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5 injured due turbulence

Old 25th Jun 2014, 21:55
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5 injured due turbulence

Five injured on Spain-bound Ryanair flight - The Local

Last edited by S.o.S.; 26th Jun 2014 at 13:48. Reason: Please stick to the facts as reported. Thanks.
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Old 25th Jun 2014, 22:16
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But I thought seat belts weren't necessary?

Seatbelts on planes are pointless, says Ryanair boss - Telegraph

I particularly liked the bit about

We're not talking about areas of huge turbulence around Europe
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Old 26th Jun 2014, 11:56
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Those who did help the injured were not medical professionals and had to use plastic bags and tissue as cabin crew told them only doctors could use the first aid kit.
If this is true, this is truly worrying! It implies that the cabin crew weren't trained to use the contents, as they are also not doctors. Personally, I thought the contents of first aid kits were there to be used on people who have the need, like those bleeding profusely. The cabin crew I work with wouldn't hesitate to open one for an injured person. Or is there a charge for their use on this airline?
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Old 26th Jun 2014, 12:24
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Well, if they're not trained on using the medical kit, then what exactly do they do on their six week cabin crew course costing several thousands of pounds. We all know very little of it is customer service and SEP can be covered in way less time so what exactly do they do on their course? I'm not bashing (no doubt the resident LCC bashers will be along in a minute too) but I'm actually curious.

A good portion on my training back when I was crew was using the the contents of the first aid kit. Granted some airbus spec stuff was not covered (usually because our own kit provided was superior) but we certainly had kit for breaks, sprains and severe bleeds, in addition to the over the counter medication we could give out (pointless as in most cases the plane had landed before the medication had chance to take hold).

Airlines with defribs have trained crew, and step by step instructions are given out by them anyway, so I'm curious as to what the doctors kit is and why the crew couldn't use it, and why regular av med first aid kits could not be opened.

I realise if there are no seals or a product goes below a minimum then engineering have to repack them at a significant cost but I find it unbelievable that this could have happened.
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Old 26th Jun 2014, 15:17
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It isn't a 'first-aid' kit, it's a "Emergency Medical Kit" and it contains medicines and tools that are best not touched by non-medicals. Dr's, Nurses and Paramedics are trained in the use of the contents. Flight attendants, with just six weeks training, are not.

I am surprised that Cryanair doesn't carry 'first-aid' kits with basically the same stuff as I have in my car. They must have the need for basic plasters (band-aids), gauze, tape and scissors (although the later might never make it through security).

From another forum I found this as being standard on one Network airline:

First Aid Kit:

Adhesive bandage compresses, 1-inch
Antiseptic swabs
Ammonia inhalants
Bandage compresses, 4-inch
Triangular bandage compresses, 40-inch
Arm splint, noninflatable
Leg splint, noninflatable
Roller bandage, 4-inch
Adhesive tape, 1-inch standard roll
Bandage scissors

Emergency Medical Kit:

Blood pressure cuff
Stethoscope
Tourniquet (rubber)
Air ways
Antiseptic Wipes
Epinephrine 1:1,000
Syringes
Needles
Latex gloves (pair)
Diphenhydramine for injection
Dextrose for injection
Nitroglycerin tablets
Self-inflating resuscitation device (masks)
CPR masks
IV admin. set
Alcohol sponges
Adhesive tape
Scissors
Saline solution
Analgesic
Antihistamine tablets
Atropine
Aspirin tablets
Bronchodilator
Lidocaine
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Old 26th Jun 2014, 15:21
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And for US airlines:

Appendix A to Part 121 of Title 14 of the Code of Federal Regulations (14 CFR 121) includes the specific requirements for US carriers:

For 0-50 seats, one kit is required, 51-150 two kits are required, 151-250 requires three, and more than 250 requries 4 kits.

That kit must include, at a minimum:
16 Adhesive bandage compresses, 1-inch
20 Antiseptic swabs
10 Ammonia inhalants
8 Bandage compresses, 4-inch
5 Triangular bandage compresses, 40-inch
1 Arm splint, noninflatable
1 Leg splint, noninflatable
4 Roller bandage, 4-inch
2 Adhesive tape, 1-inch standard roll
1 Bandage scissors

Also, at least one approved medical kit must be on board that includes, at a minimum:
1 Sphygmonanometer
1 Stethoscope
3 Airways, oropharyngeal (3 sizes): 1 pediatric, 1 small adult, 1 large adult or equivalent.
Self-inflating manual resuscitation device with 3 masks (1 pediatric, 1 small adult, 1 large adult or equivalent).
CPR mask (3 sizes), 1 pediatric, 1 small adult, 1 large adult, or equivalent.
1 IV Admin Set: Tubing w/ 2 Y connectors
2 Alcohol sponges
1 Adhesive tape, 1-inch standard roll adhesive.
1 pair Tape scissors
1 Tourniquet
1 Saline solution, 500 cc
1 pair Protective nonpermeable gloves or equivalent
6 Needles (2-18 ga., 2-20 ga., 2-22 ga., or sizes necessary to administer required medications).
4 Syringes (1-5 cc, 2-10 cc, or sizes necessary to administer required medications).
4 Analgesic, non-narcotic, tablets, 325 mg
4 Antihistamine tablets, 25 mg
2 Antihistamine injectable, 50 mg, (single dose ampule or equivalent).
2 Atropine, 0.5 mg, 5 cc (single dose ampule or equivalent).
4 Aspirin tablets, 325 mg
1 Bronchodilator, inhaled (metered dose inhaler or equivalent).
1 Dextrose, 50%/50 cc injectable, (single dose ampule or equivalent).
2 Epinephrine 1:1000, 1 cc, injectable, (single dose ampule or equivalent).
2 Epinephrine 1:10,000, 2 cc, injectable, (single dose ampule or equivalent).
2 Lidocaine, 5 cc, 20 mg/ml, injectable (single dose ampule or equivalent).
10 Nitroglycerin tablets, 0.4 mg
1 Basic instructions for use of the drugs in the kit.

