Merged: QANTAS/ALAEA EBA
 

All is quiet on the western front with the ALAEA PIA.
Have they accepted the 3% pay rise and are now off to convince their followers to accept it?
;)

Time will tell as to weather the hold fire order was a stroke of genius, or the bend over before the reaming. The time line now puts any possible action at earliest the 7th Feb, after the 380 announcement............
This could be the one defining decision in this whole campaign.

Hate to burst your bubble Mendaero, but from what I've heard there is no agreement on anything of substance. It looks like even a meagre 3% is going to cost, in kind.

This clause has to go. It doesn't matter who wrote it, It will always be twisted out of context and used used against us. As for 3%, I would only accept that if the board accepted it for themselves. The people on the coal face make the company what it is, not the board.

1st Feb is a Friday and you must give 3 clear "working days" notice, that puts a notice served on Friday the 1st for action as of one minute past midnight Thursday morning the 7th Feb.

As far as any "creative pay deals" don't hold your breath. There is only one way we are going to advance our claims and that is through action.

Members must not fall into a false sense of security, we are no closer now than we were two weeks ago. Steel yourselves.

Because we agreed not to in the comission.

Who's bent over what?
 

Whether the 1st or 7th for PIA to start, bring it on.
However, I disagree with the view that management have us bent over anything. It's their strategy that is failing. Bloomburg's study that found we are 10% more productive than Singapore; The blocking of their attempt to bring in foreign labour; The lack of scabs that have been willing to sign up; The awareness by the public of a management culture of staff shortages across the entire business; The commissioning of market research into the public attitude towards management.
It's the above, combined with a share price that is beating the market down even though they have announced higher record profits, that has management concerned. They are trying to make sure that we are not in a position to bend them over anything.
Good work so far ALAEA Exec, don't take a backward step!

Notice should be given to start PIA on the 1st Feb.

We have given Qantas enough time to negotiate a deal if they had wanted one. Don't forget, "The EBA has to be concluded by February because QE has important decisions to be made re A380 and A330". Or was that statement just as valid as "This deal looks like a good deal to me"? (MH, KM and co)

Is this the same executive?
http://www.cnet.com.au/wireless/0,23...9285323,00.htm

God help us...

MMM, Bring down the red Q!!! Make them beg.
Hit them hard. Now it's our turn to to show them.

F**k the 380, f**k the 330, f**k it all. Long live the legacy fleet.

Gentlemen, i hope we settle this

i am reliably imformed that if we do not, things will never be the same again, i am asking all like members to be aware.....i am not a troll....i implore the ALAEA to be vigilant, please do not stuff up

In what way? What have you been told?

He is just spreading fear uncertainty and doubt like he always does. Same handiwork visible on the A380 thread.

Yes, thats true, for the first time in a long time LAME's will have proven they have a backbone, and the company better take notice. Bring it on, I am sick of my inflation/efficiency payrise paying managers bonus's and undeserved mega payrises.

I'd be happy with 1/6th of Cox's payrise and no bonus on my pidly income! But the again I not a greedy :yuk: psychopath.

If we let this EBA get rammed through in it's current wording then I am telling you now, things will definatly never be the same again for Qantas LAMEs, and it's not good. Now if you are in fact an operational LAME you should understand this and be outraged at the audacity of those who seek to impose such conditions. If you are infact an agent provocateur or a company stooge then you allready know this and are by association in agreeance to all the claims made by the company.

"The ALAEA" is the sum total of ALL it's members. Hold fast, suck it up and don't shoot untill you see the whites of their eyes.

It is all smoke and mirrors. QF are just buying time it is a favourite tactic of theirs. The ALAEA might have one agenda but they haven't consulted the troops. I have said before if you want to be successful in this EBA keep focused on what you are fighting for and don't let the company or ALAEA cloud your vision.
I don't think the union is being as transparent as you think they are.

As for Wingers he must be a stooge,or he has other agendas himself

Quoting Mr. Purvinas:
Well I guess Mr. Purvinas with 20 years of avionic experience does not need to have any knowledge of the rules of gravity and the S.G. of fuel.:confused:

And being Mr Purvinas who are we mere mortals to question his comments

ever considered it being mis quoted?
 

if the water "could" float to the top it would not have been sucked in by the pumps would it! How often do we argue the accuracy of news reports on this forum? How often are pumps installed at the top of tanks?
I am sure over the 20 years he worked on the ramp and seen or done fuel checks he would know where to look for the fuel.

Hotdog, maybe you should learn where it is sucked from and why the attitude of the aircraft could play a roll after fuel had settled for some time and not so quickly take news reports as gospel.

Jet pumps should remove water as it settles though. Once again I am sure there is many slices of swiss that would have to line up for this theory to be right!

Superman, can you enlighten us why?

From what I am hearing the ALAEA isn't doing much consulting with its members during this 3 week show of faith. Surely you would think they would keep everyone informed of their progress, so that the members know they are still fighting for what the members want and not what the association officials want.

Rudderless,

I know precisely where the fuel boost pumps are situated in the tanks and fully understand the effects of attitude. However, unless Mr Purvinas has been misquoted by the press, he is misinformed. Water does not float on top of fuel. SG of water=1.0, SG of A1 at the temperature you can expect after a long flight probably 0.82.

Possible Capitulation
 

Ahhh.

I am starting to feel it in my water that the executive are about to capitulate and go on bended knee to its constituency and ask them to accept the deal that they have been offered.:(

Like many before them they may have succumbed to the greater powers, and defeated in battle go with bowed head to their army.:ooh:

Will they ever see their enemies float by in the river, or will their enemies sit high on the hill and smile down upon them, satisfied that another battle has been won?:O

Ohhh.

