Gliding Towing
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Gliding Towing
G'day all,
Just wanted to get some input on my current situation. Approx 200 hour PPL (doing my CPL theory atm). I've been given what I think is a great opportunity to tow full time at a large gliding club for 4 months. This requires unpaid leave from work etc. but in return gives me 200 odd hours flying the Pawnee.
Most people I've bounced this off agree it's a great opportunity, but I've recently had a chat to someone who thinks the time off work (lost income) vs. a good chunk of hours in a Pawnee is not really worth it, as PA25/glider towing hours aren't necessarily regarded as quality flying hours opposed to me spending my lost income on an instrument rating or 200 series time.
To be honest, I still think it's a great opportunity as I love flying the Pawnee and I actually think the flying hours are quite valuable in terms of 'stick and rudder' time. Anyway, this persons opinion has obviously got me second guessing myself so I thought I'd put it to some people who are in industry or have had similar experiences.
Any advice would be appreciated.
Just wanted to get some input on my current situation. Approx 200 hour PPL (doing my CPL theory atm). I've been given what I think is a great opportunity to tow full time at a large gliding club for 4 months. This requires unpaid leave from work etc. but in return gives me 200 odd hours flying the Pawnee.
Most people I've bounced this off agree it's a great opportunity, but I've recently had a chat to someone who thinks the time off work (lost income) vs. a good chunk of hours in a Pawnee is not really worth it, as PA25/glider towing hours aren't necessarily regarded as quality flying hours opposed to me spending my lost income on an instrument rating or 200 series time.
To be honest, I still think it's a great opportunity as I love flying the Pawnee and I actually think the flying hours are quite valuable in terms of 'stick and rudder' time. Anyway, this persons opinion has obviously got me second guessing myself so I thought I'd put it to some people who are in industry or have had similar experiences.
Any advice would be appreciated.
200 hours tailwheel time with lots of take-offs and landings will definitely polish up your flying. That will ultimately assist you when it comes to CPL training.
Ask yourself, do I want to pay for 200 hours myself? I doubt it.
Yes, you will be forgoing an income, but if the day job remains open for you to return to, treat it as long service leave.
I'd grab it with both hands.
Enjoy.
Ask yourself, do I want to pay for 200 hours myself? I doubt it.
Yes, you will be forgoing an income, but if the day job remains open for you to return to, treat it as long service leave.
I'd grab it with both hands.
Enjoy.
Might score some sailplane time too
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Gliding Towing
Seems a no brainer to be honest! Ask yourself if the person who has given you points against doing it has an alternative motive.
Grab any flying hours you can it all helps.
As stated above do you want to pay for 200 hours yourself? Nope!
Do it, enjoy it, meet new people and learn new skills.
Grab any flying hours you can it all helps.
As stated above do you want to pay for 200 hours yourself? Nope!
Do it, enjoy it, meet new people and learn new skills.
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My first 750 hours or so comprised mostly glider towing and a bit of meatbombing. Best experience I ever got early on, and it helped me avoid having to teach 10hr PPL's with 250hrs myself...
I'm guessing there is a fair chance you want to go from where you are to commercial flying for reasons other than; job stability, family life and money.
Fair chance really that you actually quite enjoy flying? If this is so then you ought to grab this opportunity with both hands and enjoy the ride!
A piddling 200 hours of any flying should'nt have a negative impact on any future civilian employer with any real world experience - provided you set your own high personal standards, learn what airmanship is and strive to be very good at applying it. Through books and the net, you can learn from the mistakes of others, particularly in the areas of airmanship and mindset, and apply these lessons to flying your Pawnee. It well set you up well in the long run... might not make you rich with time, money and job stability, but you probably are not looking for those things right now?
Fair chance really that you actually quite enjoy flying? If this is so then you ought to grab this opportunity with both hands and enjoy the ride!
A piddling 200 hours of any flying should'nt have a negative impact on any future civilian employer with any real world experience - provided you set your own high personal standards, learn what airmanship is and strive to be very good at applying it. Through books and the net, you can learn from the mistakes of others, particularly in the areas of airmanship and mindset, and apply these lessons to flying your Pawnee. It well set you up well in the long run... might not make you rich with time, money and job stability, but you probably are not looking for those things right now?
