Forced Landing - Sorrento Vic. (Merged)
THAT'S IT !!!! Since the media like to call every single engine plane a Cessna in the Aviation Industry, ...then I'm going call every Car smash I see on the road as a Holden!!!! That'll stir up the Automotive Industry... didn't know there was Ford, Nissan, Mitsubushi, Toyota, Saab, Jeep, Suzuki, Subura, etc... 
Airbumps - I don't think that there is any issue that the police officer concerned probably knows a hell of a lot more about criminal code etc than a pilot does(as you would hope so!). Difference is that a pilot doesn't get interviewed and quoted infront of a law court or the watch house being quoted in the news paper about legal issues.
I don't expect the copper to know anything about aviation, but at the same time if you don't know what your talking about in an incident a simple 'the ATSB will be investigating, we are unsure of the cause of the accident' is more than enough to keep the media at bay. Though I do give high points for the A grade bullplop they have come up with here!
I must admit the detachable wings is fantastic, man i've flown a PA28 before and was NEVER shown that feature, I guess always be aware of that unmarked button somewhere in the cockpit because you NEVER know what it might do!
I don't expect the copper to know anything about aviation, but at the same time if you don't know what your talking about in an incident a simple 'the ATSB will be investigating, we are unsure of the cause of the accident' is more than enough to keep the media at bay. Though I do give high points for the A grade bullplop they have come up with here!
I must admit the detachable wings is fantastic, man i've flown a PA28 before and was NEVER shown that feature, I guess always be aware of that unmarked button somewhere in the cockpit because you NEVER know what it might do!
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Detachable wings are a "feature" on most light aircraft.
Whether or not most of the rocket scientist pilots out there realise it or not I don't know, but most if not all wings on light aircraft are attached to the fuselage by some moderately sized aircraft AN bolts. Wing structures and attaching bolts / attachments are not designed for the force of hitting a tree, but rather are traingulated and engineered for those forces received during the flight, with margin of course.
Why do they do this? (detach wings at the root) Ease of buiding, parts can be assembled at different locations then shipped for final assembly, shipping of aircraft in containers, folding wings and maintenance etc.
Without knowing who the pilot was I'd suggest he might be a little old-school or Commercial given that he resorted to this measure. Last time I looked this procedure wasn't in the Bini's PPL syllabus.
I don't see what you are on about, it's by design, has happened many times before, will happen again and is probably a very safe option for crashing and when you have no options due to terrain!
Whether or not most of the rocket scientist pilots out there realise it or not I don't know, but most if not all wings on light aircraft are attached to the fuselage by some moderately sized aircraft AN bolts. Wing structures and attaching bolts / attachments are not designed for the force of hitting a tree, but rather are traingulated and engineered for those forces received during the flight, with margin of course.
Why do they do this? (detach wings at the root) Ease of buiding, parts can be assembled at different locations then shipped for final assembly, shipping of aircraft in containers, folding wings and maintenance etc.
Without knowing who the pilot was I'd suggest he might be a little old-school or Commercial given that he resorted to this measure. Last time I looked this procedure wasn't in the Bini's PPL syllabus.
I don't see what you are on about, it's by design, has happened many times before, will happen again and is probably a very safe option for crashing and when you have no options due to terrain!
Detachable wings are a "feature" on most light aircraft.
Without knowing who the pilot was I'd suggest he might be a little old-school or Commercial given that he resorted to this measure. Last time I looked this procedure wasn't in the Bini's PPL syllabus.
I don't see what you are on about, it's by design, has happened many times before, will happen again and is probably a very safe option for crashing and when you have no options due to terrain!
Without knowing who the pilot was I'd suggest he might be a little old-school or Commercial given that he resorted to this measure. Last time I looked this procedure wasn't in the Bini's PPL syllabus.
I don't see what you are on about, it's by design, has happened many times before, will happen again and is probably a very safe option for crashing and when you have no options due to terrain!
If there IS a 'detach wings' lever in PA28's, I'd certainly like to know where it is.
I have a few hours in JDI myself - very sad.
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Clearing Up
Righto I've just created an account so I can just clear up any errors...
