Climbing the greasy pole
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: australia
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A couple of things;
Firstly..I'm writing something...SO GET THE DAMNED BANNER OFF MY SCREEN!
Secondly... RUNURPP - Well said. GA isn't just busted ars pistons, it is also (busted ass) turbines and at times some very nice gear.
If you are in this to fly the shiny big......already said, I know but some just don't/won't get it.
Employers are not stupid, (well generally speaking
) they can see your attitude a mile off. They know the industry and the expectations of a percentage to get in do it and leave for better things ASAP. Most generally accept this with some rules, give them enough time to make it worth their while to employ you in the first place, (don't do this and you name will circulate), do the best you can and in a professional way, it stands out like dogs dingles when you don't. Enjoy as much as you can as this will confirm to your employer and EVERYBODY else that you are in it for the long run and you will be remembered,(in the right way this time).
GA can be a stepping stone and it can be a viable career. Your choices and your actions are the main driver.
I could say plenty more but the naysayers can only take small amounts in at a time.
(spelling....I just don't care anymore )
Firstly..I'm writing something...SO GET THE DAMNED BANNER OFF MY SCREEN!
Secondly... RUNURPP - Well said. GA isn't just busted ars pistons, it is also (busted ass) turbines and at times some very nice gear.
If you are in this to fly the shiny big......already said, I know but some just don't/won't get it.
Employers are not stupid, (well generally speaking
) they can see your attitude a mile off. They know the industry and the expectations of a percentage to get in do it and leave for better things ASAP. Most generally accept this with some rules, give them enough time to make it worth their while to employ you in the first place, (don't do this and you name will circulate), do the best you can and in a professional way, it stands out like dogs dingles when you don't. Enjoy as much as you can as this will confirm to your employer and EVERYBODY else that you are in it for the long run and you will be remembered,(in the right way this time).GA can be a stepping stone and it can be a viable career. Your choices and your actions are the main driver.
I could say plenty more but the naysayers can only take small amounts in at a time.
(spelling....I just don't care anymore
)
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Australia
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A common attitude of guys in a hurry.
I have been there and now flying a jet with a Big White Roo on the tail (although I am not a QF pilot) and can I tell you its not that good.
The best time you will ever have in aviation is NOW. So enjoy it.
You know what, employers and colleagues get sick to death of hearing guys like you wanting to be there yesterday.
You are still a baby with bugger all experience, whats the rush?
Most of all enjoy the best part of your life.
Remember when you first started and you couldn't wait to get into a 210. They were the good old days.
I have been there and now flying a jet with a Big White Roo on the tail (although I am not a QF pilot) and can I tell you its not that good.
The best time you will ever have in aviation is NOW. So enjoy it.
You know what, employers and colleagues get sick to death of hearing guys like you wanting to be there yesterday.
You are still a baby with bugger all experience, whats the rush?
Most of all enjoy the best part of your life.
Remember when you first started and you couldn't wait to get into a 210. They were the good old days.
Best flying I've ever done has been in a multicrew environment, working in a 'team'. To suggest 'The best time you will ever have in aviation is NOW' is highly subjective. The flying up north was fun, personally I find the flying now challenging and enjoyable in a different way.
Hindsight is a very high pedestal.
Silly Old Git
Second, Massling did not have Bandits in 1975 they were flying clapped out old Queen Airs. and they were old
Renurp old mate I dont think ANYONE cudda handled the stress of THAT job fer twenty five years .
The reason all the hills around the NSW highlands arent littered with wrecks was probably because the driver experience level was damn high them days, just wasnt anywhere for a pilot to go unless they got the gold plated invite for a sinecure in AN or TaTaas
The kids love playin with them FMC things mate makes em feel important just like playstation and yer wear a uniform cant blame em for that.... I once watched a young FO demonstrate entering data with his left hand and driving with the other while looking out the window.... bloody good eh?
Just watch the little buggers tho they go ta bed at night with a copy of the seniority list under their pillow
Last edited by tinpis; 29th Nov 2006 at 02:30.
Interesting posts. Yet how come all we hear in the aviation media is that there is a terrible shortage of commercial pilots in Australia? From reading these posts it doesn't seem that way...
Join Date: Apr 2002
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Shortage??
For the last 35 years there has been talk of a huge recruiting program NEXT YEAR. Never this year.
When the flying schools want more activity they talk to the media about this so-called "shortage of pilots". It hasn't happened yet.
What has happened is that the flying schools have trained lots and lots and lots of young hopefuls, and a flood of beginners has come out to the outback areas, where the real flying takes place. I feel sorry for these young pilots, who are desperate, with a big debt to pay off and no job. Most work in bars, supermarkets, motels etc, until they get their first flying job-too often at very low pay. I know one bloke who travelled right across the country, and spent about nine months looking for that flying job, and is now back in the city without one. He is not the only one. Others had spent big bucks to get jet time, and were still looking for piston jobs. They had to know. "what if" Now they do.