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I never knew I was alive until the end of a full day in a PA25. I only stopped to refuel and take a leak. Ask a bank runner or flying school instructor if they have ever done 40+ take-offs and landings in one day?? It can be a lonely job, depending………. however, now looking out from 35 000', i often wish that it could be with the same sense of freedom that came from the view through a bug smeared, wire cutter obscured, 30+ year old windscreen and just one shadow on the wing in the shape of my soul.
Please take the time to get to at least solo standard in gliders as well. There is little worse than a time builder on the front of the rope who has no real interest in what is going on at the other end. As a CASA Tow Pilot training delegate, (and Level 2 Gliding Instructor) I have had several sub-optimal experiences over the years training Commercial pilots to tow gliders who really only saw it as a cheap way to build hours.
The GFA Manual of Standard Procedures recommends that tow pilots be glider pilots as well.
If you fly gliders, you will understand what the glider pilot is looking for, regards what part of the sky to take her/him to. Remember it is the glider pilot who is paying for the operation. As already said by others, glider flying will certainly improve your hands on skills in other forms of aviation. Not to mention all those take offs and landings in the tug.
Many ATPL guys & Pruners fly gliders for fun and the current Chief of the Air Force started his aviation carrier in gliders all those years ago and owns and flys his own glider even now.
It really is great fun flying tugs. You will have a ball!
Greeb
The GFA Manual of Standard Procedures recommends that tow pilots be glider pilots as well.
If you fly gliders, you will understand what the glider pilot is looking for, regards what part of the sky to take her/him to. Remember it is the glider pilot who is paying for the operation. As already said by others, glider flying will certainly improve your hands on skills in other forms of aviation. Not to mention all those take offs and landings in the tug.
Many ATPL guys & Pruners fly gliders for fun and the current Chief of the Air Force started his aviation carrier in gliders all those years ago and owns and flys his own glider even now.
It really is great fun flying tugs. You will have a ball!
Greeb
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Thanks everyone for your response.
Greeb,
I learnt to fly in gliders and I'm a current glider pilot with ABC cert. I doubt I would have got the gig otherwise. I also have 50 odd hours towing in a PA25, I do appreciate the people you speak of though and I couldn't agree more.
Pithblot,
You are bang on, I'm in the process of stepping away from my secure desk job in pursuit of doing something I love! I'm aware it won't be easy but I hope to enjoy the journey.
Again, you have all reiterated that this is a golden opportunity, especially for a low hour pilot such as myself.
Thanks again
Greeb,
I learnt to fly in gliders and I'm a current glider pilot with ABC cert. I doubt I would have got the gig otherwise. I also have 50 odd hours towing in a PA25, I do appreciate the people you speak of though and I couldn't agree more.
Pithblot,
You are bang on, I'm in the process of stepping away from my secure desk job in pursuit of doing something I love! I'm aware it won't be easy but I hope to enjoy the journey.
Again, you have all reiterated that this is a golden opportunity, especially for a low hour pilot such as myself.
Thanks again
Man Bilong Balus long PNG
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danosoaring; Enjoy the gig but remember to keep your `head on a swivel` at all times.
As you have already done some towing you will appreciate just how hard it can be at times to see modern glass ships.
Concur with the above. My record is 55 tows in one day. Twice; Once at Waikerie in VH-WGC and the other time here at Takikawa, flying a Robin DR400.
That one was a very long day!!!
Now have around 2,000hrs GliderTowing and still enjoy it!
Nurse; My pills please!!!
As you have already done some towing you will appreciate just how hard it can be at times to see modern glass ships.
I never knew I was alive until the end of a full day in a PA25. I only stopped to refuel and take a leak.
That one was a very long day!!!
Now have around 2,000hrs GliderTowing and still enjoy it!
Nurse; My pills please!!!
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I used to fly the Pawnee on weekends at Benalla many years ago after I did the glider course on the Kooka. Kept the day job for income and I think you should do the same, but flog the arse off it every Saturday and Sunday wx permitting.
Up and down, noisy and silent.
Not only will you tug up.... you may also may have to go off and find someone in a paddock who has fallen short on a cross country exercise and bring them home.
There's heaps to learn about retrieves from all sorts of out-landing places, like you can only get into the field under a power line, and plenty of considerations about T/O distance, ground conditions, length of grass, far fence height and etc.
You have to really do some serious thinking in tight situations so your tow out of a marginal field all works as planned.
Or you call in the trailer.
All good decision making experiences that you don't normally get in the operating from an aerodrome world. Flying skill building with a difference!
Enjoy and stay safe.
There's heaps to learn about retrieves from all sorts of out-landing places, like you can only get into the field under a power line, and plenty of considerations about T/O distance, ground conditions, length of grass, far fence height and etc.
You have to really do some serious thinking in tight situations so your tow out of a marginal field all works as planned.
Or you call in the trailer.
All good decision making experiences that you don't normally get in the operating from an aerodrome world. Flying skill building with a difference!
Enjoy and stay safe.
Man Bilong Balus long PNG
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: Looking forward to returning to Japan soon but in the meantime continuing the never ending search for a bad bottle of Red!
Age: 69
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Not only will you tug up.... you may also may have to go off and find someone in a paddock who has fallen short on a cross country exercise and bring them home.
There's heaps to learn about retrieves from all sorts of out-landing places, like you can only get into the field under a power line, and plenty of considerations about T/O distance, ground conditions, length of grass, far fence height and etc.
You have to really do some serious thinking in tight situations so your tow out of a marginal field all works as planned.
Or you call in the trailer.
There's heaps to learn about retrieves from all sorts of out-landing places, like you can only get into the field under a power line, and plenty of considerations about T/O distance, ground conditions, length of grass, far fence height and etc.
You have to really do some serious thinking in tight situations so your tow out of a marginal field all works as planned.
Or you call in the trailer.
I have quite a few A/T retrieves including three gliders all in the same paddock about 50 or so nm from Waikerie on one occasion during a National Comps. One of the Pilots was a rather dejected Ingo Renner who was very sad at having to land out as he thought he`d blown his chances at winning his class.He recovered magnificently and still won.
Also had one of my biggest scares in a retrieve.
A Japanese Pilot visiting Waikerie dropped a wing on take off, managed to pick it up but overcorrected and started swerving from side to side. Thankfully the power of the Tug managed to eventually pull him straight before he dug a wing in and we climbed out ok. Not something I wish to repeat!!
He was given a quiet talking to by the Japanese Instructor at the Club Bar later that evening.
Busy days...
Pinky leads with 55 tows in one day. Beats 38 hands down.
End of that very long day was a far out retrieve with the sun plunging towards the horizon. Slung the guy out and continued the climb so eventually he tells me he has final glide height for distance. Hops off the rope and slides by, picking up speed and hurtles off for home, his silhouette against a splendid backlit panorama of clouds.
I can only nose down and give chase to him and the afterglow on the horizon. The air is smooth as glass and as you swing onto odark finals, you can only think.. YES..!! ..this is what its all about!!
danosoar..enjoy.!!
End of that very long day was a far out retrieve with the sun plunging towards the horizon. Slung the guy out and continued the climb so eventually he tells me he has final glide height for distance. Hops off the rope and slides by, picking up speed and hurtles off for home, his silhouette against a splendid backlit panorama of clouds.
I can only nose down and give chase to him and the afterglow on the horizon. The air is smooth as glass and as you swing onto odark finals, you can only think.. YES..!! ..this is what its all about!!
danosoar..enjoy.!!
Man Bilong Balus long PNG
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worst part is the realisation that his lack of pace is hitting your own back pocket
I always climbed at standard speed of 68kt to about 2,000 ft then went into a cruise climb of 75 to 85 kt depending on the Glider concerned. Once they had sufficient altitude to get home and they released I went into the usual descent of 105kt and 2300rpm. It always seemed to get me to the circuit area at circuit joining height.
Never had any complaints.