Qantas Reduces LHR slip Time
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Merry Christmas to all no matter what you do and where you work.....
Just to prove it is the season of miracles.....
Originally posted by Twiggs
Apparently,Twiggs is now a qualified medical practioner,fully able to quantify the minimum amount of rest the human body needs.So regardless of how run down you feel, you can be reassured that your health is in safe and secure hands....
The company has many such people although they are usually reluctant to tell you the university at which they attained those qualifications and how they arrived at such arbitrary figures....
The problem Twiggs is that the effect of jetlag is accumulative.So how do your studies account for that affect on the human body.Just how many London trips back to back are possible with minimum rest before a dangerous level of fatigue is achieved.....
Just to prove it is the season of miracles.....
Originally posted by Twiggs
38 hours is plenty of time to rest,
The company has many such people although they are usually reluctant to tell you the university at which they attained those qualifications and how they arrived at such arbitrary figures....
The problem Twiggs is that the effect of jetlag is accumulative.So how do your studies account for that affect on the human body.Just how many London trips back to back are possible with minimum rest before a dangerous level of fatigue is achieved.....
I simply can't believe the 'old school' long haul flight attendants agreed to an EBA whereby fellow employees don't actually get the same rights as them. Let's not talk about the pay and other rostering practices.
Absolutely disgusting...
Absolutely disgusting...
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I simply can't believe the 'old school' long haul flight attendants agreed to an EBA whereby fellow employees don't actually get the same rights as them. Let's not talk about the pay and other rostering practices.
Absolutely disgusting
Absolutely disgusting
Now wait for Peg and the rest of the gang to come on here and say how they had no choice, and the company would have done it anyway.....blah blah blah.
Can you imagine the techies allowing the company to start up a cheaper pilot group ....pffft never....you guys stick solid.
Anyway sorry for the thread drift....now back to the original topic.
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T L and Skylarker,
No point in going over that subject again as that chapter has well and truly closed.
This thread is about the lowering of the slip in London and no doubt other slip ports in the future to just above minimum slip times.
Twiggs,I can't help you if you don't help yourself.If you continue to support the company in just about everything they do when you post then it's no wonder people here believe that you are in the office.
It doesn't matter if you are or not but to say 38 hours is plenty of time to rest is up there with some of your other well known posts.
This time however,you can't say you were being sarcastic when you said 38 hours is plenty of time to rest.
The major problem as some others have said is that there is not much room for error in the case of delays.
You know as well as most of us that it is only a matter of time before a vote is needed.
If there is a feeling that the airline is messing around with slip times then there will be no votes coming in with other acts of non co-operation when crew are asked by ops for something.
The other major point as made by lobey is that fatigue is accumulative.
If you are doing back top back Londons,then you are going to have problems.
Doing this in the short term might save a few dollars but when the delays start to happen and based crew are called out then the costs will mount and someone will have to answer why.
No point in going over that subject again as that chapter has well and truly closed.
This thread is about the lowering of the slip in London and no doubt other slip ports in the future to just above minimum slip times.
Twiggs,I can't help you if you don't help yourself.If you continue to support the company in just about everything they do when you post then it's no wonder people here believe that you are in the office.
It doesn't matter if you are or not but to say 38 hours is plenty of time to rest is up there with some of your other well known posts.
This time however,you can't say you were being sarcastic when you said 38 hours is plenty of time to rest.
The major problem as some others have said is that there is not much room for error in the case of delays.
You know as well as most of us that it is only a matter of time before a vote is needed.
If there is a feeling that the airline is messing around with slip times then there will be no votes coming in with other acts of non co-operation when crew are asked by ops for something.
The other major point as made by lobey is that fatigue is accumulative.
If you are doing back top back Londons,then you are going to have problems.
Doing this in the short term might save a few dollars but when the delays start to happen and based crew are called out then the costs will mount and someone will have to answer why.
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Its called Jetstar
Dress it up anyway you like, but they dont work together on the same flightdeck, on the same routes. No way would a QF techie fly with a J* techie...period.
Anyhow, as said previously, its in the past and a done deal...so we move on.
I chose to forgive but never forget.
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Cheaper
Domestic Crew are about to be confronted with QD.
What will they do?
QCCA will eventually all work on the A380.Thats why they were employed.
JetStar is the Cheap Pilot Group.
Eventually they may fly with mainline pilots.
Never say never.
Anyway this is yesterdays toast...old and stale
What will they do?
QCCA will eventually all work on the A380.Thats why they were employed.
JetStar is the Cheap Pilot Group.
Eventually they may fly with mainline pilots.
Never say never.
Anyway this is yesterdays toast...old and stale
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to twiggs et al
if i vote to reduce my slip then get my wake up call 33 hours later and decide i am too knackered to work am i obligated to call the csm or do i call global lifeline. what if my vote to reduce the slip was the one that got it over the line? does this change the result of the vote?
what will be my next duty/pax? pax qf31 a.m. or operate qf10 p.m. 24 hours later? any answers appreciated
if i vote to reduce my slip then get my wake up call 33 hours later and decide i am too knackered to work am i obligated to call the csm or do i call global lifeline. what if my vote to reduce the slip was the one that got it over the line? does this change the result of the vote?
what will be my next duty/pax? pax qf31 a.m. or operate qf10 p.m. 24 hours later? any answers appreciated
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Q and A
If you are fatigued tell your CSM and seek his/her guidance.If you dont agree with the guidance offered call global lifeline and write a safety report.
Write a safety report anyway
You wont know if it was your vote that got the reduced slip over the line.The vote is supposed to be anonymous.
You dont go back to work until you clear yourself.This means that you are able to operate safely.That is your call .
Write a safety report anyway
You wont know if it was your vote that got the reduced slip over the line.The vote is supposed to be anonymous.
