Keep in mind that any simulator lacks true airplane fidelity, especially on the ground, . . . with emphasis on true aquaplanning, airplane inertia, split screen visual acuity, lack of side views, noises, heavy rain on windscreen, windshield wipers' smears, etc . . . .

As previously mentioned: Simulator training has more to do in avoidance, rather than in extricating yourself from the snafu of landing too far down the length of a wet pavement. Because if in the simulator you were to touch halfway down the pavement, you would fail your sim check. :{

protectthehornet

and you like so many others are WRONG WRONG WRONG

It ain't money. It's time and assurances that you are not going to just move the problem someplace else.

It sound easy to say money solves everything, but when you are told to submit a budget to fix it, you spend most of your time trying to figure out what's broke and then how to fix it.

In this accident we don't even know why it happened yet.

iompaseo
 

listen...if pilots didn't have to fill out paperwork for every go around...

if they didn't feel a silent pressure about MONEY and the cost of every minute of fuel maybe there wouldn't be a reluctance about going around...

it is money pal and if you don't know it now...you never will

waves
 

Where did that report appear?

listen...if pilots didn't have to fill out paperwork for every go around...

if they didn't feel a silent pressure about MONEY and the cost of every minute of fuel maybe there wouldn't be a reluctance about going around...

it is money pal and if you don't know it now...you never will
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Paperwork required for go-around? None.

:ugh:

lomapaseo - In this accident we don't even know why it happened yet.
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Post of the year, forever.

No facts on where the plane touched down.
No facts on the speed at touchdown.
No facts on any aircraft problems.
No facts on any environmental problems(standing water, hydroplanning, etc).
No facts on....

listen...if pilots didn't have to fill out paperwork for every go around...

I noticed the captain pushing the wheelchair had a pen in every pocket


vfd

Good post!
 

Yep, lets wait and see what the facts have to say. Glad no one was killed.

Anyone figured out what happened to the left wing? It looks almost like an overloading fracture.....

Oh, and I'm pretty sure the captain made the landing. Adverse conditions and all that.

misd-agin,

At a certain airline mentioned in this thread, yes, it's a required report for a go-around.

Look in required reports.


Sad thing our clueless bunch of Chiefs tossed in the mix not long ago

Most major U.S. carriers, including American, have a 'no-fault' go around policy. No paperwork, no second guessing. Does yours not have this? You are actually in trouble if you don't go around if the approach is unstable and the company finds out.

I realize many third world carriers still give you a visit to the chief pilot's office if you go around, been there done that in years past.

_____________________________________________

Wait, does American have a 'no-fault' go around policy and still require a written report? I thought the lack of a report for a missed approach was part of the 'no-fault' safety culture philosophy.

I have a hard time believing someone with no forward vsby at night can discern when they are half way down the runway. Assumes the pax knew the runway length. I've had comments from pax about long landings when I put it down at the 1000 ft mark. Many non pilot friends assume we land as close to the threshold as possible, believing any runway they see that we haven't landed equates to a long landing.

paperwork is required on a go around below 1000' agl.
at least at my major airline, which starts with a vowell...I will defer to an american pilot who truly knows.

touchdown zone lights would help...but there are other clues/cues to use...someone might want to post runway lights from the AIM.

The aircraft was probably lucky still to have enough energy to cross the road at the end of the runway and not fall down there, see the video here:

American investigating after plane crash lands in Jamaica | kens5.com | News

On duty for 12 hours, bad weather, possible short night or just not a good nights rest....could have been a lot worse. Glad no-one was killed.

Merry Christmas to all safe flying!!

With the odd chance that an over-run does occur, why do we allow airport designers build such a perimeter at the end of the runway, if the ground would have been level beyond the runway surface, how many injuries could have been avoided.

Paper work
Any captain that is so intimidated by doing the right thing in lieu of filling out a bit of paperwork or visit to the cp's office shouldn't be in the left seat, just my 2 cents.

One wonders...would this be part of the problem that sent the MD80 (of the same airline) off the end at Little Rock...a chief was directly involved with that flight.....flying.:rolleyes:

A report for a go around is required where I work too. It's to do with statistical analysis and trend monitoring, not to critique a decision or second guess anyone. It's a no blame policy for going around, pushing on and busting stabilized approach criteria is very much a blame policy and you will have a meeting with the Chief Pilot. It takes about 2 mind to fill out the form.

Can we also drop that one now?

As a pax, when you are familiar with an airport, it is not uncommon that you use landmarks to decipher your exact location...KIN has two exits and it is very rare for a narrowbody to use the second exit even in the worst of conditions....To answer your question as to how a person with no forward visibility can tell their location, you use the landmarks, e.g the airport fire station..

The mishap crew relieved the JFK at MIA.

The CA pushing the wheelchair was not the mishap CA.