Why Flying in the USA Sucks
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214,
No problem. As soon as I can afford it. Which means higher fares and therefore higher salaries! 
by coughing up more for your milk, bread, clothes, daily paper, furniture, TV set and bus ticket
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Newspapers...when USAToday came out, it was fifty cents an issue...it is now 75 cents...
but I've seen my pay go down since then.
THIS THREAD has gotten more responses than I could imagine. and I hope all the pilots out there start to take back our profession...and don't count on ALPA to do it for you.
but I've seen my pay go down since then.
THIS THREAD has gotten more responses than I could imagine. and I hope all the pilots out there start to take back our profession...and don't count on ALPA to do it for you.
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Not sure why the USA has been picked on for this vitriol... As a pilot... and from time to time SLF, and a frequent flyer internationally and domestically throughout Europe and the US and many points beyond, I would say that flying (as SLF) sucks internationally....
If I could drive and take boats I would prefer it every time... Personally I would be much happier if airline ticket prices doubled and LCCs were banned... I could then turn up at the airport and experience a civilised atmosphere... few delays... pleasant staff... and work with pilots of greater experience who lived happier lives and bitched less...
In addition my favourite parts of the Mediterranean and Caribbean would be less cluttered with sweaty red faced
heads from the wrong side of town.
If I could drive and take boats I would prefer it every time... Personally I would be much happier if airline ticket prices doubled and LCCs were banned... I could then turn up at the airport and experience a civilised atmosphere... few delays... pleasant staff... and work with pilots of greater experience who lived happier lives and bitched less...
In addition my favourite parts of the Mediterranean and Caribbean would be less cluttered with sweaty red faced
heads from the wrong side of town.
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I still have to laugh...
...when Alfred Kahn said (paraphrased), 'with deregulation, now everyone will be able to fly'....
And, I, after almost 30 years of deregulation, ask, 'Yes, but should they?'
I remember the clientele before deregulation. Now, I see what we're carrying these days. Admittedly, a lot of the nonsense that we see on airplanes these days is due to changes in social culture...but a lot of it is due to people leaving their trailers and flying to Alabama. (Oh, I really love Alabama...just joking!!!!)
Back in the days of PeopleExpress (a.k.a. People's Distress), the fares were so cheap, welfare recipients would fly from state to state to collect welfare from several sources. (The sister of a good freind of mine is a honcho in the Justice Department...her office investigates this particular kind of fraud.)
Over the years, we've had in the cabin, fist fights, food fights, screwing, illegal drug sales, illegal drug use, sexual assault, ...well, the list goes on...
A classic (in my mind) was when some company vice president on some international flight (I think he was either drunk or on cocaine...maybe both.) became upset with the cabin service, jumped up on the serving cart, dropped his pants, squatted, and took a XXXX.
I and my crew were waiting at the gate for our aircraft...someone was there to pick up an arriving passenger (some relative) (pre-911), and he asked the gate agent when the plane would arrive. The agent told him the plane was going to be about 15 minutes early, because 'the plane had a tailwind'.
The man's reply, "The plane has a tailwind....You ought to put those tailwinds on all your aircraft!"
And, Alfred Kahn was right..... Now everyone DOES fly.
PantLoad
And, I, after almost 30 years of deregulation, ask, 'Yes, but should they?'
I remember the clientele before deregulation. Now, I see what we're carrying these days. Admittedly, a lot of the nonsense that we see on airplanes these days is due to changes in social culture...but a lot of it is due to people leaving their trailers and flying to Alabama. (Oh, I really love Alabama...just joking!!!!)
Back in the days of PeopleExpress (a.k.a. People's Distress), the fares were so cheap, welfare recipients would fly from state to state to collect welfare from several sources. (The sister of a good freind of mine is a honcho in the Justice Department...her office investigates this particular kind of fraud.)
Over the years, we've had in the cabin, fist fights, food fights, screwing, illegal drug sales, illegal drug use, sexual assault, ...well, the list goes on...
A classic (in my mind) was when some company vice president on some international flight (I think he was either drunk or on cocaine...maybe both.) became upset with the cabin service, jumped up on the serving cart, dropped his pants, squatted, and took a XXXX.
I and my crew were waiting at the gate for our aircraft...someone was there to pick up an arriving passenger (some relative) (pre-911), and he asked the gate agent when the plane would arrive. The agent told him the plane was going to be about 15 minutes early, because 'the plane had a tailwind'.
