Flying the "Tin Parachute"
Thread Starter
Joined: Feb 2002
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From: Enniskillen
nose up - loads of power and stop in the width of the runway
Find what the POH short field approach speed is and don't go below that, you will find that will be short enough.
I really must come over and get a flight with you sometime.
Tony
Joined: Apr 2001
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From: London UK
Tony
I think Koli is exaggerating slightly :0)
Although, I do like to demo the aircraft to its full potential. Strangely, there doesn't seem to be a massive amount of advantage to back side of the curve approach in the Koliber/Rallaye. I think that the drag increase is so dramatic in the flare that it does the same job as waffling in under a touch of 'puissance'!
Hover-taxiing is also a bit of a giggle - especially on a quiet day at EGSX. I've tried to land going backwards in a strong wind but never managed it (nagging notion that it wasn't a good idea based on the fact that I've never managed to push any Koliber or Rallaye backwards without a tow bar).
Having flown some serious STOL machines I don't know of any aircraft which has such accessible short field performance - ease of use is the issue, really.
Koli - You have my email, just drop me a line whenever you want to do some more flying...
I think Koli is exaggerating slightly :0)
Although, I do like to demo the aircraft to its full potential. Strangely, there doesn't seem to be a massive amount of advantage to back side of the curve approach in the Koliber/Rallaye. I think that the drag increase is so dramatic in the flare that it does the same job as waffling in under a touch of 'puissance'!
Hover-taxiing is also a bit of a giggle - especially on a quiet day at EGSX. I've tried to land going backwards in a strong wind but never managed it (nagging notion that it wasn't a good idea based on the fact that I've never managed to push any Koliber or Rallaye backwards without a tow bar).
Having flown some serious STOL machines I don't know of any aircraft which has such accessible short field performance - ease of use is the issue, really.
Koli - You have my email, just drop me a line whenever you want to do some more flying...
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From: South East
Hi Tony R
Nice to meet you the other day. Next time your accross, come and try it with 180 horses!
All the best
Wide
PS trying to pluck up courage to take the YAK accross all that water to BFS in June. If I do can I PM you for advice?
Nice to meet you the other day. Next time your accross, come and try it with 180 horses!
All the best
Wide
PS trying to pluck up courage to take the YAK accross all that water to BFS in June. If I do can I PM you for advice?
Thread Starter
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From: Enniskillen
Hi Wide-Body,
Nice to meet you too,
I have flown a lot in 180s and 235s but I still think the 100 is the most pleasent, just a bit slow.
You'll be very welcome in N Ireland and EGAB (Ennislillen) is re-opening soon. Parking at EGAA can be expensive and my 340M strip might be a bit short for the YAK.
Let me know when and we'll meet up.
M14P,
We get a lot of very strong westerlys in Donegal and with a 03/21 R/W we used to "Hover-taxi" sideways down the r/w and just land into wind accross the r/w. Not many pilots of US built cans would go flying in 40 knots
I am sure those who have never flown a Rallye to the limits will think were full of !!!!!.
Tony
Nice to meet you too,
I have flown a lot in 180s and 235s but I still think the 100 is the most pleasent, just a bit slow.
You'll be very welcome in N Ireland and EGAB (Ennislillen) is re-opening soon. Parking at EGAA can be expensive and my 340M strip might be a bit short for the YAK.
Let me know when and we'll meet up.
M14P,
We get a lot of very strong westerlys in Donegal and with a 03/21 R/W we used to "Hover-taxi" sideways down the r/w and just land into wind accross the r/w. Not many pilots of US built cans would go flying in 40 knots
I am sure those who have never flown a Rallye to the limits will think were full of !!!!!.
Tony
Gnome de PPRuNe
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From: Too close to Croydon for comfort
Dunno whether Maurice Seree (Serat?) operated across the runway at Bggin, but believe he did fly backwards at Biggin on one memorable windy occasion. Also flew the cave episode. Check through the Miles thread on Aviation History and Nostalgia to see Aerohack's reminiscences of flying with Maurice! Flew in G-BAOI with the Scouts in 75, courtesy of Air Touring Services out of Biggin... great fun!
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From: London UK
My Dad related a story of someone trying to emulate the taking-off-across-the-runway heroics at Stapleford in the 70's. 'Twas a Franklin-bemotored version, I think. Anyway, 28 (29 then) was much narrower than it is now and the chap blasted off (after bar-room swaggering) straight from his parking spot towards the crop...
...and through it...
...and then into the air.
Would've loved to have seen that. High speed combine harvesting.
...and through it...
...and then into the air.