The criticisms of past executives…………….were they merely lip service???:rolleyes:

Are the current leaders consistant with the past leaders???????:eek:

Make your own judgement, as I have.:ok:

:sad:

you missed my point!
 

this is why its all so stupid and obviously a misquote, yet you jumped on it. There would be more a problem sucking air I would think if taking stupidity to the nth
The pumps aren't there and water doesn't float on fuel. Most I suggest know this would be a journalist error. :rolleyes:

Run out of puff?
 

Headcone, keep your chin up, my waters have never felt better. Can you hold back on the OT for another week or let me guess you never even considered it or couldn't give a red rats bum.

I see plenty of info, if you choose to read it that is. I don't think the current exec asks if its ok by QF anymore. I don't see them folding either unless directed by the members, are the members happy with QF now?

Lets wait and see, I think you've called to early unless of course you are spreading FUD for them!:(

My Two Cent!

Although it seems there is a lack of info from ALAEA at the moment, they are trying to not give away their position. That is to be expected.

Remember, regardless what may be offered, it is up to the members to decide whether to accept any offer that is put forward!!

If no agreement can be reached, the final option for QF is to close down E&M. I know there are those who would find this more acceptable than agreeing to what , so far , ammounts to a pay cut.

February
 

Yoshi, there are more than a few that agree with your sentiments, although I'm sure the majority don't particularly want to see E&M closed down. Let's see what February brings. Both parties have agreed to continue negotiations per Commissioner Watson's recommendation, at least until 1 February.

Headcone
 

Headcone, I will make my own judgement when the EBA is complete and certified in the AIRC. Until then, the executive has my complete support as the democratically elected executive should have. As far as I can see, the executive is following the direction of the majority of the membership. If you refuse to see that, you are either not a member of the association or you are in the minority. Which is it?

Rudderless, mate you missed my point entirely. Read my original post on this subject. I quoted a published statement from your ALEA executive secretary Mr. Purvinas in a UK newspaper, who is of the opinion that fuel is heavier than water and could have been the cause of the BA038 prang. I know this is off topic but the only reason I brought it up is, that I would be somewhat concerned if Mr. Purvinas was my associaton's executive secretary.:rolleyes:

UK Newspaper !
 

Now we know he has DEFINITELY been misquoted ! ! !

Corrections and Observations

SP - Federal Secretary of the ALAEA :}

Whether misquoted or not we're all aware of fuel/water issue and yes it does only go to the bottom of tanks that's why you do drains at lowest points in tanks. :8

Did you have a crack because he's 115 pounds wringing wet and could be blown away in a strong wind :E

if you want to add your two cents into the myriad of spotters and armchair experts,re the ba 777 incident then do so on the thread in tech log.as for media quotes who ever really believes the daily rag.

now please stay on topic ,(WHICH IS PIA AND THE ALAEA).
having walked about twenty feet and approached my union delegate and actually asked what is going on (which really wasnt that difficult ,and maybe some of the so called stirrers should do),the answer i recieved was very informative and that there is another meeting today.

The Rubber Dick is back!!!!! :}:}:}

TID EDIT:

Oh no you're not!:}

OK fellows, thanks for the correction. Mr.Purvinas is indeed the Federal Secretary of ALAEA. Following are his comments made to ZDNet.com.au which was copied by the UK Daily Mail.

However ALAEA's federal secretary, Steven Purvinas, an avionics engineer with 20 years experience, contacted members of the organisation who had worked on the Boeing 777. He told ZDNet.com.au that of all Boeing's aircraft, the 777 is most likely to be affected by wireless or radio frequency interference.

"The 777 is far more electronically capable and reliant on it than its predecessors such as the Boeing 747. If wireless interference hasn't been ruled out as a possible cause, this aircraft would be a prime candidate for it," said Purvinas.

According to the members of the ALAEA who have worked on Boeing 777 aircraft, but declined to be interviewed, Boeing has taken extra measures to secure the systems and wiring that connect those systems.

The engineers claimed that although the 777 relies more on its electronic components, its wiring bundles are heavily shielded against radiation and stray currents that might affect the integrity of the system.

A more likely cause of the aircraft's throttle systems to fail at that stage of descent, according to Purvinas, is dirty fuel from Beijing, where it had refuelled before heading to London's Heathrow Airport.

"In this case, we're talking both engines carking it at same time. At that stage the aircraft is tilted at a certain altitude so when the fuel moves back into the tanks, it may expose the fuel pumps to water which is contained in the tanks," he said.

A small amount of water is not uncommon in fuel, Purvinas said.

"When you're putting in a hundred thousand kilos of fuel, there is a small component of water but if that all rises to the top of the fuel tank and is exposed to the fuel-pump intakes at same time, that is when you may have a problem at the same time on both engines," he said.

Stay on the Topic
 

Repeat:

..now please stay on topic ,(WHICH IS PIA AND THE ALAEA).


Stoned P :zzz:

Well actually, this discussion is on topic. Steve Purvinas is the federal secretary of the ALAEA and he is heavily involved with your PIA. I have no doubt his negotiating skills are better than his grasp of physics.:E

ok hotdog you made your point 3 times, now can we get on with the topic pia any updates

Hot Dog
 

I think domo has summed it up, back on topic.

I would hate to think of you as a troll which I am sure you are not.:ok:

BTW

Woodsy aint no rocket scientist either!:E

Not another word, I promise! Hope you guys get what you are after.:ok: