Infants In Business Class
Join Date: Aug 2002
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It's not so much the noise of children that can be irritating after all flights are very noisy, engines droning props turning, trolly's clanking, pax and crew conversations and you can always stick you headphones on . No, personally i think the worst thing about having children onboard sometimes is the smell ie when parents don't make a quick effort to change tot or leave the nappy bags hanging around yuck!
Join Date: Oct 1999
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am travelling short- and long-haul in c-class, both alone on business and privately with family (including now 7 and 5 year old daughters) - not on miles or ID tickets
even when our kids were not the quietest for short periods of time, fellow travellers did show hindsight, conceding that they are children.
all in all we have been faring well - bar that gentleman who had to continue from SIN to MEL with a pair of soiled slacks (air-sickness) after he gracefully assisted me when our little one was ill - but even he took it with style and accepted by spare pair of jeans (two sizes too big, but the belt did it)
when travelling alone in C-class, it has usually not been the behaviour (or lack thereof) of small children, but more often the behaviour of fellow adult passengers in various states of intoxication or making uncalled-for and offensive comments to cabin-crew (mainly female...) in regards to appearance, indecent proposals, a non-available choice of meal, 'restrictions' on quantities of liquor served, delays, bumpy flights, mal-functioning in-flight entertainment systems - you name it.
edited for syntax....
even when our kids were not the quietest for short periods of time, fellow travellers did show hindsight, conceding that they are children.
all in all we have been faring well - bar that gentleman who had to continue from SIN to MEL with a pair of soiled slacks (air-sickness) after he gracefully assisted me when our little one was ill - but even he took it with style and accepted by spare pair of jeans (two sizes too big, but the belt did it)
when travelling alone in C-class, it has usually not been the behaviour (or lack thereof) of small children, but more often the behaviour of fellow adult passengers in various states of intoxication or making uncalled-for and offensive comments to cabin-crew (mainly female...) in regards to appearance, indecent proposals, a non-available choice of meal, 'restrictions' on quantities of liquor served, delays, bumpy flights, mal-functioning in-flight entertainment systems - you name it.
edited for syntax....
Join Date: Apr 2002
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Can one of you "business men" give me a valid reason why I should not be allowed to travel with my son in any class on any aircraft with any airline if I am paying the same price for a ticket as you.
Possibly unlikely I feel.
Join Date: Oct 1998
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Childless flights
None that I know of, but I am sure there would be a market for this... at the very least, on routes which are flown multiple times per day then it should be possible to designate some of the flights as "min age 12" or something.
Join Date: Jun 2003
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I agree with Beagle that there should be an expectation of peace and quiet when travelling but, on the other hand, as has been said before, small children, particularly babies, only have one way of communicating. And that is noisy!Changes in pressure can affect their ears, just as it does to adults, and that discomfort can trigger distress. So, circumstances can be outside parents control.
What will be more distressing is the day passengers are allowed to use mobile phones on aircraft! That will be more noisy and intrusive than any distressed minor!
What will be more distressing is the day passengers are allowed to use mobile phones on aircraft! That will be more noisy and intrusive than any distressed minor!
Business, Economy and Kiddies class, that's what we need 
! Yes, we were all children once. I often travelled as a small child. Thanks to a good upbringing I was always well behaved. My children likewise. I have no objections to children in Business or First Class as long as they behave accordingly. "Babies cry" someone said. Well, yes they do, but in all honesty if I had to endure a crying baby for hours having paid a premium price (out of my own pocket) for a seat which promised me comfort, peace and quiet, I might get a little irritable too. Fortunately my experience is that babies tend to cry pre take-off and on the descent and are fast asleep the rest of the time.
! Yes, we were all children once. I often travelled as a small child. Thanks to a good upbringing I was always well behaved. My children likewise. I have no objections to children in Business or First Class as long as they behave accordingly. "Babies cry" someone said. Well, yes they do, but in all honesty if I had to endure a crying baby for hours having paid a premium price (out of my own pocket) for a seat which promised me comfort, peace and quiet, I might get a little irritable too. Fortunately my experience is that babies tend to cry pre take-off and on the descent and are fast asleep the rest of the time.
Join Date: Feb 2000
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I'm curious as to whether this is a cultural issue - I wonder whether the same issue arises with Iberia or Alitalia, or indeed other countries where the perception of children is different? In my experience (mostly Spain) adults seem to avoid getting quite as stressed about younger humans as they do in the UK. A higher tolerance level seems to be the norm, and sometimes pleasure is actually taken from the company of children. Could it be that we have something to learn? - Discuss...
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Like Avman I have no problem with kids on planes per se. If they are well behaved then no problem, and no big deal with babies crying for a few minutes during ascent or descent. But the problem I had on the above mentioned LHR-EWR flight was that the baby was crying loudly for at least the first 4 hours out of a 7 hour flight.
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What a ridiculous thought; deny children access to business class.
I propose to deny people on board who have smelling breath, who are ugly, who are not dressed nicely, or who otherwise might bother you.
