Flying more than 100h a month
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EasyRyder, after haven taken some time to translate your post into English I gather you think I have an issue with escobar?
I simply have the view that he may be trying to find a bend on a straight road.......
Good things come to those who wait.
I simply have the view that he may be trying to find a bend on a straight road.......
Good things come to those who wait.
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A couple of examples as to why the aviation industry isn't a so called "straight road"
1st. With instructing experience and turbo prop experience I am not marketable to any airlines due to lack of experience. Why then do airlines take on integrated students with 200h?
2nd. With 1000h tt and instructing and turbo prop experience I am not marketable to airlines due to lack of experience. Why then do airlines take on 1500h instructors?
I have accepted that I am not marketable without a green book and am trying to get that green book. Whilst I agree in part with good things come to those who wait, do you know how annoying it is to see friends who were half way through a ppl when i was a fATPL, go integrated and get four engined jets straight out of flying school? For me everybody should have to work their way up the aviation industry either with instructing, para dropping, glider towing, the bCPL was a good thing in my eyes. I enjoy my job, I enjoy flying, and I wouldn't swap my career path but there comes a time when you have to make things happen for yourself
1st. With instructing experience and turbo prop experience I am not marketable to any airlines due to lack of experience. Why then do airlines take on integrated students with 200h?
2nd. With 1000h tt and instructing and turbo prop experience I am not marketable to airlines due to lack of experience. Why then do airlines take on 1500h instructors?
I have accepted that I am not marketable without a green book and am trying to get that green book. Whilst I agree in part with good things come to those who wait, do you know how annoying it is to see friends who were half way through a ppl when i was a fATPL, go integrated and get four engined jets straight out of flying school? For me everybody should have to work their way up the aviation industry either with instructing, para dropping, glider towing, the bCPL was a good thing in my eyes. I enjoy my job, I enjoy flying, and I wouldn't swap my career path but there comes a time when you have to make things happen for yourself
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I am not doubting your motivation or frustration.
You may well have friends who are in the big jets but they are no doubt low down the food chain and probably accept this fact. Working constantly towards improvement.
You have hit the nail on the head, you are not marketable because you do not have experience and burning holes in the sky will not give it you with respect to getting an airline job IMHO.
I merely remarked on this thread because it strikes me you are looking for shortcuts to your goal. You think that zapping around in a spam can to short cut your way to an ATPL is going to make you better at driving a people tube. That worries me. Ask yourself why the airlines take these 200hr integrated students? Because they don't need experience of flying light aircraft it is because these people have demonstrated that they will follow the rules and process. Flying the airliner is the easy bit, that get's taught in the sim, the hard part is the decision making process and judgement. That is learnt on the line.
Just food for thought.
You may well have friends who are in the big jets but they are no doubt low down the food chain and probably accept this fact. Working constantly towards improvement.
You have hit the nail on the head, you are not marketable because you do not have experience and burning holes in the sky will not give it you with respect to getting an airline job IMHO.
I merely remarked on this thread because it strikes me you are looking for shortcuts to your goal. You think that zapping around in a spam can to short cut your way to an ATPL is going to make you better at driving a people tube. That worries me. Ask yourself why the airlines take these 200hr integrated students? Because they don't need experience of flying light aircraft it is because these people have demonstrated that they will follow the rules and process. Flying the airliner is the easy bit, that get's taught in the sim, the hard part is the decision making process and judgement. That is learnt on the line.
Just food for thought.
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Sorry bose i dont have that much time to post on pprune like you do, over 2700 posts to work on your english, very impressive. I bet you have ur Oxford dictionary next to you at all times. Great retort too btw (by the way). Guys like you and the spelling police have no real argument and reduce yourselves to correcting spelling/grammer to make yourself feel big/important. Oh i hope your not referring to moi as being low on the food chain... i'm knocking on the door of a command.... but i'm sure your a big wig at the flying club!
See i kinda have a life and job that takes me around the world. But hey i'll take ur advice when im next in the cruise for 9 hrs and practise hey?
Hay evry1 u dont neeed propa ingleesh 2 fly big airplains like meeeeee!!
I'm outta here... Peace
Good luck Pablo!
See i kinda have a life and job that takes me around the world. But hey i'll take ur advice when im next in the cruise for 9 hrs and practise hey?
Hay evry1 u dont neeed propa ingleesh 2 fly big airplains like meeeeee!!
I'm outta here... Peace
Good luck Pablo!
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Whilst i agree that flying a 152 and flying an airliner are two different things, command decisions and actual hand flying skills are taught in the sep's. Flying an airliner is fine but if all systems went i'd much rather have a 1000h instructor sat next to me than a 200h integrated guy. I passed all aptiude test for an integrated school, however financially it wasn't viable for me. Min hour first time pass in my IR suggests i'm within the top 23% of pilots, I believe that was the first time pass rate when I did it, no idea how many of them did it in min hours. As afr as I am aware there isn't any more difficult exams for integrated students than modular.
