Air Crew Fireproof Uniforms/clothing footwear
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: australia
Posts: 221
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I would not lose much sleep over fires in small planes. Consider the likelihood of having any accident being very small, then consider that less than 5 percent of those rare GA crashes result in a fire and the risk is pretty low. Then remember that there is a good chance that you will probably already be dead from being mangled to pieces should you have a serious GA crash so flashy suits are kinda useless anyway.
You are better off preventing your burns by making sure you fly safely and not crashing in the first place. The rest will work itself out.
You are better off preventing your burns by making sure you fly safely and not crashing in the first place. The rest will work itself out.
Join Date: May 2008
Location: Somewhere
Posts: 283
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Checkboard,
It's good, until you jump into the cockpits with screens rather than steam and have it reflecting insanely well off the screens, in some cases enough to effectively not see any information on the screens. But even then you can get some pretty nasty reflections off the round dials.
White shirts are also pretty bad culprits for reflecting off glass cockpit panels.
I have had to get my coey to remove his high-vis before because reflection was so bad i couldnt read the engine instruments on the centre screen. Sectors were short enough to not normally worry about taking the vest off, putting it on, taking it off etc, so we often just left them on- not so much any more in the glass machines.
How about this then, for a pilot jacket:
White shirts are also pretty bad culprits for reflecting off glass cockpit panels.
I have had to get my coey to remove his high-vis before because reflection was so bad i couldnt read the engine instruments on the centre screen. Sectors were short enough to not normally worry about taking the vest off, putting it on, taking it off etc, so we often just left them on- not so much any more in the glass machines.
Join Date: May 2002
Location: Permanently lost
Posts: 1,785
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
For those who think Nomex racewear clothing is the go please remember that it was designed to give 30 seconds of protection. After that the heat build-up will start to burn flesh. 30 seconds is the time after which a fire marshall should be in attendance. It would be a lot longer for any aircraft crash.
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Australia
Posts: 1,414
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
In another life we were shown photos of burns on aircrew. Nylon wrist-watch bands were deadly because the nylon melted into the wrist. And would you believe that wearing socks that needed darning because toes were exposed, was equally horrifying to see burnt off toes. These were wartime aviation medicine photos.
Strange though that may seem, all these shocking photos paled in comparison to the 'orrible venereal disease photos of spotted and oozy dongers that we were shown as young recruits in the Air Force. Put me off for life - well almost.
Strange though that may seem, all these shocking photos paled in comparison to the 'orrible venereal disease photos of spotted and oozy dongers that we were shown as young recruits in the Air Force. Put me off for life - well almost.
Sisley clothing... GIve them a try.
They make all the flying suits (one and two piece), for the company I fly for. In fact it's fair to say they make pretty much all the zoombags for all the major helo operators here in Australia.
They make all the flying suits (one and two piece), for the company I fly for. In fact it's fair to say they make pretty much all the zoombags for all the major helo operators here in Australia.
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: australia
Posts: 221
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Compressor stall, yes you should definitely wear your seatbelt. Maybe buy a full fireproof suit and nomex helmet with a nomex chin strap and some nomex jocks for the five minute drive to the shops on saturday also...... Can never be too safe now hey!
In fact, why not wear it when cooking also, just in case your fish fingers cause a firestorm in the kitchen.
In fact, why not wear it when cooking also, just in case your fish fingers cause a firestorm in the kitchen.
For the risk involved, personally I'd use the requirements for club level motorsport as a guide. No synthetics, long pants, long sleeve shirt with collar. On the basis that you need hand dexterity to get out, you could consider nomex gloves. Nomex socks are not very comfortable, but pure wool socks are easy to source. You could consider leather shoes - or indeed racing shoes. But leather soles are a poor grip surface for tarmac wear. That enhances your ability to get out of the aircraft.
The problem with fire extinguishers is that the commonly available dry powder ones don't really work. We put (from memory) six into a burning car at a racetrack and didn't permanently extinguish the fire. An aircraft fire is likely to be bigger. The old (environmentally unfriendly) BCF extinguishers are much better, but they illegal for pretty much everything except aviation and consequently are difficult / expensive to get and poisonous to breathe. Not a great option for in flight use, but probably nothing is.
The problem with fire extinguishers is that the commonly available dry powder ones don't really work. We put (from memory) six into a burning car at a racetrack and didn't permanently extinguish the fire. An aircraft fire is likely to be bigger. The old (environmentally unfriendly) BCF extinguishers are much better, but they illegal for pretty much everything except aviation and consequently are difficult / expensive to get and poisonous to breathe. Not a great option for in flight use, but probably nothing is.
Join Date: May 2007
Location: Aus, or USA, or UK or EU, or possibly somehwere in Asia.
Posts: 320
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Victor Two:
You clearly are one of those pprune contributors who have no problem with displaying their complete ignorance, whilst honestly believing that they are making sense.
Your facile premise that just not crashing is better than being prepared for an accident displays the mental logic of an ant, no disrespect to ants. Go ahead and drive without your seat-belt. I also expect that your car is not equipped with airbags, abs, esp, collapsible steering column, anti intrusion bars or safety glass. These are clearly unnecessary items that would cramp your cavalier attitude to hazard analysis. You most likely also have crabs, the clap and possibly HIV with that attitude.
Long sleeves and pants, natural fibres, woolen socks with the elasticized part turned down over the outside, good quality leather boots (or shoes) can all provide at least a minimal level of flash flame protection, and are no real issue to wear, and yes, I have operated in the tropics. I have also spent up to 10 hours a day in hot cockpits under a bubble sliding canopy, behind a very big hot engine, while wearing a heavy duty flight suit (dark green to minimise the reflections), helmet and gloves. Amazingly one of the other pilots used to work in dick-togs, leather sandals david clarks. (eh, JH). The fact that neither of us crashed at that period of time proves nothing but luck. At least i had some insurance against the odds.