You dont go back to work until you clear yourself.This means that you are able to operate safely.That is your call .
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to twiggs et al
if i vote to reduce my slip then get my wake up call 33 hours later and decide i am too knackered to work am i obligated to call the csm or do i call global lifeline. what if my vote to reduce the slip was the one that got it over the line? does this change the result of the vote?
what will be my next duty/pax? pax qf31 a.m. or operate qf10 p.m. 24 hours later? any answers appreciated
if i vote to reduce my slip then get my wake up call 33 hours later and decide i am too knackered to work am i obligated to call the csm or do i call global lifeline. what if my vote to reduce the slip was the one that got it over the line? does this change the result of the vote?
what will be my next duty/pax? pax qf31 a.m. or operate qf10 p.m. 24 hours later? any answers appreciated
(this is not a shot at your advice MF, which sounds reasonable)
I can't see why the scenario you described would be any different to anybody who at call time found that they were unfit to fly due to illness.
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I agree that having different crew on different pay scales on the same aircraft is not ideal....
However,the precedent was already set when we operated with Thai Cabin Crew as well as New Zealand based Crew.Both of these latter groups work and pay conditions are far less than Australian based Crew.....
The pilots union as far as I know have also made some decisions which in hindsight were not that good.Their decision not to allow impulse pilots to join their union was shortsighted at best...
These same Impulse pilots were then used by Dixon to start up Jetstar and they were not impressed with the rebuke from the mainline pilots union.If those pilots were members of the mainline union things would have been dramatically different....
Does this mean any information other than your own?
Since most Australian based crew bid to go to LHR for a reason it is obvious that if they were given the chance to have an extra night would jump at the chance....
The crew doing those trips go there for specific reasons and to get an extra night would be a win for them.They will be back in Singapore next trip any way so it's a win/win for them because they are thumbing their nose at the company and getting an extra night in LHR.
In fact I think that the Australian based crew would be almost wishing for a delay into LHR so that they get a chance to have an extra night....
The company will have to pay a LHR based crew to operate to Singapore and that means taking one crew out of their pool.If this happens regularly the company would not be impressed regardless of what propaganda is being fed here .....
However,the precedent was already set when we operated with Thai Cabin Crew as well as New Zealand based Crew.Both of these latter groups work and pay conditions are far less than Australian based Crew.....
The pilots union as far as I know have also made some decisions which in hindsight were not that good.Their decision not to allow impulse pilots to join their union was shortsighted at best...
These same Impulse pilots were then used by Dixon to start up Jetstar and they were not impressed with the rebuke from the mainline pilots union.If those pilots were members of the mainline union things would have been dramatically different....
rather than relying on the misinformation posted on this forum.
Since most Australian based crew bid to go to LHR for a reason it is obvious that if they were given the chance to have an extra night would jump at the chance....
The crew doing those trips go there for specific reasons and to get an extra night would be a win for them.They will be back in Singapore next trip any way so it's a win/win for them because they are thumbing their nose at the company and getting an extra night in LHR.
In fact I think that the Australian based crew would be almost wishing for a delay into LHR so that they get a chance to have an extra night....
The company will have to pay a LHR based crew to operate to Singapore and that means taking one crew out of their pool.If this happens regularly the company would not be impressed regardless of what propaganda is being fed here .....
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indamiddle....Unless you have an immediate physical condition which necessitates a doctor then you should always call your CSM and let him/her know of your intentions...
You should then call ops or global lifeline depending on your condition if you are unable to work....
Whether or not your vote is decisive should have no bearing on your vote.If you don't feel as though you should accept a reduced slip then don't.Whatever ops do with you after that is variable so there is no point in trying to think of that angle...anything is possible.
The main issue is whether or not you are fit enough and believe that a reduced slip is warranted...
You should then call ops or global lifeline depending on your condition if you are unable to work....
Whether or not your vote is decisive should have no bearing on your vote.If you don't feel as though you should accept a reduced slip then don't.Whatever ops do with you after that is variable so there is no point in trying to think of that angle...anything is possible.
The main issue is whether or not you are fit enough and believe that a reduced slip is warranted...
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Well BP 266 bid books show a change to the Aus based CC LHR trips.
Now they are going up and back via BKK with 38 hrs in LHR.
All the trips are SYD base which must be a bit disappointing for the MEL base.
Some of the TOD's for the sector BKK-LHR are less than 14 hrs, so if one of these was delayed, there would be no 36 hr long range minimum rest.
I wonder if this will have an effect on the BKK base?
Now they are going up and back via BKK with 38 hrs in LHR.
All the trips are SYD base which must be a bit disappointing for the MEL base.
Some of the TOD's for the sector BKK-LHR are less than 14 hrs, so if one of these was delayed, there would be no 36 hr long range minimum rest.
I wonder if this will have an effect on the BKK base?
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Delay
That would depend on how long the delay is.
Fatigue is a also a factor.If you feel you have not achieved suitable rest and are unsure that you can safely operate then dont go to work.
Self reporting and culpability in the instance of an accident should be foremost in any crew members mind.
Twiggs-Is that you louise?
Fatigue is a also a factor.If you feel you have not achieved suitable rest and are unsure that you can safely operate then dont go to work.
Self reporting and culpability in the instance of an accident should be foremost in any crew members mind.
Twiggs-Is that you louise?
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Yes it seems so.
I'm sure there are just as many crew who will enjoy the time in BKK now though.
Just like the old days!
I've just noticed that there are now some 62 hr slips in LHR!
I'm sure there are just as many crew who will enjoy the time in BKK now though.
Just like the old days!
I've just noticed that there are now some 62 hr slips in LHR!
Last edited by twiggs; 1st Aug 2009 at 01:12. Reason: added the 62 hr slip info
