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A1 if your story is accurate (and well handled if it is), and as recent as you suggest you're taking a huge risk if the boss in question reads this thread.
He may well, and probably does, have some grudging respect for your stand on the day but that will evaporate when he sees you not reciprocating that grudging respect (he did the right thing in the end too) by posting about it on here.
Just food for thought.
To the rest...this is the sort of thread that quickly gets out of hand and attracts trouble.
If you keep it as it currently (mostly) is, absolutely unidentifiable, it'll be ok but if it starts down the road of disgruntled pilots trying to slap current or past employers for perceived slights then it will be deleted in a heartbeat.
He may well, and probably does, have some grudging respect for your stand on the day but that will evaporate when he sees you not reciprocating that grudging respect (he did the right thing in the end too) by posting about it on here.
Just food for thought.
To the rest...this is the sort of thread that quickly gets out of hand and attracts trouble.
If you keep it as it currently (mostly) is, absolutely unidentifiable, it'll be ok but if it starts down the road of disgruntled pilots trying to slap current or past employers for perceived slights then it will be deleted in a heartbeat.
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What he said!
Couldn't agree more. The idea is too give a heads up to our fellow pilots. If we attempt to name and shame or refer to an accident or incident that is too easily identifiable it will end badly and the only people that will gain from the exercise are the lawyers.
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Am sure the Mods will put the lid on this thread soon enough. As much as we would like to hear some of the nasty tactics that has been perpetrated by operators who ought to know better human nature won't allow us to not let loose with both barrels sometimes when it comes to being stabbed in the back or being hard done by.
"till then we must try to use the 'kiss' method here & make the stories mostly generic.
CW
"till then we must try to use the 'kiss' method here & make the stories mostly generic.
CW
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Much Ado,
I totally understand what u are saying and will take it on board! But I don’t work for that operator anymore. The story is extremely accurate the only things I left out were the swear words and yelling. There is such a shortage of twin drivers out there that I don’t need to work for unsafe operators and not only that there is a right way to talk to people (Yelling and screaming is just not on in my book). If there wasn’t such a shortage or drivers out there I probably would have done as I was told to keep my job.
My previous employer wouldn’t know how to turn on a computer let alone log on to PPRUNE. I don’t think anyone will read this and put two and two together, but news travels fast in aviation so I will just keep quiet from now on.
I totally understand what u are saying and will take it on board! But I don’t work for that operator anymore. The story is extremely accurate the only things I left out were the swear words and yelling. There is such a shortage of twin drivers out there that I don’t need to work for unsafe operators and not only that there is a right way to talk to people (Yelling and screaming is just not on in my book). If there wasn’t such a shortage or drivers out there I probably would have done as I was told to keep my job.
My previous employer wouldn’t know how to turn on a computer let alone log on to PPRUNE. I don’t think anyone will read this and put two and two together, but news travels fast in aviation so I will just keep quiet from now on.
Last edited by airman1; 7th May 2008 at 12:33. Reason: Spelling!!
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What about the 'pilot' who joined a company as 'ops manager' and took all the calls for charters etc.
One would arrive at the office and he would come in 'off a job' - a job no one else had heard about - or was asked to operate.
Funnily enough, he was like, at least number 10 down the seniority list.
He wasn't short of a bob (like the rest of us were) - only short of hours - but could afford to fly to another capital city every other weekend to work on a house he and his partner owned, and daddy got him a job in an airline nice and early in the piece thereafter.
Opportunism & nepotism - all in the same body.
Ah, the pilot 'fraternity'.
One would arrive at the office and he would come in 'off a job' - a job no one else had heard about - or was asked to operate.
Funnily enough, he was like, at least number 10 down the seniority list.
He wasn't short of a bob (like the rest of us were) - only short of hours - but could afford to fly to another capital city every other weekend to work on a house he and his partner owned, and daddy got him a job in an airline nice and early in the piece thereafter.
Opportunism & nepotism - all in the same body.
Ah, the pilot 'fraternity'.
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Any mail for me?
Had a pilot who used to bring the mail in from remote communities as part of the freight. Locals used to send money in the mail to rellies in the "big smoke" as bank transfers were a tad out of their capability. This pilot seemed to live well beyond his means whilst in town. Last heard being pursued by the Federal police....jerk.
Last edited by flying-spike; 7th May 2008 at 22:32. Reason: editorial
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I was wrong, nobody has been hard done by!