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Well easyrider, please tell us the airline you work for so that we can avoid it. With an aggressive attitude like yours I would want to give it a wide berth. There is no place for ego or aggression in the cockpit and you seem to have a large dose of both. You also demonstrate admirably why there is such a gulf between airline and private pilots.
I also have a life and a job that takes me around the world. I would bet in better style and with greater flexibility than you......
escobar, I have not questioned your ability of motivation. I understand how difficult the IR is, I passed mine in the minimum hours as well. Raw ability is not at question. Finding short cuts to an end goal was at question.
I would be perfectly happy sat behind a 200hr integrated student, knowing that they have been trained, (indoctrinated in fact) into following the rules and are subject to the same supervision and LPC as required of the guy with 1000hrs of Instructing. I have long held the view that a thousand hours in a spam can does not make for an airline pilot. I have several thousand hours in spam cans and do not think for one minute that would make me a good airline pilot.
I also have a life and a job that takes me around the world. I would bet in better style and with greater flexibility than you......
escobar, I have not questioned your ability of motivation. I understand how difficult the IR is, I passed mine in the minimum hours as well. Raw ability is not at question. Finding short cuts to an end goal was at question.
I would be perfectly happy sat behind a 200hr integrated student, knowing that they have been trained, (indoctrinated in fact) into following the rules and are subject to the same supervision and LPC as required of the guy with 1000hrs of Instructing. I have long held the view that a thousand hours in a spam can does not make for an airline pilot. I have several thousand hours in spam cans and do not think for one minute that would make me a good airline pilot.
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I feel that we should end this debate here. Obviously we both differ in our views towards the aviation industry. I am well aware that with only a couple of hundred hours instructing I am a better pilot than I ever was during my training. I have no doubt that after training a 200h wonderkid is in a much better position than I was with 200h to undertake a sim and ultimately a left hand seat with an airline. I have been in two emergency situations during my time with captains, the first was with a capt who had not been an instructor and he almost fell to pieces, the second was with an ex instructor and he carried on as if nothing had happened, trouble shooting, analyising, monitoring. I have been in 10s of "apparent emergency situations with students" ones that I remember happening when i was a student with an instructor and the instructor calmly taking controls and sorting it. Now I am that instructor calmly taking controls, my capacity has increased. Its also obvious the capts who have been instructors and who haven't. Ones who haven't want to just fly, ones who have will impart their knowledge. I'm much happier flying with ex instructors.
I speak from the bottom of the food chain, however it is very easy to forget when flying commercially and with auto-pilots, that we are pilots and not cockpit monitors. My company has employed guys who will get command when they hit their 500h multi crew, even though they only have sep time,providing they are good enough. My whole point was that I want to be in the position to get a shot at command when i hit my 2500h, company mins. I'm not finding shortcuts, i'm playing the game. When people are paying for integrated courses, buying time on type, is it not them that are taking short cuts?
To conclude my question has been answered, and I thank all contributors, how this topic has managed to take such a digresion is normal for pprune. Petty digs and back stabbing seems to be rife in the aviation industry, and hence when its anonymous this is heightened. Bose-x, whilst I have valued your input, was there any real need to question my dedication to my students? The post was mis-read by you, or possibly taken out of context but it was a snide post to make on a topic which had nothing to do with instructing.
My question has been answered so if any mods are about can you please lock this topic now? Thanks
I speak from the bottom of the food chain, however it is very easy to forget when flying commercially and with auto-pilots, that we are pilots and not cockpit monitors. My company has employed guys who will get command when they hit their 500h multi crew, even though they only have sep time,providing they are good enough. My whole point was that I want to be in the position to get a shot at command when i hit my 2500h, company mins. I'm not finding shortcuts, i'm playing the game. When people are paying for integrated courses, buying time on type, is it not them that are taking short cuts?
To conclude my question has been answered, and I thank all contributors, how this topic has managed to take such a digresion is normal for pprune. Petty digs and back stabbing seems to be rife in the aviation industry, and hence when its anonymous this is heightened. Bose-x, whilst I have valued your input, was there any real need to question my dedication to my students? The post was mis-read by you, or possibly taken out of context but it was a snide post to make on a topic which had nothing to do with instructing.
My question has been answered so if any mods are about can you please lock this topic now? Thanks
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If I read your post out of context with regard to Instructing then I apologise.
I am an Instructor myself an unfortunately come into contact all to often with the hours builders who are interested only in themselves and the hours they can accumulate for a 'proper' job. It does GA and themselves no justice.
I am an Instructor myself an unfortunately come into contact all to often with the hours builders who are interested only in themselves and the hours they can accumulate for a 'proper' job. It does GA and themselves no justice.