Would've loved to have seen that. High speed combine harvesting.
to sail beyond the sunset
Joined: Oct 2002
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From: Dublin
Tony,
Seems an excessive load of weaponry even for NI
(Ducks and runs)
Although, Didn't some balaclava wearing persons hijack a Rallye from Dundalk Flying Club in the bad old days and try to drop a milkchurn bomb on an RUC station?
Damn nice airplanes.
Seems an excessive load of weaponry even for NI
(Ducks and runs)
Although, Didn't some balaclava wearing persons hijack a Rallye from Dundalk Flying Club in the bad old days and try to drop a milkchurn bomb on an RUC station?
Damn nice airplanes.
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From: UK
Flew in G-BAOI with the Scouts in 75, courtesy of Air Touring Services out of Biggin... great fun!
The story goes that they were all put in the, then new, hangar one night. The next morning some wag commented that opening the hangar doors was a bit like opening a packet of Corn Flakes
Treadigraph ...were you still flying there in 1978? I joined then to fly the Rallye 150ST.
Regards
Gnome de PPRuNe
Joined: Jan 2002
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From: Too close to Croydon for comfort
Ah, I wasn't piloting, I was one of the Scouts! Spots and all... We took an aerial look at Brands Hatch.
I remember the BAO. sequence (Spotters Anorak was in place in those days) but not the colours! But I can well imagine the scene!
I was a fairly frequent visitor to Biggin then, quite content to sit on the grass between Sportair and the threshold of 29 (or whatever it was) and watch the aeroplanes come and go. Security chap used to stop and have a chat... It was an airfield then, not the Bizport it seems to have become now. Sorry, back to Rallyes...
Cheers
Treadders
I remember the BAO. sequence (Spotters Anorak was in place in those days) but not the colours! But I can well imagine the scene!
I was a fairly frequent visitor to Biggin then, quite content to sit on the grass between Sportair and the threshold of 29 (or whatever it was) and watch the aeroplanes come and go. Security chap used to stop and have a chat... It was an airfield then, not the Bizport it seems to have become now. Sorry, back to Rallyes...
Cheers
Treadders
Joined: Dec 2000
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From: UK
Oops !!
Sorry Treaders for ageing you prematurely, I leapt to the wrong conclusion.
I probably taxied past you more than a few times en-route Air Touring to the 29 threshold in a variety of Rallyes. As Air touring were (still are) the UK distributor we got our hands on quite a few variants. The 220hp Minerva is still my favourite.
Regards
Sorry Treaders for ageing you prematurely, I leapt to the wrong conclusion.
I probably taxied past you more than a few times en-route Air Touring to the 29 threshold in a variety of Rallyes. As Air touring were (still are) the UK distributor we got our hands on quite a few variants. The 220hp Minerva is still my favourite.
Regards
Gnome de PPRuNe
Joined: Jan 2002
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From: Too close to Croydon for comfort
No offence taken, SATCO, most people think I'm younger than I actually am! 
Do you remember the French Rallye Agricole taildragger that banged its chin (and bent the prop) on 29's threshold returning to Tarbes from Farnborough in 1978 ?
I suspect it was a combination of power against brakes and a strong breeze down the active... The last I saw of it, it was being manhandled back towards ATS... Phil Meeosn's Pitts departed around the same time and went up like a lift...
SOCATA used to send quite a fleet of Rallye sub-types to the SBAC - that Guerrier (?) in TonyR's pic was one of the exhibits as well.
Cheers
Treadders
Do you remember the French Rallye Agricole taildragger that banged its chin (and bent the prop) on 29's threshold returning to Tarbes from Farnborough in 1978 ?
I suspect it was a combination of power against brakes and a strong breeze down the active... The last I saw of it, it was being manhandled back towards ATS... Phil Meeosn's Pitts departed around the same time and went up like a lift...
SOCATA used to send quite a fleet of Rallye sub-types to the SBAC - that Guerrier (?) in TonyR's pic was one of the exhibits as well.
Cheers
Treadders
Joined: Apr 2000
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From: South East
Hi Tony
I think you win on the armament stakes, but my baby would look the part before you shot it down
:http://www.!!!!!!!!!!!!!!/open.file/340327/M/
I am still debating if I have enough courage to go from Anglesy direct. I think your strip is a bit small. I would take the Rallye but my mates in EGAA tower want to play with the 52.
Will get in touch when I make up my mind
All the best
Wide
I think you win on the armament stakes, but my baby would look the part before you shot it down
:http://www.!!!!!!!!!!!!!!/open.file/340327/M/
I am still debating if I have enough courage to go from Anglesy direct. I think your strip is a bit small. I would take the Rallye but my mates in EGAA tower want to play with the 52.