Take mr heavy`s advice and rent your own plane, so you won`t bother anyone else
I propose to deny people on board who have smelling breath, who are ugly, who are not dressed nicely, or who otherwise might bother you.
Take mr heavy`s advice and rent your own plane, so you won`t bother anyone else
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Join Date: Feb 2001
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I posed the original question regarding infants - not children. I think infants are classed as less than 2 years old and usually travel free when accompanied by a guardian. Is it not, therefore, rather ironic that a pax ( the infant ) who is paying the least fare ( £0 )on the aircraft is, if being uncontrollably noisy, causing the greatest nuisance to those who are paying amongst the highest fares.
If airlines insist on permitting infants in 'business' or first class then perhaps it is time to rename the various compartments of the aircraft to reflect the fact that they may not be suitable for either business or rest and thus may not provide the luxury they advertise.
If airlines insist on permitting infants in 'business' or first class then perhaps it is time to rename the various compartments of the aircraft to reflect the fact that they may not be suitable for either business or rest and thus may not provide the luxury they advertise.
As a parent of two and frequent flyer I would like to chart the middle ground here. We are blessed with two very well behaved kids who have traveled regularly by air since birth. The blessings of which I speak though were not wholly bestowed by heaven but through their upbringing and consistent discipline which makes them a pleasure to travel with. That their behavior on-board is almost always complimented by my fellow passenger, is a source of pride for mum and dad – and by the way they are both extremely happy kids.
Central to my thesis is, when suffering badly behaved children, the main culprit is the accompanying parent(s). My casual observation is that those same adults are often the type that would disturb your flight in some way without their darlings in tow. This doesn’t of course prevent the annoyance of suffering bad kids on board in any class.
My empathy is always there to the young couple or mum with a crying baby on-board, desperately trying to appease its needs – the situation is tearing their heart out too – I know, we have been there. Help from us is always available be it the sympathetic smile right down to the hands-on action. I am rather proud of my baby burping technique and enjoy the adulation that comes from the successful completion of the mission. My wife has also the kind of shoulder and murmur that sooths troubled little souls. Sometimes it is enough to give the parents the respite to gather their own strength for the task ahead. As to being puked on under fire – well that’s all part of the Great Game. So I think you can see that I’m very tolerant of babies and get very annoyed at badly behaving kids – or adults for that matter.
Only once did our family have the pleasure of traveling business class. My then seven year old daughter settled herself into her chair across the aisle next to an understandably nervous looking businesswomen. She politely introduced herself, admired her palatial surroundings and said “Daddy, I do like business class!”. Thus started a very enjoyable flight for all, with compliments from businesswoman and crew at the end. It can be done folks, it just takes good old fashioned parenting - which is not universally fashionable these days.
To answer the original question though. It is my understanding that there are neither child nor infant fares available in business class, at least on the carriers that I have flown. Would I take my infant though into business class even if I had the money for another full premium fare? – No, I would be too embarrassed lest he/she disturbs someone who has paid a lot for a bit of P & Q. I believe tolerance works both ways.
Central to my thesis is, when suffering badly behaved children, the main culprit is the accompanying parent(s). My casual observation is that those same adults are often the type that would disturb your flight in some way without their darlings in tow. This doesn’t of course prevent the annoyance of suffering bad kids on board in any class.
My empathy is always there to the young couple or mum with a crying baby on-board, desperately trying to appease its needs – the situation is tearing their heart out too – I know, we have been there. Help from us is always available be it the sympathetic smile right down to the hands-on action. I am rather proud of my baby burping technique and enjoy the adulation that comes from the successful completion of the mission. My wife has also the kind of shoulder and murmur that sooths troubled little souls. Sometimes it is enough to give the parents the respite to gather their own strength for the task ahead. As to being puked on under fire – well that’s all part of the Great Game. So I think you can see that I’m very tolerant of babies and get very annoyed at badly behaving kids – or adults for that matter.
Only once did our family have the pleasure of traveling business class. My then seven year old daughter settled herself into her chair across the aisle next to an understandably nervous looking businesswomen. She politely introduced herself, admired her palatial surroundings and said “Daddy, I do like business class!”. Thus started a very enjoyable flight for all, with compliments from businesswoman and crew at the end. It can be done folks, it just takes good old fashioned parenting - which is not universally fashionable these days.
To answer the original question though. It is my understanding that there are neither child nor infant fares available in business class, at least on the carriers that I have flown. Would I take my infant though into business class even if I had the money for another full premium fare? – No, I would be too embarrassed lest he/she disturbs someone who has paid a lot for a bit of P & Q. I believe tolerance works both ways.
Last edited by eko4me; 3rd Apr 2004 at 17:16.
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Willowman
My experience of taking my infants in business class is that they were charged at 10% of the full adult fare. That's for no seat, or guaranteed basinette. I've also paid the discounted adult fare for when they were children, as often this has been cheaper than the child fare at 66% of the full adult fare.
FWIW, my own view is that I expect my children to behave on an aeroplane, in any class, in the same way they should in a resturant or hotel. Words or worse will be had if they disobey.
cur
My experience of taking my infants in business class is that they were charged at 10% of the full adult fare. That's for no seat, or guaranteed basinette. I've also paid the discounted adult fare for when they were children, as often this has been cheaper than the child fare at 66% of the full adult fare.