The man's reply, "The plane has a tailwind....You ought to put those tailwinds on all your aircraft!"
And, Alfred Kahn was right..... Now everyone DOES fly.
PantLoad
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By Alan H. Hess. Originally published in Travel Weekly, October 1998.
==============================================
** Buying paint from a hardware store **
Customer: Hi, how much is your interior flat latex paint in Bone White?
Clerk: We have a medium quality, which is $16 a gallan, and premium,
which is $22 a gallon. How many gallons would you like?
Customer: I'll take five gallons of the medium quality, please.
Clerk: That will be $80 plus tax.
==============================================
** Buying paint from an airline **
Customer: Hi, how much is your paint?
Clerk: Well, sir, that all depends.
Customer: Depends on what?
Clerk: Actually a lot of things.
Customer: How about giving me an average price?
Clerk: Wow, that's too hard a question. The lowest price is $9 a gallon, and we have 150 different prices up to $200 a gallon.
Customer: What's the difference in the paint?
Clerk: Oh, there isn't any difference; it's all the same paint.
Customer: Well, then, I'd like some of that $9 paint.
Clerk: Well, first I need to ask you a few questions. W hen do you intend to use it?
Customer: I want to paint tomorrow, on my day off.
Clerk: Sir, the paint for tomorrow is the $200 paint.
Customer: What? When would I have to paint in order to get the $9 version?
Clerk: That would be in three weeks, but you will also have to agree to start painting before Friday of that week and continue painting until at least Sunday.
Customer: You've got to be kidding!
Clerk: Sir, we don't kid around here. Of course, I'll have to check to see if we have any of that paint available before I can sell it to you.
Customer: What do you mean check to see if you can sell it to me? You have shelves full of that stuff; I can see it right there.
Clerk: Just because you can see it doesn't mean that we have it. It may be the same paint, but we sell only a certain number of gallons on any given week. Oh, and by the way, the price just went to $12.
Customer: You mean the price went up while we were talking?
Clerk: Yes, sir. You see, we change prices and rules thousands of times a day, and since you haven't actually walked out of the store with your paint yet, we just decided to change. Unless you want the same thing to happen again, I would suggest that you get on with your purchase. How many gallons do you want?
Customer: I don't know exactly. Maybe five gallons. Maybe I should buy six gallons just to make sure I have enough.
Clerk: Oh, no, sir, you can't do that. If you buy the paint and then don't use it, you will be liable for penalties and possible confiscation of the paint you already have.
Customer: What?
Clerk: That's right. We can sell you enough paint to do your kitchen, bathroom, hall, and north bedroom, but if you stop painting before you do the bedroom, you will violation of our tariffs.
Customer: But what does it mater to your whether I use all the paint? I already paid for it!
Clerk: Sir, there's no point in getting upset; that's just the way it is. We make plans upon the idea that you will use all the paint, and when you don't, it just causes us all kinds of problems.
Customer: This is crazy! I suppose something terrible will happen if I don't keep painting until after Saturday night!
Clerk: Yes, sir, it will.
Customer: Well, that does it! I'm going somewhere else to buy my paint.
Clerk: That won't do you any good, sir. We all have the same rules.
To be fair, the issue with airlines is to be found in any business today, and that is executives who are pulling in obscene renumeration packages, and think of nothing except their next bonus/share options etc. I think it was an old time Edwards test pilot who put it thus,
"We, the generation of the depression, World War II and the postwar technological explosion, were a unique group, As we shattered myth after myth, we also were sowing the seeds to meet our match. We were generating the bureaucracy that gave the keys to our decline to the trial lawyers and the MBAs and that has brought us almost to a Mexican standoff. Howerer, this coming great new generation will not tolerate their shenanigans for long, and we will once again begin to surprise ourselves at every turn by advancing aerospace."
"If the Wright brothers were alive today Wilbur would have to fire Orville to reduce costs." - Herb Kelleher, founder, Southwest Airlines
==============================================
** Buying paint from a hardware store **
Customer: Hi, how much is your interior flat latex paint in Bone White?
Clerk: We have a medium quality, which is $16 a gallan, and premium,
which is $22 a gallon. How many gallons would you like?
Customer: I'll take five gallons of the medium quality, please.
Clerk: That will be $80 plus tax.
==============================================
** Buying paint from an airline **
Customer: Hi, how much is your paint?
