it out ( they insisted on dismantling it and trailor it out ) they were fine.
My mate had a similar situation with a US base and was manhandled out of the plane, spread eagled on the runway face down with a fecking great gun in the back of his head. (and that was pre 9/11).
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From: Oxford
hatzflyer,
Out of interest, did you have time to declare an emergency, and were you on the MATZ freq at the time?
Seems odd that they would have queried it, really - normally they are far too cool and collected for anything more than a raised eyebrow in the controller's tone of voice...
The anecdote about the American bases sums up the difference in approach nicely.
Tim
Out of interest, did you have time to declare an emergency, and were you on the MATZ freq at the time?
Seems odd that they would have queried it, really - normally they are far too cool and collected for anything more than a raised eyebrow in the controller's tone of voice...
The anecdote about the American bases sums up the difference in approach nicely.
Tim
Joined: Oct 2004
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From: UK
I would recommend you call the MATZ ATC at least five miles out
1.15.3 Pilots requiring a MATZ, and where appropriate, ATZ penetration service must establish two way RTF communication on the appropriate frequency with the aerodrome controlling the zone when 15 nm or 5 min flying time from the boundary
whichever is the sooner, and request approval to penetrate the MATZ,and if
appropriate ATZ. When requested by the controller to ‘pass your message’ the pilot
should pass the following information:
a) Aircraft Callsign / Type
b) Departure Point and Destination
c) Present Position
d) Level
e) Additional details / Intention (e.g. Flight Rules, Next Route Point)
whichever is the sooner, and request approval to penetrate the MATZ,and if
appropriate ATZ. When requested by the controller to ‘pass your message’ the pilot
should pass the following information:
a) Aircraft Callsign / Type
b) Departure Point and Destination
c) Present Position
d) Level
e) Additional details / Intention (e.g. Flight Rules, Next Route Point)
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From: Oxford
Understandable, then, as they may have thought you'd just decided to drop in! But I don't think anyone, least of all the RAF, would deny that you did the obviously right thing. Shame they wouldn't let you fly it out but if it trailers easily I suppose I can see their point.
Tim
Tim
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From: 75N 16E
I take off under the stub of a matz and rarely dial them up unless I am going somewhere. If I wanted to tansit I'd ask for a transit, but normally I'd be above and ask for a Traffic Service. Even in AIAA areas you can fly around and rarely see anyone else.
Joined: Jul 2004
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From: On the wireless...
I am based at a busy aerodrome within the confines of a MATZ (but not the Rule 45 ATZ). Whenever I call the published VHF freq inbound or outbound response is usually tardy and the call is received with little apparent interest and the provision of a totally inappropriate pressure setting. I do not recall ever having had any traffic information. If the military really do want extended protection from civilian aircraft they should apply for a 5nm radius Rule 45 ATZ then we will all know exactly where we are. From radar observation MATZ dimensions are inappropriate for the traffic patterns which they are supposed to protect and consequently, IMHO, not worth the paper they are printed on as far as civilian pilots are concerned. The MATZ Penetration Service is an incongruous entry in a civilian IAIP. It is neither one thing nor the other. Little wonder that MATZ Penetration is misunderstood.
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From: Niort
I very much agree. One of our local MATZ will only grant tranist 'threough' the MATZ at 3000!.
If there is any flying going on they try and sterilise the area - which of course the a/c they operate largely do not need.
To be fair however I have had pretty good service from some of the Americans - they are a bit paranoid about you not flying overhead but traffic info, squawks - just like a mini-RIS. (Yes I know but Traffic doesn't fo it for me!)
If there is any flying going on they try and sterilise the area - which of course the a/c they operate largely do not need.
To be fair however I have had pretty good service from some of the Americans - they are a bit paranoid about you not flying overhead but traffic info, squawks - just like a mini-RIS. (Yes I know but Traffic doesn't fo it for me!)