The really sad part is that there are hardly any experienced bush pilots anymore, as they have not been able to make a decent living. The newbies work for half price, as they think they will be moving on to the airlines soon..
There is a shortage of experienced bush pilots. Plenty of apprentices.
And the cheap labour has attracted some predatory operators, with some less than admirable practices.
Nearly all the piston engine pilots in Alice Springs are on casual, or part time wages. Are some paying for ICUS????
Someone said aviation is a disease, and there is no cure. Some are exploiting that. Some operators are selling ICUS time on charter flights. Some airlines are doing the same with Boeings.
There may be a future in instructing (if you are multi lingual?), once you get to grade 2 or better. There appears to be a surplus of "apprentices" there too, and a shortage of good senior people.
Such is Australian general aviation. There is some hope, if the multi crew pilot's licence comes, and the airline wannabies from the Nintendo generation spend their money and go straight to airlines instead of going to GA where they do not want to be.
Then they can talk about the "clapped out 50,00 hour Boeing, with blocked up toilets, and 15 unserviceable items."
When the flying schools want more activity they talk to the media about this so-called "shortage of pilots". It hasn't happened yet.
What has happened is that the flying schools have trained lots and lots and lots of young hopefuls, and a flood of beginners has come out to the outback areas, where the real flying takes place. I feel sorry for these young pilots, who are desperate, with a big debt to pay off and no job. Most work in bars, supermarkets, motels etc, until they get their first flying job-too often at very low pay. I know one bloke who travelled right across the country, and spent about nine months looking for that flying job, and is now back in the city without one. He is not the only one. Others had spent big bucks to get jet time, and were still looking for piston jobs. They had to know. "what if" Now they do.
The really sad part is that there are hardly any experienced bush pilots anymore, as they have not been able to make a decent living. The newbies work for half price, as they think they will be moving on to the airlines soon..
There is a shortage of experienced bush pilots. Plenty of apprentices.
And the cheap labour has attracted some predatory operators, with some less than admirable practices.
Nearly all the piston engine pilots in Alice Springs are on casual, or part time wages. Are some paying for ICUS????
Someone said aviation is a disease, and there is no cure. Some are exploiting that. Some operators are selling ICUS time on charter flights. Some airlines are doing the same with Boeings.
There may be a future in instructing (if you are multi lingual?), once you get to grade 2 or better. There appears to be a surplus of "apprentices" there too, and a shortage of good senior people.
Such is Australian general aviation. There is some hope, if the multi crew pilot's licence comes, and the airline wannabies from the Nintendo generation spend their money and go straight to airlines instead of going to GA where they do not want to be.
Then they can talk about the "clapped out 50,00 hour Boeing, with blocked up toilets, and 15 unserviceable items."
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I once watched a young FO demonstrate entering data with his left hand and driving with the other while looking out the window.... bloody good eh?
I like to program the FMC with my left hand, hands fly with my right, make a PA to the pax, while slurping coffee through a straw between breaths, meanwhile I do my best James Bond "cocked eye" impression directed at the Captain as a warning should he move his hands towards the controls, I also have service interphone selected incase I catch Brenda at 3L making a call to the Purser asking about me.
I try to avoid listening out on COM2 as I find this a distraction....
Grandpa Aerotart
There never has been a pilot shortage in Australia...and I don't think we will see one any time soon.
You'll know there is a pilot shortage in Australia when QF, J* and VB start recruiting 250 hr pilots because they have no choice...as happens in many other parts of the world...where there actually is a pilot shortage.
I ponder the long term effects of the MPL.
As to the starter of the thread...relax you're way ahead of the curve.
You'll know there is a pilot shortage in Australia when QF, J* and VB start recruiting 250 hr pilots because they have no choice...as happens in many other parts of the world...where there actually is a pilot shortage.
I ponder the long term effects of the MPL.
As to the starter of the thread...relax you're way ahead of the curve.
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Join Date: Jun 2004
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INXS, the flight was changed onto a 757 at the last moment, due to a tech issue, and the fact there were only 210 pax...piccys in the more piccys thread
Silly Old Git
...all from a guy from small town NZ.
The Finn brothers all come from Bumfuk Waikato and I'll bet most of yer 290 pax have a recording of theirs.
And I'll bet they never heard a you.
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Tinny....are you discriminating against me cos I cant sing????????? (gonna call the league for non singers discrimination
)
Or are you saying that I should have been born in Te Awamutu? (My dad used to buy heifers off old man Finn..back when Tim wanted to be a milk tanker driver )
)Or are you saying that I should have been born in Te Awamutu? (My dad used to buy heifers off old man Finn..back when Tim wanted to be a milk tanker driver
)
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Yea sure when you're flying jets you soon realize it aint actually glamourous at all, but puhleeeeze! GA is 5900000000000 times worse. If you want a real job badly enough then you do whatever you have to do to get those 1500 hours & get that real job, and like it or love it GA will always be the only game in town for the vast majority of us who only wanted to get to the airlines and aren't well connected or loaded enough to get there straight out of flying school. Don't be bringing on all that guilt-trip about how the boys have all got bad attitudes for not enjoying every minute of their obligatory GA shafting.
