Can I ask pilots of twin turbine single pilot operations that are on pprune ... Do you perform takeoff safety briefs as part of EVERY takeoff? Are they even taught in turbine lessons?

VB - yes brief every takeoff. That was our policy.

As for other operators I wouldn't know.

Yes - absolutely.

It has been 25 years since I flew a BE20 but I seem to recall part of the briefing involved discussing actions for engine failure below blue line speed (V2 or Vtoss). Was it 121kts? Was rotate 95kts?

I seem to recall that there would be controllability problems below the blue line speed under certain conditions.

Flying in PNG, if my memory is correct, we used to brief closing the other condition lever and landing straight ahead.

Same at my company and ones previous. All TO/ Approaches on all types.

Take off safety briefings should be done in all aircraft types!!!

I brief myself when I'm flying a 172, might be very short. Glide speed, which way I will head/turn should the engine fail and pre impact drills. Only takes me about 5 seconds to mentally go through.

Is anyone able to calculate the weight & balance for this aircraft type?

Let's assume pilot + 4x pass (well above std 80kg), 4x full golf clubs + 4 x heavy suitcases packed for their trip from initial origin in the US (worst case).

+ full fuel (for return 2 hour trip + reserves)

How does this stack up with even slight power loss on take-off?

What if all the pax were seated at the very front or rear of the aircraft (or all on the left side to see the view of Melbourne CBD as they departed - which incidentally was the direction the aircraft turned).

Interested if this throws up any red lights?

From the dash cam video it appears that;
1. No smoke visible
2. Landing gear up
3. Wings level
4. Descent rapid but fairly constant

Would an engine failure in a B200 likely cause smoke? Perhaps the video quality was not good enough to see this evidence.

Why is everyone talking about V1/V2 when operating a B200 - a Part 23 aircraft.

Sure there are Part 25 performance figures in the AFM, but operating to that criteria would severely restrict where you could operate the aircraft.

How about we limit the performance and terminology to that which is applicable to the aircraft's certification standard.

Yes and Yes. Not only a company policy, but a personal policy.

Interesting to hear the ATSB are referring to the type of operation as being Private. This could have some implications. There is a ATSB press conference tomorrow.

Brutus. You are so correct re PNG.

I understand the was a 4 kt breeze from the North West at the time of the accident. If Max had used the much longer R/W 26 could he have got back on the ground without over running the RSA.

Is this airfield so surrounded by schools, warehouses, highways, that there is nowhere suitable to put down without the final turn that comes unstuck? in that case the airfield should undergo some prompt removal of dangerous development. Enough to give a place to land straight ahead in case of EFATO. Years ago a light aircraft landed without causing damage on a roof near High Wycombe, when the pilot suffered a epileptic episode on approach, he was unable to see facing into the sun.

I have only flown gliders and single engine aircraft; having a look at the book of instruction that must be absorbed to fly this twin safely the second engine would only confuse me.

Stallie, spot on, its also about gradients and the last time I calculated it for the average Part 23 type, and it was a while ago, for EN R26 that radio mast to the west was an issue, if it is still there and for R17 it was under or over the Westgate or around which building in the city.

There seems to be a great deal of confusion around here about performance and Part 23 v Part 25.

I mean this in the kindest way Mary...have a look at the area on google maps...Max had very few options when the poo hit the fan.

Years ago, in England, a Kingair was taking off in fog, crashed shortly after take-off [into buildings, I think], and the accident report concluded that it was power lever slide back. It was owned and flown by a well known Motor Racing journalist, whose name escapes me. Think it took off from Blackbushe.

VP-BBK perhaps?

JEM60
I believe that event was prompted by a rollback due to an oversight in not applying the throttle friction locks. Believing that he'd suffered an engine failure the pilot misidentified the 'failing' engine and reacting instinctively secured the wrong engine.

As for briefing prior to departure.. yes, most do that but there's a huge difference in repeating by rote a departure brief, and actually psyching oneself up to be primed for an EFATO event.
Having spent a few years of my career as a FlightSafety Instructor I know from experience that even when knowing what's about to happen pilots regularly need more than one attempt to deal with an EFATO event successfully.

Great to see that the process of discrediting and denigrating the pilot has already begun in the media. Well done the civic-minded person/authority that leaked the details of a previous investigation of a near miss and IR re-testing.

Right on time: Before he's been buried.

Clearly this pilot was a dangerous Maverick just hankering to spear a B200 and his passengers into a DFO.

I do hope that CASA will be given more power, and more rules will be made and more regulatory constraints placed on pilots.

It's great to be reminded, once again, of the kind of parasitic scum that get their jollies and make their living off the public fear created by these tragedies.

And hopefully the investigation and causes of the accident will be completed and identified by PPRuNers shortly.

They were just saying on t.v that the authorities will be looking at Essendon Airport as they are now thinking it is too close to built up areas. :-( And who's fault is that?

Lead Balloon
:D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D

601 I used FAR25 figures as that's what I had to hand. They show what the limitations of one particular b200 airframe actually are. You won't get that level info out of the FAR 23 figures for obvious reasons. The trouble is these obvious reasons lead many people to say these things are never any trouble on 1...

Whilst my great grandfather was the country's first dedicated ATC at EN between the wars, they lived in a little house off the end of 17. My then young grandmother recalls the huge paddocks around the house, as well as dining with the Holymans pilots who'd drop by after work. Anyone who dares say to me that the airport is too close to houses will cop a verbal barrage from me.

the huge paddocks around the house

Used to be a real estate agent (Lindsay Crapp ? - I rented the premises upstairs) located next to De Marco's pub and he was an aviation enthusiast of note.

Around the walls were numerous photos of the early days at Essendon. Those paddocks were shown very clearly ... the airport was well and truly out in the sticks in the early days.

As a Boeing airports chap told me decades ago .. the general technique is to build an airport in the bush .. twenty odd years later all the housing around results in the usual calls for the airport to be shut down.