Jetstar Int. Package.
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I'm not having a go at you guys in Jet*, your welcome to it but just remember if you accept this package then you really are undervaluing yourselves. Even with an extra 5-6% on top of what is on offer, you would still be cheap for any airline flying that type of aircraft.
I can't agree with Chimbu with regards contract pilots from Rishworth and Parks etc. There are heaps of contract jobs out there and a lot of them pay very well indeed, the Japs make most QF captains wages look cheap! So I don't see that Jet* International being crewed by contract pilots, perhaps a few but not enough to run the airline.
And BTW, can you blame some of the QF guys for being upset (and yes I am with QF). It is just like when most of us were in GA and some company started up paying less than yours, you knew that things were going to get harder.
The Professor may have his opinions but to me he just sounds like some management stooge.
I can't agree with Chimbu with regards contract pilots from Rishworth and Parks etc. There are heaps of contract jobs out there and a lot of them pay very well indeed, the Japs make most QF captains wages look cheap! So I don't see that Jet* International being crewed by contract pilots, perhaps a few but not enough to run the airline.
And BTW, can you blame some of the QF guys for being upset (and yes I am with QF). It is just like when most of us were in GA and some company started up paying less than yours, you knew that things were going to get harder.
The Professor may have his opinions but to me he just sounds like some management stooge.
Last edited by RaTa; 12th Feb 2006 at 04:36.
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Some of you just don't get it: IT'S NOT ABOUT J* DRIVERS SCREWING MAINLINE DRIVERS!
Earlier in this thread, Mr. McGoo made reference to so-&-so screwing so-&-so, although his immediate next post did point the finger more towards the "negotiators," as opposed to the guys in the trenches.
As far as "screwing it for the mainline guys" is concerned, I would imagine that's the last thing on a pilot's mind when he accepts a job with J*, especially if he has just come from G.A. More likely, he's thinking: "I'm just grateful to have a job that allows me to fly decent equipment and actually get paid enough to do more than just live from hand to mouth."
I have no malice toward anyone in either J*, QF mainline, or any other airline for that matter. I am just someone who loves to fly, and have had the opportunity to make it a living for a number of years. I recognise that my brethren are in the same boat, whoever they fly for. Of course, we all want to secure the best salary and working conditions possible, but if airline 'A' offered me a position for less salary than airline 'B' (and an offer from airline 'B' isn't forthcoming at the time), I am not going to say "thanks, but you can get stuffed while I wait for someone better to offer me a job!" Seriously! Anyone with an ounce of common sense realises that you take what you can get - at the time. If you're not happy with your circumstances, you bide your time until something better does come along. That some people out there should suggest I refuse a job on principle, just to make them feel better about themselves - even though it's to my own personal detriment to refuse - is just ludicrous.
I won't discount the possibility that maybe there is a small element within the ranks that do have an agenda against Mainline drivers, but I certainly don't believe they're in the majority - and anyone who does think that every J* driver out there is trying to "screw it" for Mainline or the industry in general, is either delusional or paranoid.
As far as "screwing it for the mainline guys" is concerned, I would imagine that's the last thing on a pilot's mind when he accepts a job with J*, especially if he has just come from G.A. More likely, he's thinking: "I'm just grateful to have a job that allows me to fly decent equipment and actually get paid enough to do more than just live from hand to mouth."
I have no malice toward anyone in either J*, QF mainline, or any other airline for that matter. I am just someone who loves to fly, and have had the opportunity to make it a living for a number of years. I recognise that my brethren are in the same boat, whoever they fly for. Of course, we all want to secure the best salary and working conditions possible, but if airline 'A' offered me a position for less salary than airline 'B' (and an offer from airline 'B' isn't forthcoming at the time), I am not going to say "thanks, but you can get stuffed while I wait for someone better to offer me a job!" Seriously! Anyone with an ounce of common sense realises that you take what you can get - at the time. If you're not happy with your circumstances, you bide your time until something better does come along. That some people out there should suggest I refuse a job on principle, just to make them feel better about themselves - even though it's to my own personal detriment to refuse - is just ludicrous.
I won't discount the possibility that maybe there is a small element within the ranks that do have an agenda against Mainline drivers, but I certainly don't believe they're in the majority - and anyone who does think that every J* driver out there is trying to "screw it" for Mainline or the industry in general, is either delusional or paranoid.
Last edited by The Bunglerat; 12th Feb 2006 at 04:47.
Nunc est bibendum
Being paid to sit in hotels? C'mon Chimbu, get a grip. The only time the 5.5 hours a day kicks in on the long haul flying is when the COMPANY decides to have us sitting around doing nothing. ALL OF US want to be at home instead of away on a trip. I'd prefer to have efficient flying and get 8 hours for every day that I'm away from home and do 1000 hours per annum but the REALITY is is that QF can not schedule us to that because of flight time limitations.
The J* crew will be held to the same FTL and so will sit around in the hotels for the identical amount of time that the mainline crew did. If they operate under the dispensation then THAT is a safety issue. I flew with a bunch of the former AN crew now in QF and ALL OF THEM that I've spoken to have said that the dispensation for international ops was dangerous. ALL OF THEM that I've spoken to have talked about multiple times when both crew were asleep at the controls. In reality when it comes to the international schedules, it just means that they've saved themselves a second officer on the flight. Nice way to save money and increase the 'risk' exponentially. One wonders whether those kinds of rosters could also be seen as broaching OH&S legislation but that hasn't been tested in court yet.
Next, it's pretty hard to clock up more than 800 hours per annum if the company is choosing to sit you on your backside for three days because they only fly into the joint three times a week. If they ARE choosing to do that, I'm sure the J* crew will love getting paid 17 hours pay for a five day trip only to get two days (or less) off at home and then bounce back out again. Not sure how they'll clock up the 1000 hours at that rate!
I've got no doubt that the J* guys won't even think about the mainline guys when they vote on this deal but I DO hope that they think about their very own futures. This isn't about 'screwing it for mainline', this is about being short sighted and screwing it for themselves and everyone else who follows- just as 58% of the QF LH pilot group who voted did with our recent EBA. Whilst the pay rises that come with rapid promotion may be great in the short term, they won't hold up in the longer term- especially with lack of time at home that will occur with long haul lack of frequency.
So I DO reckon the deal is under cooked. I'm sure that the J* pilots could and should be able to do better than that. The 'threat' from the company to get someone else to fly it is nothing new and we've seen it before many times. No one ever bothers to stand up to it though.
So if they vote it up, they're welcome to it and I hope they enjoy the flying. I'm sure that they are all very capable pilots but don't believe for a second that the offer is a 'good' one.
The J* crew will be held to the same FTL and so will sit around in the hotels for the identical amount of time that the mainline crew did. If they operate under the dispensation then THAT is a safety issue. I flew with a bunch of the former AN crew now in QF and ALL OF THEM that I've spoken to have said that the dispensation for international ops was dangerous. ALL OF THEM that I've spoken to have talked about multiple times when both crew were asleep at the controls. In reality when it comes to the international schedules, it just means that they've saved themselves a second officer on the flight. Nice way to save money and increase the 'risk' exponentially. One wonders whether those kinds of rosters could also be seen as broaching OH&S legislation but that hasn't been tested in court yet.
Next, it's pretty hard to clock up more than 800 hours per annum if the company is choosing to sit you on your backside for three days because they only fly into the joint three times a week. If they ARE choosing to do that, I'm sure the J* crew will love getting paid 17 hours pay for a five day trip only to get two days (or less) off at home and then bounce back out again. Not sure how they'll clock up the 1000 hours at that rate!
I've got no doubt that the J* guys won't even think about the mainline guys when they vote on this deal but I DO hope that they think about their very own futures. This isn't about 'screwing it for mainline', this is about being short sighted and screwing it for themselves and everyone else who follows- just as 58% of the QF LH pilot group who voted did with our recent EBA. Whilst the pay rises that come with rapid promotion may be great in the short term, they won't hold up in the longer term- especially with lack of time at home that will occur with long haul lack of frequency.
So I DO reckon the deal is under cooked. I'm sure that the J* pilots could and should be able to do better than that. The 'threat' from the company to get someone else to fly it is nothing new and we've seen it before many times. No one ever bothers to stand up to it though.
So if they vote it up, they're welcome to it and I hope they enjoy the flying. I'm sure that they are all very capable pilots but don't believe for a second that the offer is a 'good' one.
Nunc est bibendum
Originally Posted by The Bunglerat
That some people out there should suggest I refuse a job on principle, just to make them feel better about themselves - even though it's to my own personal detriment to refuse - is just ludicrous.
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Chimbu,
Do you honestly think a J* Int pilot will be flying 900hrs per year? It would be more like 750hrs/yr at most = $134,000.
Domestic flying you can do lots more hours and hence earn more money. I think this deal will result in J* Int guys earning LESS than domestic J*.
I don't know many QF pilots who like to sit around in hotels. It is the Qantas route structure that forces this on them and J* will likely be the same.
Even with a stick hour rate, there should be protections so that a once per week service to where ever doesn't punish the guys for sitting in a hotel. When the A330 operated under the domestic pay and rostering, there was a min daily avg credit that ensured crap hour trips averaged out.
Oh and get your facts right. There is no overtime for QF at 55hrs. It is the min guarantee, above which the $ rate is exactly the same. It is in the company's benefit as hours above can be taken at no cost to the company. It is the worker who loses the money.
The hourly rate is also less than mainline and for stick not credit - yeah really good deal.
Prof,
There are a lot of factors that should be taken into account when determining a pay rate.
Time away from home. Most industries pay a premium to workers who spend a significant amount of time away from home. If you have to leave your family for up to 10 days at a time, I think you deserve a little extra.
Working hours. J* Int will be doing a lot of back of the clock flying. It is punishing on the body and definately affects your general health. Worth a premuim I think.
Hotels, allowances etc. Spend 1/3 of your nights away? Worth a descent hotel I think and a meal allowance to get you more than Maccas. Allowances should be determined for each port.
So for me, an acceptable cost rate is what the company have aimed for - 40% less than mainline. Take out the inefficiences and overheads of mainline and you could easily achieve a 40% cost reduction with something less than about 20% cut in wages. It is the whole cost that should be the question not just the end pay rate to the pilot.
I don't really care who gets to fly J* Int, except that it will be the future rate for all 787's - QF and J*, now that is an issue for mainline guys.
I think the JPC are completely naive with the negotiating (they have provrd it twice now). They really needed some professional help to get the best deal. Unfortunatley, they were so fearful and protective of their own self interest, that they declined any assistance. A couple of pilots is no match to the resources of the company when negotiating a deal. They got scared and were pressured into a very mediocre deal.
I plead with every J* pilot to think very carefully about this deal. To vote NO would simply send the guys back to negotiate a better deal (hopefully with some good professional help). J* WILL get the flying, there is no doubt, but you can extract a better deal.
Do you honestly think a J* Int pilot will be flying 900hrs per year? It would be more like 750hrs/yr at most = $134,000.
Domestic flying you can do lots more hours and hence earn more money. I think this deal will result in J* Int guys earning LESS than domestic J*.
I don't know many QF pilots who like to sit around in hotels. It is the Qantas route structure that forces this on them and J* will likely be the same.
Even with a stick hour rate, there should be protections so that a once per week service to where ever doesn't punish the guys for sitting in a hotel. When the A330 operated under the domestic pay and rostering, there was a min daily avg credit that ensured crap hour trips averaged out.
Oh and get your facts right. There is no overtime for QF at 55hrs. It is the min guarantee, above which the $ rate is exactly the same. It is in the company's benefit as hours above can be taken at no cost to the company. It is the worker who loses the money.
The hourly rate is also less than mainline and for stick not credit - yeah really good deal.
Prof,
There are a lot of factors that should be taken into account when determining a pay rate.
Time away from home. Most industries pay a premium to workers who spend a significant amount of time away from home. If you have to leave your family for up to 10 days at a time, I think you deserve a little extra.