I wear a pair of correctly fitting nomex gloves as a matter of course and have no issues with them under normal circumstances. I have worn such gloves for 38 years now and cannot consider flying without them.
There are numerous GA operations where the hazard level is higher than others and a flight suit and helmet are a cheap investment. Again I have been used to wearing them whenever i considered there was an elevated risk. I have kicked, punched and clawed my way out of an inverted burning wreck and would not have survived without the safety gear I was wearing, especially my helmet which kept me conscious in the period immediately after (final) impact despite a severe head impact. this allowed me to get out before the cockpit was completely consumed by fire. that is what they are for. In the three serious accidents that i have been involved in, in every case my life was either saved (2 of them) or my injuries significantly reduced,( the other one.)
Not every pilot needs all the fruit, but elementary precautions such as long sleeves and pants (and gloves) not can dramatically reduce post impact fire trauma, but also reduces sunburn and skin cancer.
A couple of other hints: in the event of a forced landing off airport:
take your feet off the rudder pedals just before touch down/impact, especially in aircraft with fixed nose wheel steering. Those unbroken ankles are much easier to run on.
If you smell fuel in the cabin after impact take one deep breath and hold it til you are outside (or cover your mouth with rag cloth, or even your sleeve, or gloved hand). If it all goes up while you are inhaling a lungful of fuel rich air you will do for your lungs, even if your survive the fire flash and get out of the plane, you will die a few days later.
Other people have demonstrated all of this over the years, this is 'tombstone education'. learn from their lessons.
HD
You clearly are one of those pprune contributors who have no problem with displaying their complete ignorance, whilst honestly believing that they are making sense.
Your facile premise that just not crashing is better than being prepared for an accident displays the mental logic of an ant, no disrespect to ants. Go ahead and drive without your seat-belt. I also expect that your car is not equipped with airbags, abs, esp, collapsible steering column, anti intrusion bars or safety glass. These are clearly unnecessary items that would cramp your cavalier attitude to hazard analysis. You most likely also have crabs, the clap and possibly HIV with that attitude.
Long sleeves and pants, natural fibres, woolen socks with the elasticized part turned down over the outside, good quality leather boots (or shoes) can all provide at least a minimal level of flash flame protection, and are no real issue to wear, and yes, I have operated in the tropics. I have also spent up to 10 hours a day in hot cockpits under a bubble sliding canopy, behind a very big hot engine, while wearing a heavy duty flight suit (dark green to minimise the reflections), helmet and gloves. Amazingly one of the other pilots used to work in dick-togs, leather sandals david clarks. (eh, JH). The fact that neither of us crashed at that period of time proves nothing but luck. At least i had some insurance against the odds.
I wear a pair of correctly fitting nomex gloves as a matter of course and have no issues with them under normal circumstances. I have worn such gloves for 38 years now and cannot consider flying without them.
There are numerous GA operations where the hazard level is higher than others and a flight suit and helmet are a cheap investment. Again I have been used to wearing them whenever i considered there was an elevated risk. I have kicked, punched and clawed my way out of an inverted burning wreck and would not have survived without the safety gear I was wearing, especially my helmet which kept me conscious in the period immediately after (final) impact despite a severe head impact. this allowed me to get out before the cockpit was completely consumed by fire. that is what they are for. In the three serious accidents that i have been involved in, in every case my life was either saved (2 of them) or my injuries significantly reduced,( the other one.)
Not every pilot needs all the fruit, but elementary precautions such as long sleeves and pants (and gloves) not can dramatically reduce post impact fire trauma, but also reduces sunburn and skin cancer.
A couple of other hints: in the event of a forced landing off airport:
take your feet off the rudder pedals just before touch down/impact, especially in aircraft with fixed nose wheel steering. Those unbroken ankles are much easier to run on.
If you smell fuel in the cabin after impact take one deep breath and hold it til you are outside (or cover your mouth with rag cloth, or even your sleeve, or gloved hand). If it all goes up while you are inhaling a lungful of fuel rich air you will do for your lungs, even if your survive the fire flash and get out of the plane, you will die a few days later.
Other people have demonstrated all of this over the years, this is 'tombstone education'. learn from their lessons.
HD
We should all remember to learn from the mistakes of others - we're not going to live long enough to make them all ourselves... Those who don't want to take the advice may end up learning the hard way one day...
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Australia
Posts: 1,414
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
We should all remember to learn from the mistakes of others
I received a mighty painful lesson to my ring finger when the ring got caught on a metal protuberance while jumping from the rear turret of a Lincoln on the ground where I had been hiding during an escape and evasion exercise at Townsville. It was only a three foot drop to the tarmac but the damage to my trapped finger hurt severely But that was military flying of course where the dangers were greater than lolling over steak and eggs in an A380 on $380,000 a year
Join Date: May 2007
Location: Aus, or USA, or UK or EU, or possibly somehwere in Asia.
Posts: 320
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
A37575
You are only partly correct about not wearing your wedding ring for safety reasons.
I used to not wear mine whenever I was away up country in my ag flying days, but it did not always prevent injuries as a consequence. Still, one lives and learns.
HD
You are only partly correct about not wearing your wedding ring for safety reasons.
I used to not wear mine whenever I was away up country in my ag flying days, but it did not always prevent injuries as a consequence. Still, one lives and learns.
HD