Also, "At least one approved automated external defibrillator, legally marketed in the United States in accordance with Food and Drug Administration requirements" must be stored in the passenger cabin.
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Old 26th Jun 2014, 19:59
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"the aircraft dipped at a 60 degree angle".

I somehow doubt this. Even over the choppiest of waters across the Atlantic, a heavy airliner won't drop more than 50ft without correcting itself?
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Old 26th Jun 2014, 20:33
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A medical emergency kit? So what if it contains things that are "dangerous." You ignore the things that you don't know how to use and use the things you do. Which leads to the next question: What exactly are the cabin crew trained to do to help injured passengers? Get the passenger's money out if their wallet to buy scratch cards? And do doctors actually fly on this "caring, " and "we'll try not to p!ss people off unnecessarily" airline?
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Old 27th Jun 2014, 08:42
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Both types are on the aircrafts' Minimum Equipment List. The aircraft cannot operate further flights without an unopened kit(s). They don't carry spares and it is unlikely that an airline would maintain a store at outstations. They are expensive, contain products with 'use-before dates', and could be subject to on-ground pilferage.

Mind you I would imagine that some airports - Goose Bay, Gander, St. Johns, Bangor, for example, have an adequate supply to sell to diverted flights.

I'm not saying that in this circumstance the cabin crew should not have used some stuff from the kit, but that there is a good reason why they are not used 'every-day' for non-emergencies.
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Old 27th Jun 2014, 09:25
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Stupid SLF

Leaving aside for the moment first aid kits, if passengers actually listened to the safety briefing and ensured that they kept their seat belts fastened except when moving about the cabin then the chances of injury due to unforeseen turbulence would be drastically reduced.

We have all heard the "mass clicking" of seat belts the moment the "fasten seat belts" sign is turned off and frankly these people bring it upon themselves. It also beggars belief why so many passengers find it necessary to move around the cabin on a short haul flight. Your average bladder ought to be able to hold onto it's contents for 3 or 4 hours, and anyway, aircraft toilets aren't exactly great places to use.

Don't airports have toilets these days?
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Old 27th Jun 2014, 09:26
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ExXB - While I accept what you say about the kits being on the MEL, I don't accept your reasoning behind it. If there is something in the aircraft which can help an injured passenger, it should and must be used. After all, the cabin crew are NOT medically qualified, so it's not up to them to judge. If opening the kits grounds the aircraft, then so be it. That is the price for going with the absolute minimum equipment and/or failing to have the option to release down to the MMEL or a "one-off" release. It's a risk the airline took and now they get their return. I also find it difficult to accept the "on-ground pilferage" or the expiry date comments as reasons for not using the kits. Presumably, the kit are stowed away and closed and if a something is in date, it can be used.

And while we are here, if the cabin crew won't open the kits, why bother even having the kits at all? I also wonder if the carrier charged for the mess the bleeding passengers made on the straw on the floor or the benches.

To passengers reading this thread may I suggest that this is another good reason as to why you should take care in choosing who you fly with. A company who cares about their passengers would have opened the kits, used the contents and sorted out the mess on arrival. Remember, when some LoCo chief executives fly for pleasure, they fly BA First Class!
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Old 27th Jun 2014, 09:54
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Not a fan of Ryanair but let's not jump to conclusions. We might not know the full story yet.

Suffice to say, some airlines do carry medic kits. Depending on airline these can contain items such as a stethoscope right through to hard drugs to aid cardiac arrest and controlled substances for pain relief. Crew aren't trained to use these so it's absolutely right that passengers aren't able to either.

That said, basic items to treat injuries such as those consistent with turbulence should be available for cabin crew to use.

Like I say though, whilst I dislike Ryanair, I'm not passing judgement as I wasn't there. I also know how colourful passenger tales can be and you often hear passengers cooking up myths about why things are done this way or that way.

I just find it a bit far fetched to believe that even Ryanair crew would sit back and watch injured passengers suffer.
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Old 27th Jun 2014, 12:05
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Ok, I'll repeat myself

I'm not saying that in this circumstance the cabin crew should not have used some stuff from the kit, but that there is a good reason why they are not used 'every-day' for non-emergencies.
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Old 27th Jun 2014, 17:28
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As per the newspaper article 3 of the 4 cabin crew on board were injured so that would just leave 1 crew to deal with 5 injuries. I very much doubt the 6 week training course includes how to deal with 5 different injuries at once, on your own, likely at different ends of the aircraft.

Fair play to whoever that crew member was, I think they deserve a lot more respect that some posters are giving them.
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Old 27th Jun 2014, 21:30
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And while we are here, if the cabin crew won't open the kits, why bother even having the kits at all?
Perhaps they might be useful to a doctor on board?

My daughter is a surgeon and has responded on several flights to CC requesting the assistance of a medical doctor
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