Clerk: Well, sir, that all depends.
Customer: Depends on what?
Clerk: Actually a lot of things.
Customer: How about giving me an average price?
Clerk: Wow, that's too hard a question. The lowest price is $9 a gallon, and we have 150 different prices up to $200 a gallon.
Customer: What's the difference in the paint?
Clerk: Oh, there isn't any difference; it's all the same paint.
Customer: Well, then, I'd like some of that $9 paint.
Clerk: Well, first I need to ask you a few questions. W hen do you intend to use it?
Customer: I want to paint tomorrow, on my day off.
Clerk: Sir, the paint for tomorrow is the $200 paint.
Customer: What? When would I have to paint in order to get the $9 version?
Clerk: That would be in three weeks, but you will also have to agree to start painting before Friday of that week and continue painting until at least Sunday.
Customer: You've got to be kidding!
Clerk: Sir, we don't kid around here. Of course, I'll have to check to see if we have any of that paint available before I can sell it to you.
Customer: What do you mean check to see if you can sell it to me? You have shelves full of that stuff; I can see it right there.
Clerk: Just because you can see it doesn't mean that we have it. It may be the same paint, but we sell only a certain number of gallons on any given week. Oh, and by the way, the price just went to $12.
Customer: You mean the price went up while we were talking?
Clerk: Yes, sir. You see, we change prices and rules thousands of times a day, and since you haven't actually walked out of the store with your paint yet, we just decided to change. Unless you want the same thing to happen again, I would suggest that you get on with your purchase. How many gallons do you want?
Customer: I don't know exactly. Maybe five gallons. Maybe I should buy six gallons just to make sure I have enough.
Clerk: Oh, no, sir, you can't do that. If you buy the paint and then don't use it, you will be liable for penalties and possible confiscation of the paint you already have.
Customer: What?
Clerk: That's right. We can sell you enough paint to do your kitchen, bathroom, hall, and north bedroom, but if you stop painting before you do the bedroom, you will violation of our tariffs.
Customer: But what does it mater to your whether I use all the paint? I already paid for it!
Clerk: Sir, there's no point in getting upset; that's just the way it is. We make plans upon the idea that you will use all the paint, and when you don't, it just causes us all kinds of problems.
Customer: This is crazy! I suppose something terrible will happen if I don't keep painting until after Saturday night!
Clerk: Yes, sir, it will.
Customer: Well, that does it! I'm going somewhere else to buy my paint.
Clerk: That won't do you any good, sir. We all have the same rules.
To be fair, the issue with airlines is to be found in any business today, and that is executives who are pulling in obscene renumeration packages, and think of nothing except their next bonus/share options etc. I think it was an old time Edwards test pilot who put it thus,
"We, the generation of the depression, World War II and the postwar technological explosion, were a unique group, As we shattered myth after myth, we also were sowing the seeds to meet our match. We were generating the bureaucracy that gave the keys to our decline to the trial lawyers and the MBAs and that has brought us almost to a Mexican standoff. Howerer, this coming great new generation will not tolerate their shenanigans for long, and we will once again begin to surprise ourselves at every turn by advancing aerospace."
"If the Wright brothers were alive today Wilbur would have to fire Orville to reduce costs." - Herb Kelleher, founder, Southwest Airlines
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will someone tell me what codswallop is?
is there a professional bakers rumor network? perhaps twoonefour would be more comfortable there.
---
Awhile ago, the term "clampets" was popular with the f/a's. and that is the problem...cheap enough that people who don't have manners can buy tickets and treat the plane like a barn.
--
is there a professional bakers rumor network? perhaps twoonefour would be more comfortable there.
---
Awhile ago, the term "clampets" was popular with the f/a's. and that is the problem...cheap enough that people who don't have manners can buy tickets and treat the plane like a barn.
--
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Poorwanderingwun: If I could drive and take boats I would prefer it every time... Personally I would be much happier if airline ticket prices doubled and LCCs were banned... I could then turn up at the airport and experience a civilised atmosphere... few delays... pleasant staff... and work with pilots of greater experience who lived happier lives and bitched less...
In addition my favourite parts of the Mediterranean and Caribbean would be less cluttered with sweaty red faced d*ckheads from the wrong side of town.