I'm sorry but any of you old timers who go all misty eyed about how the best times of a pilot's life are really to be found in the sub-minimum-wage, employee-shafting, undercutting, rule-bending, MEL-ignoring, FTL-what-the-hell-is-that, arse-kissing, backstabbing, gossiping, greasy-pole climbing, big steaming pile that just about universally comprises 21st century GA in Australasia, you all really really need your bleedin heads examined.
I'm sorry but any of you old timers who go all misty eyed about how the best times of a pilot's life are really to be found in the sub-minimum-wage, employee-shafting, undercutting, rule-bending, MEL-ignoring, FTL-what-the-hell-is-that, arse-kissing, backstabbing, gossiping, greasy-pole climbing, big steaming pile that just about universally comprises 21st century GA in Australasia, you all really really need your bleedin heads examined.
Silly Old Git
No... and I certainly wont get misty eyed over the sub-minimum-wage, employee-shafting, undercutting, , MEL-ignoring, FTL-what-the-hell-is-that, arse-kissing, backstabbing, gossiping, greasy-pole climbing, big steaming pile that just about universally comprises 21st century Airlines in Australasia, either.
And....elsewhere
And....elsewhere
Last edited by tinpis; 2nd Dec 2006 at 00:56.
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Attitude???
It is pilots with this sort of attitude who have made GA what it is now. Some of the poorer quality, usually city based operators and flying schools have also adapted this short term, get rich quick, exploititive outlook as well, and they are exploiting one another.
The only winners are the flying schools, that train lots of pilots that no-one needs.
People of the outback who fly in GA aeroplanes deserve better.
The sooner the multicrew pilot's licence comes along, the better.
Does that negative, irresponsible attitude automatically change ,if you get an airline job??? It appears not.
The only winners are the flying schools, that train lots of pilots that no-one needs.
People of the outback who fly in GA aeroplanes deserve better.
The sooner the multicrew pilot's licence comes along, the better.
Does that negative, irresponsible attitude automatically change ,if you get an airline job??? It appears not.
So Bushy if hypothetically everyone in GA wanted to be there and all the ones with the bad attitude are in airlines will:
GA Operaters change their attitude?
Start paying proper money for living in remote areas? (ie $80 000+)
Start getting decent aircraft?
Start doing their maintenance PROPERLY and fixing things when they break? (well really since all the pilots are proffessional bush operaters they won't let him get away with shonky aircraft and ensure that the MEL is followed. Then the boss will be up in arms about "being held to randsome by the pilots)
Do proper line training and skill development
Whilst pilot's have contributed to GA's woes, even if this changed I don't think that will change much as operaters aren't about to change anything just because everyone wants to live in the bush.
GA Operaters change their attitude?
Start paying proper money for living in remote areas? (ie $80 000+)
Start getting decent aircraft?
Start doing their maintenance PROPERLY and fixing things when they break? (well really since all the pilots are proffessional bush operaters they won't let him get away with shonky aircraft and ensure that the MEL is followed. Then the boss will be up in arms about "being held to randsome by the pilots)
Do proper line training and skill development
Whilst pilot's have contributed to GA's woes, even if this changed I don't think that will change much as operaters aren't about to change anything just because everyone wants to live in the bush.
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semantics...don't you just love it..........NOT
GA/RPT/Airlines..All have bad apples!
Get over it.
GA is not the be all to end all
Airlines is not the be all to end all.
Enjoy your job or move the hell out
GA/RPT/Airlines..All have bad apples!
Get over it.
GA is not the be all to end all
Airlines is not the be all to end all.
Enjoy your job or move the hell out
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Ahead of the curve
Chimbu Chuckles mentioned the term "ahead of the curve".
I realise that back in the day, most people did thousands of hours in GA before moving on to airlines, be they regional or major. However, in the present climate, that progression is happening a lot quicker, obviously.
So, in light of that, does it create a problem of being too far ahead of the curve?
I've heard things about "upper limits" with regard to experience of sucessful airline applicants which worry me a little, since I do not yet meet airline direct entry minima with regard to qualifications other than flying experience. While the upper limits remain an unofficial fact, for those that actually aspire to an airline type job, could it pose an obstacle? Anyone out there scored an airline job recently with a multitude of logbooks at the interview?
Whaddya reckon?
520.
I realise that back in the day, most people did thousands of hours in GA before moving on to airlines, be they regional or major. However, in the present climate, that progression is happening a lot quicker, obviously.
So, in light of that, does it create a problem of being too far ahead of the curve?
I've heard things about "upper limits" with regard to experience of sucessful airline applicants which worry me a little, since I do not yet meet airline direct entry minima with regard to qualifications other than flying experience. While the upper limits remain an unofficial fact, for those that actually aspire to an airline type job, could it pose an obstacle? Anyone out there scored an airline job recently with a multitude of logbooks at the interview?
Whaddya reckon?
520.