average hours to go solo

[pulse1]

I don't think that "time to solo" has much meaning when it comes to assessing one's prowess as a pilot.

I had a very similar route to powered flight as shortstripper but, thanks to some amazing instruction from two RAF test pilots, I soloed in 3.5 hours in a DH82A. Thirty years later with about 75 hours I started to fly again after a break of 23 years. This time it took me about 5 hours to solo in a Cessna 152.

This year I will celebrate, hopefully, having my PPL for forty years but, with over 300 hours in my logbook, I am only too painfully aware how slow I have been to learn some fairly basic aspects of flying that others seem to grasp very quickly. A big thanks to many pprune posters for helping me along the way.

[AerocatS2A]

Asking about what exercises had been done...that's a very good point. I'd be really interested to know too. So, for those of you who soloed in single digit hours, could you possibly post what exercises you'd done, and how long of each. Because I think you have to do at least a couple of hours of stall recovery. And I too can't see how you could fit it all in to less than ten hours, and I'm curious.

Ok, I solo'd relatively quickly, here are my first exercises:

Flight 1 - Trial flight
Flight 2 - Effects of controls
Flight 3 - Straight and level
Flight 4 - Climbing and descending and medium turns
Flight 5 - Basic stalls
Flight 6 - Circuits
Flight 7 - Circuits
Flight 8 - Circuits
Flight 9 - Circuit emergencies
Flight 10 - Circuits, diversion airfield check, engine failures
Flight 11 - Circuits
Flight 12 - Solo

Each flight was about half an hour (shortest 0.4, longest 0.7) in an uncongested environment requiring minimal transit times to the training area. I flew once a week as that was all I could afford. My instructor was aware of my finances and tried to be efficient with his training regime.

I'd also previously flown a glider to solo so many of the initial lessons were just a refresher.

[juliet india mike]

I think the number of landings is more important than total hours in the logbook. I soloed at 19 hours I had just over 80 landings, which is a function of how busy your airfield is, how fast your aircraft and how long your circuit. After 1st solo, everything happened really quickly to a point with circuit bashing, then slowed and went backwards after a 6 week gap and I had to relearn how to land before starting solo cross countries. Nevertheless I completed the general skills test at 46.3 hours and somehow regretted it a little because learning had been so much fun! Now however I am learning with every flight, just without a formal syllabus, and still having fun.

Looking back on it, time to solo is about as relevant as your grades at A level or your degree classification. Means nothing after a day has passed. (Except you'll remember it forever. It is definitely up there with getting married, birth of your children etc)

[Monkeeeey]

Solo at 25 hours after progress check with CFI

L1. Trial
L2. controls
L3. Straight and Level
L4. Use of Flaps
L5. Instrument flying
L6. Climbing/Descending
L7. Climbing/Descending
L8. Slow Flight/Low level flights
L9. Medium level turns/Climbing Turn/Descending Turn (power/flaps)
L10. Stall and Recovery
L11. Incipient Spin/ Recovery from unusual Attitudes
L12. First Circuits
L13. PFL's
L14. Circuits
L15. Flapless/Glide/EFATO
L16. Circuits
L17. Circuits
L18. Circuit Joins/ Overhead/Crosswind/Base
L19. Diversion X2 T/G at alternate
L20. Circuits
L21. Circuits
L22. Steep Turns/Compass Turns
L23. Circuits
L24. Circuits
L25. Progress check with CFI - SOLO

[Whirlygig]

Interesting Roger, that you didn't cover PFLs before your first solo.

Cheers

Whirls

[Monkeeeey]

Roger , your preflight briefings must have gone on for hours...

[digital.poet]

Very interesting folks, thanks for posting.

Roger, wow, you did cover a lot very quickly. I found it very difficult to keep the contents of a single pre-flight briefing in my head, but to come to terms with all that stuff in that speed is very impressive.

Whirly, actually I didn't really do any PFLs pre-solo either. I guess that the main part of PFL is to get yourself into a sensible orientation for a glide approach. In the circuit I am either in that position or too low in which case it is the EFATO, land ahead and upset the poor farmer a little, and upset his poor sheep quite a bit . An engine failure early down wind might have been a bit of a tricky situation. Would probably have to hope that any traffic taking off can get out of my way as I land back the wrong way. Failing that, there is a nice little golf course in that position. Apparently the golfers are always complaining about the noise even though the airfield predates the golf course by at least 50 years. I would love nothing more than to put it down on the fairway!

Monkeeeey, your pre-solo lessons look quite similar to mine. I am intrigued about how early you did instrument stuff though. Did you just have a marginal day and decide to drop it in rather than staying on the ground? Instrument flight before C&D and turning seems a little bizarre. Isn't this exactly what you did on instruments?

I have to say I enjoyed my instrument appreciation. Probably my favourite individual lesson with the exception of first solo. The 'fly for 2 minutes with your eyes closed' was a riot, I thought I was doing so well until my instructor told me to open my eyes, when I saw the clouds at 40 degrees across the screen the dialog went like this...

Me: Fffffffffu.......I was going to use a very rude word then
Instructor: Yes, I saw it forming on your lips



I hope the IMC remains viable for me to take after my PPL. I love being up above those clouds and actually find VOR navigation about a hundred times easier than visual nav.

[mad_jock]

well its all up to my ticket.

Although i will admit now I can't sign you off now.

I have sent folk out with 10 landings under thier belt if the gut says OK thats what I used to go on.

If you are pish you will solo in 20+ if you are **** hot you will solo in 5 hours.

It is my lic and its my call and its to be honests f*ck all to do with the student.

Sorry to be horrible but thats it. Our Lic our call and I never did and never will pander to trainees flying on my ticket when they are pish.