In addition my favourite parts of the Mediterranean and Caribbean would be less cluttered with sweaty red faced d*ckheads from the wrong side of town.
sevenstrokeroll Awhile ago, the term "clampets" was popular with the f/a's. and that is the problem...cheap enough that people who don't have manners can buy tickets and treat the plane like a barn.
Below the Glidepath - not correcting
Here's an idea:
Dear Sir,
As I am unable to realize my full potential, or find any degree of job satisfaction with your Airline, please accept my resignation with immediate effect. I hope my position can be filled by some enthusiastic and unjaded youngster who will see a career in avation with the same delight as I once did.
Yours.....
As I am unable to realize my full potential, or find any degree of job satisfaction with your Airline, please accept my resignation with immediate effect. I hope my position can be filled by some enthusiastic and unjaded youngster who will see a career in avation with the same delight as I once did.
Yours.....
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Two's In...
Right idea....
Many of my colleagues in the airline business in America have, essentially, done just that. Maybe they've taken an early retirement, or maybe they've flat out resigned.
Some have switched to other careers, and some have gone to carriers in other countries. In most cases, from what I can gather, these people are happier and wealthier.
And, it's interesting to note (which has been covered many times before here in PPrune), that Southwest Airlines...the ultimate low-cost carrier...pays like a Las Vegas slot machine. The people are happy and wealthy (and highly unionized). Obviously, this happiness and wealthiness of employees is not dependent on working for a 'Legacy' carrier or working for a carrier that caters to the trailer park people.
It's all about competent management...It's all about character and integrity...It's all about treating people fairly. (Gee, do they teach these things in these MBA schools?)
What gets me is that many of the major airlines declared bankruptcy, disolved the pension plans, and bankrupted the PBGC, so now the tax payers of America are taking it up the shorts. All the while, these execs benefited personally to the tune of tens of millions of dollars.
Today, it's Deja Vu II with the "credit crisis". Unscrupulous execs loaned money for real estate purchases to people who were not credit worthy, bundling up the loans into investment instruments that were sold world-wide. What could go wrong! Worst case, when Mr. and Mrs. Smith default on their mortgage, the loan holder takes the house...sells it, maybe for a profit.
In the end, many lending institutions have declared bankruptcy. The execs still drive the expensive sports cars, live in the multi-million dollar neighborhoods, belong to the expensive country clubs...and the U.S. Federal Reserve says the tax payers need to take some of the hit to circumvent a world-wide recession (or depression).
The commonality between these two stories (airline industry and mortgage industry) is greed, theft, and political connections. The rich stay rich, and the average guy still gets caught holding the bag. With airline bankruptcies, execs were rewarded with millions for 'struggling their way through the reorganization process', while the employees (mostly pilots) gave, gave, gave, gave...to keep the companies afloat.
None of this stuff is new....been going on since the beginning of time. The basic song is the same...maybe a second verse...maybe a more modern rendition of the song...maybe new singers...but, the basic song is the same.
Most airline execs, I'm convinced, are crooked incompetents. Regardless of the industry...whether you're making car batteries or women's tampons, the reject executives seem to gravitate to the airline industry...for some reason.
Look at it this way: Little Johnny and his sister, Suzie, are bored during their summer vacation and open up a lemonade stand on the front sidewalk of their home. Ten cents a cup. The product tastes good, and they have many happy customers.
XYZ Airways sees this new, emerging market and immediately sets up a competing stand across the street. Armed with MBAs, lawyers, and a host of experienced management types, they structure a top-heavy layer of 'control'...have a dedicated department of employees for each function of the process....one department solicits offers for lemon supply (with the associated kickbacks)...one department is responsible for peeling the lemons...one department is responsible for stirring the stuff...one department is responsible....well, you get the idea.
At the end of the summer, Johnny and Suzie have made an honest profit of $7.10 selling their ten cent lemonade, while XYZ Airways shows a loss of $328 million...selling the same damn thing.
And, it's all the employees' fault.....
PantLoad
Many of my colleagues in the airline business in America have, essentially, done just that. Maybe they've taken an early retirement, or maybe they've flat out resigned.
Some have switched to other careers, and some have gone to carriers in other countries. In most cases, from what I can gather, these people are happier and wealthier.
And, it's interesting to note (which has been covered many times before here in PPrune), that Southwest Airlines...the ultimate low-cost carrier...pays like a Las Vegas slot machine. The people are happy and wealthy (and highly unionized). Obviously, this happiness and wealthiness of employees is not dependent on working for a 'Legacy' carrier or working for a carrier that caters to the trailer park people.