Working hours. J* Int will be doing a lot of back of the clock flying. It is punishing on the body and definately affects your general health. Worth a premuim I think.
Hotels, allowances etc. Spend 1/3 of your nights away? Worth a descent hotel I think and a meal allowance to get you more than Maccas. Allowances should be determined for each port.
So for me, an acceptable cost rate is what the company have aimed for - 40% less than mainline. Take out the inefficiences and overheads of mainline and you could easily achieve a 40% cost reduction with something less than about 20% cut in wages. It is the whole cost that should be the question not just the end pay rate to the pilot.
I don't really care who gets to fly J* Int, except that it will be the future rate for all 787's - QF and J*, now that is an issue for mainline guys.
I think the JPC are completely naive with the negotiating (they have provrd it twice now). They really needed some professional help to get the best deal. Unfortunatley, they were so fearful and protective of their own self interest, that they declined any assistance. A couple of pilots is no match to the resources of the company when negotiating a deal. They got scared and were pressured into a very mediocre deal.
I plead with every J* pilot to think very carefully about this deal. To vote NO would simply send the guys back to negotiate a better deal (hopefully with some good professional help). J* WILL get the flying, there is no doubt, but you can extract a better deal.
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Wow where do I sign up.
As Captains in Emirates we get paid AUD $ 120,000 per annum for 850Hrs stick time, MFF A330/A340, primarily night ops and 8days off a month at home. Days off can be forced down route and no fancy smancy min credit rules.
But on the upside we do live in 45'C and have a real big sandpit to play in.
As Captains in Emirates we get paid AUD $ 120,000 per annum for 850Hrs stick time, MFF A330/A340, primarily night ops and 8days off a month at home. Days off can be forced down route and no fancy smancy min credit rules.
But on the upside we do live in 45'C and have a real big sandpit to play in.
Bird
That is pretty bad. But a distortion when comparing to J* or any other Oz package. You clear 10K a month; the equivalent of about 180K a year when Australian taxation a factor. Not including bonuses, rent, schooling etc.
You really deserve more to have you & family subjected to Arabian culture!
That is pretty bad. But a distortion when comparing to J* or any other Oz package. You clear 10K a month; the equivalent of about 180K a year when Australian taxation a factor. Not including bonuses, rent, schooling etc.
You really deserve more to have you & family subjected to Arabian culture!
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Heavens to murgatroid!
Why is this thread in D & G General Aviation? The place for students, instructors and charter guys.
This forum is for everything apart from rumours and news. It was (perhaps incorrectly) named GA and questions. It is an amalgamation of questions, contacts (where are they now), and GA stuff. It's because the thread originator asked a QUESTION that it was moved here. No conspiracy, no secret agenda.........
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If I am reading EXPANDING's initial post correctly Jetstar pilots will be agreeing to fly ANY widebody aircraft for the same pay rate.
WIDEBODY A330, A380, B767, 777, 787 747.
What a joke, what a way to bring down a profession. Have some guts guys, this rot has to stop and unfortunately you guys have to do it. Stop dragging the profession down. Do you really think pilots overseas will fly for these ridiculous wages. What we as a pilot group have to do is stand together. Qantas is making a good profit, aviation is expanding around the world. There is no need to drive wages down to such levels. Dixon is doing it only because there are people out there gullible enough to accept these conditions. Stop thinking in the short term and think of the future.
WIDEBODY A330, A380, B767, 777, 787 747.
What a joke, what a way to bring down a profession. Have some guts guys, this rot has to stop and unfortunately you guys have to do it. Stop dragging the profession down. Do you really think pilots overseas will fly for these ridiculous wages. What we as a pilot group have to do is stand together. Qantas is making a good profit, aviation is expanding around the world. There is no need to drive wages down to such levels. Dixon is doing it only because there are people out there gullible enough to accept these conditions. Stop thinking in the short term and think of the future.
Grandpa Aerotart
Which is analygous to 'stop thinking about yourselves and start thinking about us'......never going to happen, human nature just doesn't work that way.
Anyone who thinks pilots won't come back to fly for a greenfields alternative J* is just fooling themselves.