Ok guys, I thought this would chockas with good yarns to share about @rsholes and their act in the industry. Is this all we have. Is everybody happy? Is it all peace,light and happiness? Please, don't disillusion meany more!
Great thread,
I think we have all been asked (or expected) to bust duty before.
But as far as labelling someone a dodgy operator, just look at CAO 20.18.10
In the case of charter or RPT aircraft, all instruments and equipment fitted to the aircraft must be serviceable before take-off..... (mel, pus and so on) but you get my point. Are there any above board operators?????
I think we have all been asked (or expected) to bust duty before.
But as far as labelling someone a dodgy operator, just look at CAO 20.18.10
In the case of charter or RPT aircraft, all instruments and equipment fitted to the aircraft must be serviceable before take-off..... (mel, pus and so on) but you get my point. Are there any above board operators?????
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Two stories, both about the same operator.
First one was a departure from Tennant Creek at about 0500 during a heavy wet season. It was the one that almost washed Katherine away, '98/'99? It also caused flooding of parts of the Tanami (which, incidentally, scared the cr@p out of me when having flown 90 minutes on a 187 track from Tindal I saw the moon reflected on water through a break in the clouds. WTF?!! I thought I was out over the Timor
). I was flying a C210 and had to find my way through really heavy rain to land and when I did the noise of the water being thrown off the mains onto the underside of the wings was deafening, never heard anything like it. Water on the runways and apron was flowing an inch or two deep and I had to taxi in with a dog and a white stick.
Dropped off the freight, topped up the fuel and headed for Alice. At 300' the AH toppled and the ASI dropped to zero. Cloudbase was about 500' and thick enough for it still to be dark underneath so I had the choice of either climbing in IMC through the cloud and almost certainly into an embedded CB or a low level circuit in the dark and landing. Seeing as how I'd been doing the run twice a week for over a year and knew the Tennant circuit well I opted for the latter. The subsequent phone call to the boss contained a number of threats about what would happen to me if I didn't press on. I told him I was heading for the company house in town where he'd find me once someone had replaced the flooded vac pump and drained the pitot/staic system. A few hours later I got a call to say the aircraft was ready so I ambled out to the airport where I found the boss (a LAME) standing on the uncowled engine trying to undo a stubborn bolt with a long screwdriver and half-brick. It was a 'Snap-On' brick though so that was ok.
Once he'd finished I then had to fly the freight and him back to Alice, the atmosphere was less than cordial perhaps not helped by me deliberately flying through every bit of cloud I could find (he was scared of flying)
Story 2. Left Darwin for Ramingining in a C402 fresh from maintenance. Only passengers were two locals who had missed the Metro flight and they were asleep before I'd closed the doors. One woke up around TOC and started singing along to his boom-box, Slim Dusty probably. A little later he started punching and kicking the seat in front of him, my warning to pack it in had no effect and around then I was informed that I was a "pucking white c*nt". I also caught him swigging from a bottle of Bundy that he'd somehow smuggled on board which explained his behaviour. As I was past halfway I called ahead to the company agent and asked her to have her hubby the local police sergeant there when I landed. In the meantime there was nothing I could do (single crew) other than let him drink and verbally abuse me. Things started getting nasty though and he got out of his seat and came at me with the bottle. I pulled the pin from the extinguisher and threatened to spray him with 'poison' then beat him to death with the empty which got him to sit down. As I was restowing the extinguisher he rushed me and I dropped it under my seat so had to resort to knocking off the autopilot and pulling and pushing hard a couple of times pinning him to the floor and throwing him against the ceiling. His mate stayed fast asleep!!
The bottle wielder finished his Bundy, passed out downwind, fell into the aisle on base leg and pissed his trousers on final. After shutdown his mate saw him and legged it so while we awaited the paddywagon I 'tested the patient for consciousness' with a couple of toe punts between the eyes. He didn't wake up
I filed all the reports but the company refused to pursue it because ".....it might put other aboriginal passengers off flying with us". How could it? Nobody but me knew I'd put the boot in!
Edited to add a third tale.
All single crew RPT aircraft require a functioning autopilot, nothing says you have to use it though. So, the company would fix and test the AP, sign it off as functioning then mark the on/off knob with engineers sealant so they'd know if you'd switched it on or not because "If you use it we'll inevitably have to repair it again".