It's all about competent management...It's all about character and integrity...It's all about treating people fairly. (Gee, do they teach these things in these MBA schools?)
What gets me is that many of the major airlines declared bankruptcy, disolved the pension plans, and bankrupted the PBGC, so now the tax payers of America are taking it up the shorts. All the while, these execs benefited personally to the tune of tens of millions of dollars.
Today, it's Deja Vu II with the "credit crisis". Unscrupulous execs loaned money for real estate purchases to people who were not credit worthy, bundling up the loans into investment instruments that were sold world-wide. What could go wrong! Worst case, when Mr. and Mrs. Smith default on their mortgage, the loan holder takes the house...sells it, maybe for a profit.
In the end, many lending institutions have declared bankruptcy. The execs still drive the expensive sports cars, live in the multi-million dollar neighborhoods, belong to the expensive country clubs...and the U.S. Federal Reserve says the tax payers need to take some of the hit to circumvent a world-wide recession (or depression).
The commonality between these two stories (airline industry and mortgage industry) is greed, theft, and political connections. The rich stay rich, and the average guy still gets caught holding the bag. With airline bankruptcies, execs were rewarded with millions for 'struggling their way through the reorganization process', while the employees (mostly pilots) gave, gave, gave, gave...to keep the companies afloat.
None of this stuff is new....been going on since the beginning of time. The basic song is the same...maybe a second verse...maybe a more modern rendition of the song...maybe new singers...but, the basic song is the same.
Most airline execs, I'm convinced, are crooked incompetents. Regardless of the industry...whether you're making car batteries or women's tampons, the reject executives seem to gravitate to the airline industry...for some reason.
Look at it this way: Little Johnny and his sister, Suzie, are bored during their summer vacation and open up a lemonade stand on the front sidewalk of their home. Ten cents a cup. The product tastes good, and they have many happy customers.
XYZ Airways sees this new, emerging market and immediately sets up a competing stand across the street. Armed with MBAs, lawyers, and a host of experienced management types, they structure a top-heavy layer of 'control'...have a dedicated department of employees for each function of the process....one department solicits offers for lemon supply (with the associated kickbacks)...one department is responsible for peeling the lemons...one department is responsible for stirring the stuff...one department is responsible....well, you get the idea.
At the end of the summer, Johnny and Suzie have made an honest profit of $7.10 selling their ten cent lemonade, while XYZ Airways shows a loss of $328 million...selling the same damn thing.
And, it's all the employees' fault.....
PantLoad
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Ah, the good old days.......
http://www.alexisparkinn.com/photoga...AM707-1958.wmv
http://www.alexisparkinn.com/photoga...AM707-1958.wmv
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Yeah. Right up to the time they said the weather at London was clear and 64 degrees. Then I knew it was fantasy.
On a more serious note I recall an airline executive in the 1970s saying that the best time to travel was about 10 years ago. Never a truer word spoken.
On a more serious note I recall an airline executive in the 1970s saying that the best time to travel was about 10 years ago. Never a truer word spoken.
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"I paid US $4.50 for one loaf of bread today. It was much less a few years ago."
Maybe you should change brands? Or buy yourself a bread maker?
Pantload: Perfect description of our economic system. It's laissez faire capitalism for the average joe, and feather-bedded cradle to grave socialism for the well off.
Maybe you should change brands? Or buy yourself a bread maker?
Pantload: Perfect description of our economic system. It's laissez faire capitalism for the average joe, and feather-bedded cradle to grave socialism for the well off.
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The Reagan Era convinced the majority of Americans to place too much trust and power in large corporations.
This situation hasn't changed since, through the years of the somewhat-decent George I (run out of town for increasing taxes on said corporate elites), Bill the Pedophile (spanked for trying to wrest health care away from corporate medicine) and W (an MBA who is stupid like a fox).