Will get in touch when I make up my mind
All the best
Wide
Thread Starter
Joined: Feb 2002
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From: Enniskillen
Hi Wide,
What about Strumble to the Wexford coast, or if you really dont want too much water Portpatrick in Scotland (just west of Stranarar) to the N Ireland coast.
My view is, once your a couple of miles over water your swimming anyway.
Would love a flight in the 52, I had a short flight in one a few years ago.
Tony
What about Strumble to the Wexford coast, or if you really dont want too much water Portpatrick in Scotland (just west of Stranarar) to the N Ireland coast.
My view is, once your a couple of miles over water your swimming anyway.
Would love a flight in the 52, I had a short flight in one a few years ago.
Tony
Joined: Dec 2000
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From: UK
Do you remember the French Rallye Agricole taildragger that banged its chin (and bent the prop) on 29's threshold returning to Tarbes from Farnborough in 1978 ?
I was one of a party of volunteers who helped out on the stand at Farnborough a couple of years later. During one of the frequent rain showers I took shelter in an Ag Rallye, God knows why because it was a bit wiffy. They also produced a 235hp taildragging 4 seat tourer at that time as well.
The old 100hp MS880B Rallye was replaced in the 2nd generation by the Rallye 110ST powered by the same Lycoming engine as everything else in those days (PA38, C152 etc). I didn't find the new model to be very inspiring. Also the coarser prop gave it a better cruise speed but made it difficult to taxy out of the long grass that often surrounded Air Touring. It got nicknamed the 'Ground gripper' by some instructors to fit in with the other 'G' names SOCATA had given the range (Galerien, Gurrier, Garnement etc) (excuse the spelling).
Regards
Gnome de PPRuNe
Joined: Jan 2002
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From: Too close to Croydon for comfort
Yep, '78 - time flies! (But slowly in a Rallye)
I'm surprised SOCATA didn't call one Gourmand especially for those trips across La Manche to Le Touquet for lunch!
I'm surprised SOCATA didn't call one Gourmand especially for those trips across La Manche to Le Touquet for lunch!
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From: london
pulling full flap on take off, must tell you this story.
when i was a very raw ppl a chap who lived over near hereford talked me into landing in a field called english bickenor. the rally coped admirably but the field was nothing like i had ever seen, there wasnt one level section.
i said to him how the fxxxk am i going to get out of here. its easy he said. we push the a/c up the the last bit of the hill into the corner of the field. you select full power and when you get some speed up i pull on full flap. sounded like he knew what he was talking about so i gave it a go.
the top of the field was at an alarming angle and to say i was scared would be an understatement.
we bounced across this field with the hedge coming up very quiclky. just when i thought for christ sake do something, i heard a little voice say " i cant get the flap on". there was no airspeed on the clock but i pulled back on the stick anyway. we sailed over the hedge and landed in the next field, continued the take off and got airborne. that was thirty years ago and i have never been into a short field since.
still friends with alf benjamin though!!!!
when i was a very raw ppl a chap who lived over near hereford talked me into landing in a field called english bickenor. the rally coped admirably but the field was nothing like i had ever seen, there wasnt one level section.
i said to him how the fxxxk am i going to get out of here. its easy he said. we push the a/c up the the last bit of the hill into the corner of the field. you select full power and when you get some speed up i pull on full flap. sounded like he knew what he was talking about so i gave it a go.
the top of the field was at an alarming angle and to say i was scared would be an understatement.
we bounced across this field with the hedge coming up very quiclky. just when i thought for christ sake do something, i heard a little voice say " i cant get the flap on". there was no airspeed on the clock but i pulled back on the stick anyway. we sailed over the hedge and landed in the next field, continued the take off and got airborne. that was thirty years ago and i have never been into a short field since.
still friends with alf benjamin though!!!!
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From: Here and There
whatunion,
That all sounded a bit too scary for me, did you need to change the Y fronts when you landed?
The Rallye must be a hell of an aircraft as it seems to have kept people out of trouble when doing really silly things.
I suppose Tony R has a point then of having full flap set before starting the take off run. if anything jamed the flap or the breaker poped when you really needed it one could repeat your experience, perhaps not having a next field to continue.
I think after reading this thread I will be going for a Rallye, apart from them being slow and the problems with rust there is not much negitive to say about them.
Ken
That all sounded a bit too scary for me, did you need to change the Y fronts when you landed?
The Rallye must be a hell of an aircraft as it seems to have kept people out of trouble when doing really silly things.
I suppose Tony R has a point then of having full flap set before starting the take off run. if anything jamed the flap or the breaker poped when you really needed it one could repeat your experience, perhaps not having a next field to continue.
I think after reading this thread I will be going for a Rallye, apart from them being slow and the problems with rust there is not much negitive to say about them.
Ken