JAR license in France

[skydriller]

Hi Bob,

I went through your exact predicament last year, and posted about it here:
:http://www.pprune.org/forums/showthr...France+JAA-PPL

As for

5) They checked with the local and Parisien Aviation Civil and were told that with a UK license and a Spanish medical, I could not legally solo in a French registered aircraft.

I think you have been mis-informed. The French accept a valid JAA Licence without question, which to be valid needs a JAA medical, It is the state of licence issue that accepts (or not) the medical, not France. I feel the poeple you have talked with are confused and think your licence is a French issued JAA licence, for which they naturally require a French Compliant Medical in order for it to be valid, as it isnt actually a full JAA-PPL.....

When I spoke with the French authorities last year (Possibly it was the senior French guy you refere to!!) it was suggested by them I should go to spain for a JAA compliant medical, as they know the DGAC one is not JAA compliant.....

I say again, if the CAA are happy your licence is a Valid JAA-PPL, then the French will accept it - get your aeroclub and the DGAC to phone the CAA Licencing Dept......Believe me , I went through this last year!!

Regards, SD..

[skydriller]

My JAA PPL(H) is due for renewal in May but I have decided to vote with my wings and am going to transfer it tot the French regime. Liberty,egality and cheap wine.

Thats a big decision, I think you should look into what is actually involved in Transfering your licence to French administration and what you will give up by doing it.

I too am a brit living here in France and have a UK issued JAA-PPL. I looked into this last year (see the link I placed above), and the DGAC wanted me to pass all the PPL theory exams again in french and then pay them a few hundred Euros for the previlidge of switching to French state JAA-PPL licence administration. The switch also results in my medical being valid for 2 years not 5 (or 1 instead of 2 depending upon age) and also means that although flying an F-reg is no different to before, I cannot legally fly an aeroplane of any other JAA registration outside of France (or even inside france depending upon the Reg...). Another thing to consider is the IMCR....

My decision was to hop on a flight to the UK pronto to get a JAA Compliant Medical.......

Regards, SD..

[BackPacker]

Did you guys ever tried getting a JAR-FCL Class 2 compliant medical in France, where an AME who is qualified to do JAR-FCL Class 1 medicals (after all, the French use these, as I understand) simply fills in the paperwork, and then sends the lot off to the UK to get the medical issued?

After all, you can get FAA medicals everywhere in Europe. Why not a JAR-FCL class 2 in France?

I know that a French AME will by default issue you a French national class 2 medical, but if you insist, would there be any reason for him not to do a JAR-FCL compliant examination?

[skydriller]

Backpacker,

At the time I didnt try, because I was told that there were no French AMEs able to issue JAA Class 2 medicals any longer, this is because all AMEs were autherised by the DGAC who now say the French Class 2 medical isnt JAA Compliant, Unlike a French Class 1 which is fully JAA compliant.

BUT I was told last summer by a guy working for airbus that there was someone in Toulouse doing JAA Medicals for Brits/Germans/Spanish etc at Airbus, HOWEVER, couldnt confirm it was for JAA class 2 Medicals and obviously it could have been for JAA Class 1.....

Regards, SD..

[BackPacker]

The way I see it is that the AME checks your health and then sends his findings to the appropriate aviation administration. It's the aviation administration who makes the decision whether you're fit to fly (based on these findings) and then issues you the medical.

So I'm only suggesting that it might just legally be possible for a French AME to fill in the appropriate British forms, send the whole lot to the UK CAA, who then issues you the JAR-FCL class 2 medical. Or, for that matter, fills in the appropriate Dutch forms, send the whole lot to the Dutch CAA (called the IVW actually), who then issues you the JAR-FCL class 2 medical.

But to be honest here... My medical is a Dutch JAR-FCL one, and I am by no means an expert on French aviation law when it comes to medicals. Maybe there is a rule somewhere that your medical has to be issued by your country of residence, or that aviation authorities only accept examination results from AMEs in their own country. Or something else making this scheme impossible.

[Maoraigh1]

There are two kinds of CAA issued JAR licences. When I changed address, the CAA issued me with a JAR license, with a new number, but without the wording "can be used in other states". This licence, like my old UK one, is for life.
They wanted to see my logbooks, and if I remember, Ł160 or so, to give me a time limited full JAR licence, "valid in other states".
By changing my licence number, they made my restricted FAA license invalid.

[skydriller]

There are two kinds of CAA issued JAR licences.

Really, I thought there was just the JAA-PPL and the old CAA PPL issued by FCL at Gatwick?

Regards, SD..

[bobdee]

Success!!!

Have to report that following a conversation with the Chef du bureau médical de la DCS PN, I have an Email confirming that my UK JAR license with Spanish medical is accepted by the admin to fly French Registered AC.

SD, I did read your previous posting and based on this I thought I had a good case. The difference was the Spanish medical.

LH2. You cant blame a club for being cautious in checking out license validity given you are flying their aircraft on their insurance.

Anyway. happiness reigns in this neck of the woods, and now I just have to complete my minimum hours by April to keep the license current.

I will still go the Spanish medical route next year. Cost about 100 euros and convenient if you can combine the need for a medical with a Spanish break.

I have to say that the folk at CAA medical did their best to help me at all times. Not their fault that the French have somewhat different rules. I still dont undestand why the French Class 2 medical is not accepted by other JAR states, but I think its more a case of French laws not allowing personal medical details to be passed to others. An amendment to existing privacy laws would apparently be required and this is a major thing in the French constitution.

Thanks to all those that participated in what has been an interesting thread.

BobD

[Whopity]

CAA also confirm that while there is no problem in French PPL's coming to UK in French registered aircraft, there is a problem, in fact its not legaly possible for a French PPL to hire and fly a UK registered aircraft, say for example on holiday in the UK. His French class 2 medical is not JAA and therefore not accepted as valid in the UK.

I don't know who told you that but its utter nonsence. So long as you hold a license and medical that comply with ICAO Annex 1 and its issued by an ICAO State e.g. France, then you can fly a UK registered aircraft in accordance with Article 26. They could of course say your UK issued licence is not valid with the French medical.

[bobdee]

Hi Whop.
As stated, the info was from the CAA medical section. The point, as has been repeated loadsa times.. The French Class 2 is not recognised by the UK or any other JAR' states. Call the CAA and get connected to the medical section and ask. Its no doubt a fine point but I guess its down to license validity and insurance status.

BobD

[Whopity]

Say no more; they may not accept it with a UK JAA licence but, their interpretation is incorrect with regard to the French medical on a French issued licence for renting a UK aircraft. Article 26 permits the operation of UK registered aircaraft on the basis of any ICAO licence JAA or otherwise.

[Zen Pilot]

JAR (& other) medicals in France

Apparently the Centre d'Expertise Medicale de Personnel Navigante Toulouse-Blagnac (www.cempn.com) can issue medicals that are fully recognised by DGAC, JAA, CAA and FAA. Class 1, Class 2, whatever you want ....
And access to anyone - not just Airbus - just make an appointment plus allegedly relatively low cost compared to UK AMEs.

[skydriller]

Bobdee,

Have you heard any more on this? I stand by what I said earlier about the JAA-PPL licence validity being the important thing for the French as a JAA-signatory state, as this is what needs to be recognised by the French. Your medical needs to be recognised as valid by the JAA/CAA who issue your licence, to make that licence valid. What did the top guy at the DGAC in Paris say?

Regards, SD..

[bobdee]

All OK

Hi SD,

I did post the good news as soon as it happened. Have a look at "Success".
Regs
BobD

[skydriller]

Great News BobDee!!

Sorry I missed it earlier