First one was a departure from Tennant Creek at about 0500 during a heavy wet season. It was the one that almost washed Katherine away, '98/'99? It also caused flooding of parts of the Tanami (which, incidentally, scared the cr@p out of me when having flown 90 minutes on a 187 track from Tindal I saw the moon reflected on water through a break in the clouds. WTF?!! I thought I was out over the Timor
). I was flying a C210 and had to find my way through really heavy rain to land and when I did the noise of the water being thrown off the mains onto the underside of the wings was deafening, never heard anything like it. Water on the runways and apron was flowing an inch or two deep and I had to taxi in with a dog and a white stick.Dropped off the freight, topped up the fuel and headed for Alice. At 300' the AH toppled and the ASI dropped to zero. Cloudbase was about 500' and thick enough for it still to be dark underneath so I had the choice of either climbing in IMC through the cloud and almost certainly into an embedded CB or a low level circuit in the dark and landing. Seeing as how I'd been doing the run twice a week for over a year and knew the Tennant circuit well I opted for the latter. The subsequent phone call to the boss contained a number of threats about what would happen to me if I didn't press on. I told him I was heading for the company house in town where he'd find me once someone had replaced the flooded vac pump and drained the pitot/staic system. A few hours later I got a call to say the aircraft was ready so I ambled out to the airport where I found the boss (a LAME) standing on the uncowled engine trying to undo a stubborn bolt with a long screwdriver and half-brick. It was a 'Snap-On' brick though so that was ok.
Once he'd finished I then had to fly the freight and him back to Alice, the atmosphere was less than cordial perhaps not helped by me deliberately flying through every bit of cloud I could find (he was scared of flying)
Story 2. Left Darwin for Ramingining in a C402 fresh from maintenance. Only passengers were two locals who had missed the Metro flight and they were asleep before I'd closed the doors. One woke up around TOC and started singing along to his boom-box, Slim Dusty probably. A little later he started punching and kicking the seat in front of him, my warning to pack it in had no effect and around then I was informed that I was a "pucking white c*nt". I also caught him swigging from a bottle of Bundy that he'd somehow smuggled on board which explained his behaviour. As I was past halfway I called ahead to the company agent and asked her to have her hubby the local police sergeant there when I landed. In the meantime there was nothing I could do (single crew) other than let him drink and verbally abuse me. Things started getting nasty though and he got out of his seat and came at me with the bottle. I pulled the pin from the extinguisher and threatened to spray him with 'poison' then beat him to death with the empty which got him to sit down. As I was restowing the extinguisher he rushed me and I dropped it under my seat so had to resort to knocking off the autopilot and pulling and pushing hard a couple of times pinning him to the floor and throwing him against the ceiling. His mate stayed fast asleep!!
The bottle wielder finished his Bundy, passed out downwind, fell into the aisle on base leg and pissed his trousers on final. After shutdown his mate saw him and legged it so while we awaited the paddywagon I 'tested the patient for consciousness' with a couple of toe punts between the eyes. He didn't wake up
I filed all the reports but the company refused to pursue it because ".....it might put other aboriginal passengers off flying with us". How could it? Nobody but me knew I'd put the boot in!
Edited to add a third tale.
All single crew RPT aircraft require a functioning autopilot, nothing says you have to use it though. So, the company would fix and test the AP, sign it off as functioning then mark the on/off knob with engineers sealant so they'd know if you'd switched it on or not because "If you use it we'll inevitably have to repair it again".
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hey 'fred' tell us sumfin' interesting next time mate, sounds like you just described a normal days outing/s with a lot of operators in da bush!
Still amusing anyway, ta
CW
Still amusing anyway, ta
CW
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Ops Normal
(1) Had a similar incident had just selected gear up departing off 36 Dn when one of the "locals"decided he would come up front and help me fly (I didn't think I was doing that bad a job and you would think by 300' he wouldn't have had time to form an opinion!). I threatened him with the extinguisher whilst busily winding in nose up trim, did a right downwind for 11, landed and handed him over to the feds at the terminal.( I knew my mob wouldn't do anything to him) You guessed it, no action taken by the so called authorities but I understand he copped a flogging from one of the elders who was seated up the back when he eventually did arrive back in the community.