Firsty I used to fly VH-JDI, otherwise known as the plane that crashed today, I can tell everyone that there is no such thing as "detachable wings", there is no button/lever/switch/pin/etc to disconnect the wings from the aircraft.
Under my understanding, (I trained in JDI fairly recently, with Peter Bini Adv Flight Training until their takeover), the pilot executed a textbook emergency landing, he even managed to call a mayday, which was tracked.
The main thing is that he managed to get all occupants out with out substantially harming them and himself.
Under my knowledge it is best to use the wings to slow the aircraft down once the craft has entered known terrain, using the fuselage is effective only if you are intending to harm yourself...i.e. use the wings to slow the plane.
Unfortunately the pilot did not quite make it too the golf course, perhaps he did hit the power lines, I'm not sure but I know power lines are incredibly hard to see against the ground due to lack of contrast. So if he did hit power lines that would probably explain why the wings are 20m behind.
It's an unfortunate loss-I loved flying that little plane, sure it was old (it was made in '74, I think, but it had comfy seats and the old style dash [I fly the newer C172S glass cockpit now])...
Cheers,
Jeremy
Firsty I used to fly VH-JDI, otherwise known as the plane that crashed today, I can tell everyone that there is no such thing as "detachable wings", there is no button/lever/switch/pin/etc to disconnect the wings from the aircraft.
Under my understanding, (I trained in JDI fairly recently, with Peter Bini Adv Flight Training until their takeover), the pilot executed a textbook emergency landing, he even managed to call a mayday, which was tracked.
The main thing is that he managed to get all occupants out with out substantially harming them and himself.
Under my knowledge it is best to use the wings to slow the aircraft down once the craft has entered known terrain, using the fuselage is effective only if you are intending to harm yourself...i.e. use the wings to slow the plane.
Unfortunately the pilot did not quite make it too the golf course, perhaps he did hit the power lines, I'm not sure but I know power lines are incredibly hard to see against the ground due to lack of contrast. So if he did hit power lines that would probably explain why the wings are 20m behind.
It's an unfortunate loss-I loved flying that little plane, sure it was old (it was made in '74, I think, but it had comfy seats and the old style dash [I fly the newer C172S glass cockpit now])...
Cheers,
Jeremy
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Good onya Jeremy
Wish you could have come along sooner. I've just spent the last few hours with my stackhat on, pouring over our Cessna PA28 pilot's operating handbook and the aircraft itself looking for the wing release button/handle/switch/pin/lever to no avail.
Now I can finally put head to pillow and sleep in peace knowing the world is safe again.
At least until tomorrow............
Wish you could have come along sooner. I've just spent the last few hours with my stackhat on, pouring over our Cessna PA28 pilot's operating handbook and the aircraft itself looking for the wing release button/handle/switch/pin/lever to no avail.
Now I can finally put head to pillow and sleep in peace knowing the world is safe again.
At least until tomorrow............
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S/C Stone may not know much about aeroplanes and I'm sure thats probably because he/she has never had anything to do with the things.
But then if she's employed as a "Pleece Officer" I'd wager she doesn't know much about anything.
Since you know everything though, I'm sure you can tell us all about the Crimes Act Victoria 1958, Road Safety Act 1986, Summary Offences Act and all other manner of legislation that S/C Stone IS familiar with.
Get back in your box and blame the reporter for publishing that crap, not the police. Its not their job to tell the difference between a Cessna and a Piper at first glance, particulary when a reporter is hounding them for information.
And seriously - the "plane" dropped its wings??? Come on man, stop defending this ditzy tart. If that's indicative of the intellect of Victoria's Finest then God Help The Mexicans.
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As I recall, when gliding, if you drop a wing, with enough airspeed, you can pick it up again with the rudder. Otherwise you have to use aileron.
Obviously not a Piper/Cessna feature.
Obviously not a Piper/Cessna feature.
This just in... Journalists are still idiots!!
How's this gem from The Age website:
http://www.theage.com.au/news/nation...135656422.html
"The plane clipped powerlines before the pilot deliberately detached its wings to reduce the chance of the plane catching fire. The wings contained the plane's fuel."