[shortstripper]

Our Lic our call and I never did and never will pander to trainees flying on my ticket when they are pish.

Is this a foreign langauge forum? Oh! I see you're a Scottish gentleman ... perhaps that explains it?

SS

[digital.poet]

Mad Jock,

Had I not had the foresight to look down and see your post count, I might have considered your post a windup.

It's probably best that I am not your student, aside from the obvious language barrier, I have a feeling we wouldn't exactly.... gel. What with me being 'pish' and you taking the attitude of my training having 'f*ck all to do with me'. My lawyer does not talk about me being 'pish' or tell me that the services he are provided are 'f*ck all to do with me'. As I pay a similar price for my flying training, I would expect a similar level of service. Fortunately, I get that from my current instructor.

I don't spend a huge amount of time north of the border so I am not entirely certain whether describing a person as 'pish' represents a suitable level of professionalism up there, but from my perspective that sounded very derogatory and as someone who was a 20+ solo student I take that fairly personally. I might not be the fast learner in the world, and perhaps I am slightly more cautious than most, I don't even mind being publicly criticised, I simply prefer that those that do criticise do so using a level of articulation greater than that of Rab C. Nesbitt.

Thanks

[Whirlygig]

I hope Mad Jock was "pish"ed when he wrote that!
Cheers

Whirls

[Whirlybird]

Rumour has it that Mad Jock is a hell of a nice guy and a very good instructor. He probably was 'pished' when he wrote that...or deciding to stir up the discussion a little bit. Well, sorry MJ, but this is a Rumour site.

[ShyTorque]

Asking about what exercises had been done...that's a very good point. I'd be really interested to know too. So, for those of you who soloed in single digit hours, could you possibly post what exercises you'd done, and how long of each. Because I think you have to do at least a couple of hours of stall recovery.

Whirly, to be honest, as it was thirty five years ago, I can't remember. The exercise numbers are in my original logbook (well into volume 5 now) but I think the syllabus has changed a few times since (e.g. no spinning now, we did that quite early on) so quoting them here wouldn't prove anything.

Whirls, PFLs were taught but they involved landing on the runway, or straight ahead if that wasn't possible (EFATO). A helicopter won't often make the runway from the circuit so PFLs per se (off airfield) are given more priority earlier.

The RAF fixed wing syllabus put PFLs away from the circuit near the back of the book. My Bulldog instructor course development notes have them at chapter Y!

[mad_jock]

Whirly's have it right. And yes it was a bit of a wind up.

There are so many things which effect the decision to send someone solo.

The training required is alot of the time dependent on the local area. Down south I can fully appreciate why the FI's need to require a far better grasp of more of the course than we did up north with no controlled airspace for miles around. The poor chap who crashed down south is an example of that. So it really is meaningless comparing times unless you were at the same field with the same instructor.

As for the language barrier, I can assure you that the instructor after me had to have a local dictionary given to him. The poor chap was from Devon and for a week was telling everyone he was away for fud for lunch. Which means something totally different up here.

[wsmempson]

There always seems to be a bit of a scramble to go solo quickly (which, I suspect, stems from the RAF training programme which used to wash-out students who didn't solo after a set no. of hours); ultimately, this doesn't seem to have much bearing on the quality of the 'finished' pilot, as those that solo quickly are sometimes slow to grasp RT or Nav.

There was one chap at our flying club who literally took hundreds of hours to get his PPL and I think he fell into the camp of those who really shouldn't be flying at all - like little old ladies on their 12th attempt at a driving test - otherwise most people tend to solo at somewhere between 10 and 30 hrs.

However, if you're learning to fly, I wouldn't obsess about this issue - just enjoy the experience of learning. It'll happen when you are ready and not before!!

[Shortsighted Gink]

20hrs to solo at the age of 44; flying 2 hrs a month.

Though the only people who are at all interested in posing the question are those yet to solo; the point being after it's been done

it simply doesn't matter!!!!

[digital.poet]

Whirly's have it right. And yes it was a bit of a wind up.

Haha, I did suspect this but wasn't completely sure. In which case, I apologise for going all surly on you

[silvereagle]

9.5 on fixed wing and 8.2 on rotary - but that was military - and a long time ago! I tend to agree with those who have been saying - it doesn't matter. Also the vast number of hours that some people have in their log books doesn't really matter either. It is currency (or recency) that matters. I would rather fly with someone who has flown recently rather than someone who has a dusty old log book tucked away. We had a rule in my unit that if you hadn't flown for 31 days you flew with a QHI (Qualified Helicopter Instructor) before you went back on the line.

[Monkeeeey]

mad_jock

The poor chap who crashed down south is an example of that

Correct my intructor did make it clear to me that processes had changed at most airfields/schools since that tragic incident. To send someone with just 5 hours at EGKA on a weekend would be insane.

Digital.Poet

I am intrigued about how early you did instrument stuff though.

Thats how i did my first rate 1 turn :-)

It was my instructor proving a point, she noticed that I used the instruments too much and kept my eyes inside for far to long. Made me wear those funny glasses and then asked me to climb/turn/decsend did ok with that. While climbing she sneakily applied a little rudder, I did not notice that the AC had started to bank until I had looked back at the DI/AI, could not feel it at all. Lesson learnt about using your horizon as a reference and keeping your eyes outside as much as possible.

[mad_jock]

digi no need, you were quite right sticking up for yourself.

I am sure you wern't pish when you went solo. Otherwise you wouldn't have been sent. And pish isn't to bad actually only one up to "you will do"

I haven't been solo for years, would seem now very strange not having someone sitting next to me taking the mick out of my landings.