(2)Had to load one of the locals into the copilot seat and he promptly went to sleep. Looked down to change tanks at top of climb and noticed a hip flask tucked into his shoe! I pulled it out without waking him up and stuck it into the seat back to hand over to the cop at the destination. Very amusing watching him searching for it when we landed
(2)Had to load one of the locals into the copilot seat and he promptly went to sleep. Looked down to change tanks at top of climb and noticed a hip flask tucked into his shoe! I pulled it out without waking him up and stuck it into the seat back to hand over to the cop at the destination. Very amusing watching him searching for it when we landed
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I was just thinking about this the other day I try to forget all about it and haven’t told to many people.
When I was working out west a couple of years ago (my first job SE Charter). This is no lie....... I use to transfer prostitutes from one base to another. I believe the knock shop owner had a few premises in each popular mining towns!! Anyway to cut to the chase it was all VFR flying and I had 4 good-looking women on board when the weather closed in!! I set it down in a nice looking paddock to wait it out, it took about 4 hours to clear. With no mobile reception and no way to contact base the boss naturally started to get worried. So I arrived at my destination only to find every man and his dog is out looking for me. I get out of the plane with no tie and shirt buttons undone this is only because it was extremely hot and humid waiting it out on the ground. You can probably start to form a bit of a mental picture of what everyone was thinking at the time
Well did the boss get a bit irate or what didn’t even want to know what had happened. I ended up cleaning our entire fleet for 2 weeks, sweep the hangar floor, cleaned the toilets and didn’t get to fly for 9 weeks. He wouldn’t even let me taxi any aircraft to the other side of the airfield for matantence.
Now I did try and call base before I set it down on both the HF and VHF but no answer. Yes it was my decision to conduct the flight in the first place but was under pressure to get them there (always the way with charter I know!!). Never did find out whether I was put to work on the ground because was supposedly up to no good in the bush with 4 good looking women or whether it was my poor decision to go in the first place.
I have always had great respect for the weather after this little incident!
When I was working out west a couple of years ago (my first job SE Charter). This is no lie....... I use to transfer prostitutes from one base to another. I believe the knock shop owner had a few premises in each popular mining towns!! Anyway to cut to the chase it was all VFR flying and I had 4 good-looking women on board when the weather closed in!! I set it down in a nice looking paddock to wait it out, it took about 4 hours to clear. With no mobile reception and no way to contact base the boss naturally started to get worried. So I arrived at my destination only to find every man and his dog is out looking for me. I get out of the plane with no tie and shirt buttons undone this is only because it was extremely hot and humid waiting it out on the ground. You can probably start to form a bit of a mental picture of what everyone was thinking at the time
Well did the boss get a bit irate or what didn’t even want to know what had happened. I ended up cleaning our entire fleet for 2 weeks, sweep the hangar floor, cleaned the toilets and didn’t get to fly for 9 weeks. He wouldn’t even let me taxi any aircraft to the other side of the airfield for matantence.
Now I did try and call base before I set it down on both the HF and VHF but no answer. Yes it was my decision to conduct the flight in the first place but was under pressure to get them there (always the way with charter I know!!). Never did find out whether I was put to work on the ground because was supposedly up to no good in the bush with 4 good looking women or whether it was my poor decision to go in the first place.
I have always had great respect for the weather after this little incident!
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He was only jealous!
I bet your boss was only p1ssed off because he wished it was him.
Tell me, after a few years in the industry who do you reckon has been screwed more, you or your pax?
Tell me, after a few years in the industry who do you reckon has been screwed more, you or your pax?
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"ay, pie-let, just one more little boy"
The locals out bush trying to persuade you to load 4 adults and 4 children/infants into a 206.
Or camp Dogs, Turtles, Joeys and Cockatoos accompanying them in the cabin.
The locals out bush trying to persuade you to load 4 adults and 4 children/infants into a 206.
Or camp Dogs, Turtles, Joeys and Cockatoos accompanying them in the cabin.
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Flintstone and flying-spike; Thanks for that! It reinforces my view that I had it far far better flying around in PNG!
Up there at least, only the weather and/or the terrain tried to kill you!
Er.. well, the locals also occasionally did but up there we at least had some protection. Mine came courtesy of Messrs Smith and Wesson!
It reinforces my view that I had it far far better flying around in PNG!Up there at least, only the weather and/or the terrain tried to kill you!
Er.. well, the locals also occasionally did but up there we at least had some protection. Mine came courtesy of Messrs Smith and Wesson!