As a result:
- pension funds were neglected by the government, and the MBA's sunk them into stocks, tech funds and risky businesses - then threw up their hands when they became woefully underfunded. The PBGC (read: taxpayer pockets) provided the solution. (This little phenomenon costs my retired UAL uncle about $60,000 a year, by the way);
- unions were trussed, gutted and left to a lingering death. And we can't complain - we handed them the knife. The president of ALPA stood beside Reagan when he fired the controllers (after promising them the moon during the presidential campaign). When USAir's pensions were flushed, we didn't answer our phone (we should have shut the entire system down. Behnke was spinning in his grave that day);
- all the while the satanic feedback-loop of BOD gives bonus to CEO -CEO gives bonus to President - President gives bonus to executives - executives sit on other boards, etc.... has caused us to be the laughing stock of the global industry. Goodwin could have played golf every day and been the CEO of the biggest airline in the world. Instead he drove UAL off a big cliff, and walked away with tens of millions. Same with DAL, USAir, NWA, etc.... At least nobody is telling us how brilliant Al Checci is anymore, but he got to keep his tens of millions.
We're in the 1920's, boys. Somebody dig up FDR, and quick......
This situation hasn't changed since, through the years of the somewhat-decent George I (run out of town for increasing taxes on said corporate elites), Bill the Pedophile (spanked for trying to wrest health care away from corporate medicine) and W (an MBA who is stupid like a fox).
As a result:
- pension funds were neglected by the government, and the MBA's sunk them into stocks, tech funds and risky businesses - then threw up their hands when they became woefully underfunded. The PBGC (read: taxpayer pockets) provided the solution. (This little phenomenon costs my retired UAL uncle about $60,000 a year, by the way);
- unions were trussed, gutted and left to a lingering death. And we can't complain - we handed them the knife. The president of ALPA stood beside Reagan when he fired the controllers (after promising them the moon during the presidential campaign). When USAir's pensions were flushed, we didn't answer our phone (we should have shut the entire system down. Behnke was spinning in his grave that day);
- all the while the satanic feedback-loop of BOD gives bonus to CEO -CEO gives bonus to President - President gives bonus to executives - executives sit on other boards, etc.... has caused us to be the laughing stock of the global industry. Goodwin could have played golf every day and been the CEO of the biggest airline in the world. Instead he drove UAL off a big cliff, and walked away with tens of millions. Same with DAL, USAir, NWA, etc.... At least nobody is telling us how brilliant Al Checci is anymore, but he got to keep his tens of millions.
We're in the 1920's, boys. Somebody dig up FDR, and quick......
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I was a disgruntled American pilot, so I left the USA, got a JAA license (paid for by my new employer) and make twice what I was in the US. Happy days, right? Unfortunately my rent costs twice what my US mortgage cost and I can't even afford to own a car here, not to mention the taxes and other BS. I'll stay here a while, but I definitely plan to go back to the US and fly with people who didn't buy their job.
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and I hope all the pilots out there start to take back our profession...and don't count on ALPA to do it for you.
A spendid arrangement.
All the rest for you folks is sour grapes, plain and simple.
Grow up.
Paxing All Over The World
sevenstrokeroll
An old English expression, essentially, it is a polite way of saying bull$hit.
PantLoad
I think we all know what you mean but I think LA slots have a reputation of not paying!
That is a VERY good parallel to draw. In the 28 years that I have been in various kinds of employment, in various commercial and governmental organisations and in various countries of the world ... one certainty is that each new generation, as soon as they get their backside in the biiiig chair - starts to turn things to their personal advantage.
Not all of them, of course not, but more than enough. I suspect that, in the process, they make the working lives of those under them so unpleasant as to ensure that a junior member of staff makes a silent resolve that the very moment he gets his backside into the big chair ...
will someone tell me what codswallop is?
PantLoad
Southwest Airlines...the ultimate low-cost carrier...pays like a Las Vegas slot machine.
The commonality between these two stories (airline industry and mortgage industry) is greed, theft, and political connections.
Not all of them, of course not, but more than enough. I suspect that, in the process, they make the working lives of those under them so unpleasant as to ensure that a junior member of staff makes a silent resolve that the very moment he gets his backside into the big chair ...
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I've flown about 10 domestic US flights this year, and on every single one I got: -
I could get along fine without any of the above, maybe due to fact we don't get any of that over here in Europe, apart from the cheap fares. American flyers are too demanding, which is probably why half the carriers are in Chapter 11....
- 2 x 50lb of checked luggage
- 2 Pieces of hand luggage
- Free drink and snack
- Interlining of baggage
- Cheap fares
- Plenty of legroom
- PTV's on many aircraft
I could get along fine without any of the above, maybe due to fact we don't get any of that over here in Europe, apart from the cheap fares. American flyers are too demanding, which is probably why half the carriers are in Chapter 11....