Genius - "wing detachment capabilities"!! (Anyone remember the Gary Larson cartoon with the "Wings stay on/wings fall off" switch?)
I reckon this article couldn't have even been invented by that "sensationalist Aviation media story generator"
http://www.theage.com.au/news/nation...135656422.html
"The plane clipped powerlines before the pilot deliberately detached its wings to reduce the chance of the plane catching fire. The wings contained the plane's fuel."
Genius - "wing detachment capabilities"!! (Anyone remember the Gary Larson cartoon with the "Wings stay on/wings fall off" switch?)
I reckon this article couldn't have even been invented by that "sensationalist Aviation media story generator"
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Lol Gassed Budgie, pull that in flight you'll only realise your mistake when u land....squeak squeak...skidding....thats the parking brake below the throttle quadrant...ha ha I'm sure you know this...or not...:-P
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It gets worse. Think it was the Channel 10 Sydney news that reported it last night as a "Cessna" that was involved when it was clearly one of the bigger Pipers (possibly a Cherokee Six or Lance). Wonder what happened to basic fact checking?
Edit: and whats with the headline to the article? What was aerobatic about it? Did the pilot perform a derry turn or half cuban during descent? Journalistic integrity? bah..........
Edit: and whats with the headline to the article? What was aerobatic about it? Did the pilot perform a derry turn or half cuban during descent? Journalistic integrity? bah..........
Last edited by The PM; 14th Dec 2007 at 00:57.
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Am I the only one tempted to
with a story about "uncommanded wing jettison" being a secret plague thats overtaking the GA industry? How operators are fully aware of it, and are training their pilots in "heroic acrobatic manoeuvres" should said uncommanded-wing-jettison take place? How a memo has been sent out to all the local convents/schools/child care centres warning their respective managers to watch out for falling jettisoned-wings and other associated debris?
Stupid bloody woman
When you see news happening: SMS/MMS: 0406 THE AGE (0406 843 243), or email us.
Stupid bloody woman
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Ah PM, i think you just fell into the same hole as the journos. ''Clearly one of the big Pipers'' It was a Warrior, 30sec of 'basic fact checking' would have told you that.
Fair enough the Journo's a muppet, but it just shows you how easy it is to make that sort of mistake.
Fair enough the Journo's a muppet, but it just shows you how easy it is to make that sort of mistake.
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Have just read the said article,
What most of these pilots don’t x-referenece to their basic training principals, are that during an emergency landing in a single engine aircraft (whether it be Cessna or Piper), if you fly through a pair of trees and the wings are broken off, the aircraft will slow down; potential and kinetic energy and all that good stuff.
However, in reality the bastard is lucky if he\she can even steer the thing where they want it to in the first place.
But, thinking about a fuel “hazard” (and detaching the wings because of it, hey) would be the last thing on a pilots mind in this situation. (Called tunnel vision) Great thought and accolades to all the CRM of it; if true we have another “General Chuck Yeager” in our making
At this point in time it would be totally on “self preservation” as with any human being faced with a “do or die” situation. What would you do in car accident if death stared you in the face, hey, try and survive!!!!
Apologies for being so rhetoric, but in this case, both the pprune pilots and the journalist need a fact update.
What most of these pilots don’t x-referenece to their basic training principals, are that during an emergency landing in a single engine aircraft (whether it be Cessna or Piper), if you fly through a pair of trees and the wings are broken off, the aircraft will slow down; potential and kinetic energy and all that good stuff.
However, in reality the bastard is lucky if he\she can even steer the thing where they want it to in the first place.
But, thinking about a fuel “hazard” (and detaching the wings because of it, hey) would be the last thing on a pilots mind in this situation. (Called tunnel vision) Great thought and accolades to all the CRM of it; if true we have another “General Chuck Yeager” in our making
At this point in time it would be totally on “self preservation” as with any human being faced with a “do or die” situation. What would you do in car accident if death stared you in the face, hey, try and survive!!!!
Apologies for being so rhetoric, but in this case, both the pprune pilots and the journalist need a fact update.