FWIW, my own view is that I expect my children to behave on an aeroplane, in any class, in the same way they should in a resturant or hotel. Words or worse will be had if they disobey.
cur
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In my opinion, badly behaved children on aircraft be treated the same as badly behaved adults?. The only difference being, that as most of these children act this way because they've never been taught how to behave properly, and their parents don't give a sh1t about the other passengers, any disruptive action should result in the parents (and the children) being refused a business/upper class seat in the future.
I've ocassionally had to sit beside people who have very young children or babies, who often scream or cry, BUT, whilst this can make for an uncomfortable flight, this is not what I am refering to. Crying (and puking) by babies is normal and can not be avoided.
The majority of children I've ever encountered on aircraft, are usually very well behaved. Surely if some can manage it, it wouldn't be too hard for all of them.
419
I've ocassionally had to sit beside people who have very young children or babies, who often scream or cry, BUT, whilst this can make for an uncomfortable flight, this is not what I am refering to. Crying (and puking) by babies is normal and can not be avoided.
The majority of children I've ever encountered on aircraft, are usually very well behaved. Surely if some can manage it, it wouldn't be too hard for all of them.
419
Join Date: Mar 2003
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This topic surfaces at regular intervals and really gets my goat. I travel in F & C on business alone and when I travel for leisure my family and I travel in C. Because I can afford it and because when I'm going on vacation I don't see why I should squeeze myself into an airline seat with a shoehorn and hobble around at destination for 24 hours because I had no room for my legs.
My two boys, now strapping teenagers, have always flown up front wth my wife and I. They have behaved well, which is more than can be said about many adults that have surrounded us.
Do I need to go through the catalogue of transgressions that we adults commit and yet which we seem to tolerate somehow because the transgressor is the same age as us and has a gold card? Snoring loudly (ok, that's probably me, so I thought I'd get that in first), two colleagues yacking loudly over their headphones so they can continue the conversation without missing the movie, taking of shoes and socks and resting bare feet on the seatback in front, .....and the list goes on.
Why do we always pick on the parents and kids? Because we always pick on those that are weaker and present an easier target. Becuse we are all intolerant, becuse we all think that the world revolves around ME, and because it is our RIGHT. We are ENTITLED. The thing that I always have to laugh about is why business class passengers (whose tickets are often being paid for by their companies) seem to think that they are holier than the people in the back of the bus. Why should economy passengers be any more disturbed by a child (or by a boorish adult) than a passenger in business class? Don't they have rights too?
Rant over....I'm outta here
My two boys, now strapping teenagers, have always flown up front wth my wife and I. They have behaved well, which is more than can be said about many adults that have surrounded us.
Do I need to go through the catalogue of transgressions that we adults commit and yet which we seem to tolerate somehow because the transgressor is the same age as us and has a gold card? Snoring loudly (ok, that's probably me, so I thought I'd get that in first), two colleagues yacking loudly over their headphones so they can continue the conversation without missing the movie, taking of shoes and socks and resting bare feet on the seatback in front, .....and the list goes on.
Why do we always pick on the parents and kids? Because we always pick on those that are weaker and present an easier target. Becuse we are all intolerant, becuse we all think that the world revolves around ME, and because it is our RIGHT. We are ENTITLED. The thing that I always have to laugh about is why business class passengers (whose tickets are often being paid for by their companies) seem to think that they are holier than the people in the back of the bus. Why should economy passengers be any more disturbed by a child (or by a boorish adult) than a passenger in business class? Don't they have rights too?
Rant over....I'm outta here
Business class check in, BA, Abu Dhabi. Comment from an old hand:
'If they offer you an upgrade, turn them down - the kids run around all night - you'll sleep better in Club.'
I've never seen badly behaved kids in Club, but don't count crying babies. Perhaps rich brats are the price of travelling first class!
'If they offer you an upgrade, turn them down - the kids run around all night - you'll sleep better in Club.'
I've never seen badly behaved kids in Club, but don't count crying babies. Perhaps rich brats are the price of travelling first class!
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Christep
So how would you have stopped the baby crying? This is a serious question, I would love to know a foolproof technique.
I think Tightslot has it right. Compared to many other nationalities the British do seem to be intolerant towards children. This is most notable when travelling through Europe where children tend to be seen as a joy and not an encumberance.
So how would you have stopped the baby crying? This is a serious question, I would love to know a foolproof technique.
I think Tightslot has it right. Compared to many other nationalities the British do seem to be intolerant towards children. This is most notable when travelling through Europe where children tend to be seen as a joy and not an encumberance.
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Funny isn't it.
You're entitled to take your children wherever you like, whenever you like.
I'm not entitled to a flight undisturbed by rowdy kids.
I offer the above as an example and ask who the selfish party is?
You're entitled to take your children wherever you like, whenever you like.
I'm not entitled to a flight undisturbed by rowdy kids.
I offer the above as an example and ask who the selfish party is?