At the rates offered in this package, including overtime etc, EK pilots would be lining up.
1/. Already type rated and experienced on type so no expense there,
2/. Near as damn it the same net pay,
3/. Not work any harder, probably fly less,
4/. Days off at 'home', rather than the sandpit,
5/. Lower cost of living. Yes EK pilots get rent and elec payed for....that would not be enough to even slow many of them down. More than compensated by 'living in Oz'....widely considered to be worth 50K alone....although not by me.
6/. Much better schools.
7/. Wives can work if need be.
8/. Working in a place with labour laws.
9/. Working in a place with a functioning aviation authority...have you guys heard about the FTL abuses at EK?
10/. Working where income taxes are actually, albeit slowly, reducing as opposed to being seriously talked about in the UAE. Defered income like Super likely to be tax free soon and as a result the ability to pay heavily into super without severely impacting mthly net income. Don't kid yourselves that the UAE is tax free nirvana...they hit you in a variety of non direct ways.
11/. Better weather...anyone who hasn't experienced DXB summer cannot begin to comprehend 45 degree C, 97% humidity and vis reduced to several Ks in dust....and that's about 40% of the year....even at 2am it is 38C on the ground and 44+ at 1000'..amazing inversions.
12/. Many if not most already own homes, some more than 1 in Oz and have defered, accumulated tax losses that mean they will pay very little tax in the first year or two anyway.
I don't work for EK and hopefully NEVER will but I spend a LOT of time in DXB and have LOTS of mates working there....many are salivating at the prospect of returning to live in Oz flying widebodies at similar pay/increased perceived lifestyle....Airbus pilots where I do work are sniffing around as well....and here is VASTLY better than EK in all areas....in my opinion at least, and most of the guys I work with.
I actually prefer being an expat....but a significant % of my mates do not...and they all have LOTS of experience flying international long haul.
The JPG knows all this....the more mature members of the pilot body know all this...they have often worked overseas before....the young tyros are getting a case of the humps and making emotive statements along the lines of "might as well go overseas if that is all they are offering".
Be aware...if you do QF will be knocked down in the rush...they wil be embarrassed for choice.
Thems the hard facts.
Anyone who thinks pilots won't come back to fly for a greenfields alternative J* is just fooling themselves.
At the rates offered in this package, including overtime etc, EK pilots would be lining up.
1/. Already type rated and experienced on type so no expense there,
2/. Near as damn it the same net pay,
3/. Not work any harder, probably fly less,
4/. Days off at 'home', rather than the sandpit,
5/. Lower cost of living. Yes EK pilots get rent and elec payed for....that would not be enough to even slow many of them down. More than compensated by 'living in Oz'....widely considered to be worth 50K alone....although not by me.
6/. Much better schools.
7/. Wives can work if need be.
8/. Working in a place with labour laws.
9/. Working in a place with a functioning aviation authority...have you guys heard about the FTL abuses at EK?
10/. Working where income taxes are actually, albeit slowly, reducing as opposed to being seriously talked about in the UAE. Defered income like Super likely to be tax free soon and as a result the ability to pay heavily into super without severely impacting mthly net income. Don't kid yourselves that the UAE is tax free nirvana...they hit you in a variety of non direct ways.
11/. Better weather...anyone who hasn't experienced DXB summer cannot begin to comprehend 45 degree C, 97% humidity and vis reduced to several Ks in dust....and that's about 40% of the year....even at 2am it is 38C on the ground and 44+ at 1000'..amazing inversions.
12/. Many if not most already own homes, some more than 1 in Oz and have defered, accumulated tax losses that mean they will pay very little tax in the first year or two anyway.
I don't work for EK and hopefully NEVER will but I spend a LOT of time in DXB and have LOTS of mates working there....many are salivating at the prospect of returning to live in Oz flying widebodies at similar pay/increased perceived lifestyle....Airbus pilots where I do work are sniffing around as well....and here is VASTLY better than EK in all areas....in my opinion at least, and most of the guys I work with.
I actually prefer being an expat....but a significant % of my mates do not...and they all have LOTS of experience flying international long haul.
The JPG knows all this....the more mature members of the pilot body know all this...they have often worked overseas before....the young tyros are getting a case of the humps and making emotive statements along the lines of "might as well go overseas if that is all they are offering".
Be aware...if you do QF will be knocked down in the rush...they wil be embarrassed for choice.
Thems the hard facts.
Last edited by Chimbu chuckles; 12th Feb 2006 at 23:50.
Thread Starter
Chimbu, What would Emirates reaction be then, as you suggest, a truck load of blokes come home at that pay rate? An aussie base perhaps?????
Hmm, does Qantas really want to do that?
Hmm, does Qantas really want to do that?
If the J* package goes through, airlines from Dubai to Shanghai, will all be lining up to recruit and base pilots in Australia. En masse, the cheapest widebody pilots in the world will be Australian.
What's comical is a few years down the track, J* F/O's realise what a garbage deal they are getting and look abroad for miserly better conditions. Like the clowns leaving Virgin Blue to go to Emirates, without doing professional due diligence, mouthing off that they will be LHS of an A380 in no time.
What's comical is a few years down the track, J* F/O's realise what a garbage deal they are getting and look abroad for miserly better conditions. Like the clowns leaving Virgin Blue to go to Emirates, without doing professional due diligence, mouthing off that they will be LHS of an A380 in no time.
Last edited by Gnadenburg; 12th Feb 2006 at 13:20.
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Oh Chimbu,
I said before, please get your facts right.
You cannot carry forward PAYE tax losses. You can carry forward capital losses to offset against future capital gains, but you will still have to pay your PAYE tax.
The taxman just aint that stupid, he always gets his dough, one way or another.
I said before, please get your facts right.
You cannot carry forward PAYE tax losses. You can carry forward capital losses to offset against future capital gains, but you will still have to pay your PAYE tax.
The taxman just aint that stupid, he always gets his dough, one way or another.
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sydneyman, I personally don't care if the QF guys are laughing. Well done guys - you work for the world's most perfect airline!!??!! I would rather work in Oz than head to EK and play in a sand pit! At least I can drown out my sorrows and blow my wages with a few lagers in Oz.
Nunc est bibendum
Originally Posted by confoutre
At least I can... blow my wages with a few lagers in Oz.
Grandpa Aerotart
murgatroid you get your facts right.
When I had a year or so back in Oz after many overseas I paid NO TAX because of accumulated 'losses' gained through negatively geared investment properties. It ALL came back, approximately $11000 in yr 1, via a Tax return done by a competent accountant.
Keg plenty of people earn a small fraction of what J* pilots earn and survive quite nicely...indeed the smarter ones build handy little investment nest eggs...and have plenty of lagers along the way.
Pilots need to understand one important thing.
At the PRESENT TIME there are effectively two tiers of airline pilots in the world.
1/. QF, NZ, BA, CX, AF, Alitalia, Lufthansa and a decreasing number of US airlines on what might be termed traditional terms and conditions...now seen as unsustainable by beancounters.
2/. EVERYONE ELSE.
It really is that simple....if you think J*'s package is a disgrace I've got bad news...it's TYPICAL of the VAST MAJORITY of airlines the world over....and if the opportunity presents MANY expats will apply....many expats that VASTLY out qualify the J* incumbants.
It's always interesting to chat to my mates at J*....most of whom are trainers and or Check captains.
The young tyros doing all the whinging were almost without exception B1900 pilots 3 or 4 years ago....some were unemployed but on hold to come back into the fold when a slot was available...remember those guys everyone?
Well now, just 2 or 3 years later, most of those B1900 pilots are A320 and 717 captains...the rest are close....none of them paid for those type ratings as that system came in for new joiners. NONE of the current J* pilots will have to pay for their A330 type ratings OR their 787 type ratings....if a EK pilot joins tomorrow with A330 on his licence he will not have to pay for his 787 type rating in 3 years.
In the meantime captains who want to work are grossing in excess of $160k and F/Os over 100k...without doing overnights...the VB guys would love that!....if they vote up the J* International EBA they will get to do that flying too, at a premium over what they earn now.....if they don't someone else will but it WILL NOT be QF mainline.
So you guys go ahead and knock yourselves out with your ignorant rhetoric...while everyone else just gets on with life in the real world.
When I had a year or so back in Oz after many overseas I paid NO TAX because of accumulated 'losses' gained through negatively geared investment properties. It ALL came back, approximately $11000 in yr 1, via a Tax return done by a competent accountant.
Keg plenty of people earn a small fraction of what J* pilots earn and survive quite nicely...indeed the smarter ones build handy little investment nest eggs...and have plenty of lagers along the way.
Pilots need to understand one important thing.
At the PRESENT TIME there are effectively two tiers of airline pilots in the world.
1/. QF, NZ, BA, CX, AF, Alitalia, Lufthansa and a decreasing number of US airlines on what might be termed traditional terms and conditions...now seen as unsustainable by beancounters.
2/. EVERYONE ELSE.
It really is that simple....if you think J*'s package is a disgrace I've got bad news...it's TYPICAL of the VAST MAJORITY of airlines the world over....and if the opportunity presents MANY expats will apply....many expats that VASTLY out qualify the J* incumbants.
It's always interesting to chat to my mates at J*....most of whom are trainers and or Check captains.
The young tyros doing all the whinging were almost without exception B1900 pilots 3 or 4 years ago....some were unemployed but on hold to come back into the fold when a slot was available...remember those guys everyone?
Well now, just 2 or 3 years later, most of those B1900 pilots are A320 and 717 captains...the rest are close....none of them paid for those type ratings as that system came in for new joiners. NONE of the current J* pilots will have to pay for their A330 type ratings OR their 787 type ratings....if a EK pilot joins tomorrow with A330 on his licence he will not have to pay for his 787 type rating in 3 years.
In the meantime captains who want to work are grossing in excess of $160k and F/Os over 100k...without doing overnights...the VB guys would love that!....if they vote up the J* International EBA they will get to do that flying too, at a premium over what they earn now.....if they don't someone else will but it WILL NOT be QF mainline.
So you guys go ahead and knock yourselves out with your ignorant rhetoric...while everyone else just gets on with life in the real world.
Last edited by Chimbu chuckles; 12th Feb 2006 at 23:39.
Originally Posted by murgatroid
Oh Chimbu,
I said before, please get your facts right.
You cannot carry forward PAYE tax losses. You can carry forward capital losses to offset against future capital gains, but you will still have to pay your PAYE tax.
The taxman just aint that stupid, he always gets his dough, one way or another.
I said before, please get your facts right.
You cannot carry forward PAYE tax losses. You can carry forward capital losses to offset against future capital gains, but you will still have to pay your PAYE tax.
The taxman just aint that stupid, he always gets his dough, one way or another.
Murg is barking up the wrong tree here. PAYE ( in this context ) is totally irrelevant to a non-resident. Chimbu is right. A common strategy for an expatriate is to buy the house you wish to retire in now. For example, you buy your million dollar pad on the beach, negative gear the property, claim depreciation etc etc. You do not pay it off until the day you retire. So you incur approximately 50K in capital loss per year. This is perpetual. So after 10 years say, you come home in retirement or working again, with a taxation credit of 500K.
Join Date: Nov 2005
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I hate to tell you guys but there are plenty of drivers in my outfit willing to go to Jetstar Int just for the lifestyle and the pay would be not far off the mark too.
Someone said the lowest paid widebody pilots in the world – far from it based on the numbers printed here on pprune.
I know guys who would give an eye teeth to get Jetstar wages and they already fly widebody in the US.
The old days are sadly going but its not the end of the world, still better getting 150 grand to drink coffee and watch the world go by than most other jobs around.
Some guys just get too greedy in this game.
Someone said the lowest paid widebody pilots in the world – far from it based on the numbers printed here on pprune.
I know guys who would give an eye teeth to get Jetstar wages and they already fly widebody in the US.
The old days are sadly going but its not the end of the world, still better getting 150 grand to drink coffee and watch the world go by than most other jobs around.
Some guys just get too greedy in this game.