[QUOTE]
Pontius,
prioritising is fine, it's basically choosing the order in which you carry out tasks. To not do something because you think its beneath you is another matter entirely.

Thanks, you too.

:ok:
My thanks to all my readers. you have lightened (a bit) a relatlvely quiet day. Don't forget to wash your cars this weekend (or get your wife to do it for you if you are an orficer!).

Funny that everyone has assumed the car driver would be male. What of the other sex? Their clothing is likely to be even less appropriate for car washing than someone who has just been dunking.

You didn't mention whether the ageing Sqn Ldr went back to MT and washed the car or not.

The Royal Air Force is an equal opportunities employer.;)

But the aging sqn ldr will not have the same opportunity to ladder his tights nor does he get the same uniform allowance. EO?

Paraphrase- 'All animals are equal, but some are more equal than others'- Eric Blair

Cut the drivel, stop moaning and get on with your job. I do not give a monkeys what rank you are, we all know MT is mostly rubbish and SHQ is painful in the extreme. Set an example. But back to my first sentence, it is about time the "get on with your job" was performed to a higher standard by both MT and admin.:}

Always remember my Grandfather telling me he never drove a car in his life .... if he needed one he just had someone pick up a car and drive him to wherever he had to go .... :p

mind you he started off in the RFC before service in the RAF so maybe things have changed since his time .... ;)

Seven f:mad:g pages have been devoted to this crap? Jesus wept.

With all the other b0llocks that people have to withstand in service life today is this really the most worthwhile subject to discuss? Put the handbags away and get a grip folks- the pongos are laughing at you:

http://www.arrse.co.uk/cpgn2/index.p...t=31892#561794

Hahaha! I don't know what they're laughing at with threads entitled ...

"Is George Galloway a total C**T?", "Bum Boy Barrymoore -off the hook again", "Posh burds: better in bed?" and my personal favourite, "wheres the wierdest place you've ever had a shiite?"

OK, anyone else noticed the intelligence level over there?!

Yes
So what
yes
CHOM

I've got to admit that in general the banter is funnier over there in the Naafi Bar than the mil forum of Pprune (it's more like Jetblast after 12 pints of wifebeater). Over in the grown-up/professional threads your won't read about an officer throwing his dolls out of his pram and bleating on about having to spend two minutes waving a f:mad:g pressure washer around the outside of Vauxhall Astra. Or on the offchance that you do, it'll be their troops laughing about what a c:mad:t he is and how the tom with a chronic case of NSU takes the time to rim his coffee mug every day. There's a quick lesson in leadership for you right there.

IHMO, any officer without stars or a flag who thinks that washing a car is beneath them should go and give themselves a good talking to, taking time to consider why the RAF has a reputation lower than whalesh1t among the other services because right now, girls, I'm ashamed to be associated with you.

I say again- get a grip.

"any officer without stars or a flag who thinks that washing a car is beneath them should go and give themselves a good talking to"


Erm..........So you do agree that some people are too good/special/important to be troubled with cleaning their own car?

You just disagree with the placing of the threshold at Sqn Leader/Midshipman.

Interesting.

I can’t believe that I am replying to this thread but….

Just because a person who holds a commission, it does not mean that he/she has a better education than that of a person who does not hold a commission. I recently met a young chap who had joined the police with a degree and master’s degree in engineering. He did do well at school and by all accounts is a very smart and able person who would probably be looked down upon by the sharp flying end of a military arm.

If the rule is that you clean the vehicle after use, then you clean the vehicle after use. If you are unable to do such a task then I would worry if you were to be in command of an aircraft. If this order is deemed to be incorrect, do something about it, use your initiative and fix the problem, not just baulk at it being not right for you.

It’s a shame to see this attitude is still prevalent and only tarnishes the fond memories I have of being in the service. I would like to point out that the people likely to achieve this side of the fence are the smart ambitious individuals that are capable of getting stuck in and completing a task regardless of its nature.

The NAFFI Bar is a good laugh, well worth a look.

Its 2 hours getting wet.........how difficult is that? Most of them could do with a wash anyway!!;) ;)

Thread drift ... dunker
 

At a fairly senior age I had to do the dunker and stass thing to do the job at a very secret base near Stonehenge.

Being a non/minimal-swimmer I was bricking it. The diving chaps at the dunker gave me a nice red hat and an extra diver to make sure that I came out of the skip at the required time. All went well, thanks to them I successfully (sp?) completed and was then self loading supernumary on a variety of flying machines, even got a log book ... :eek:

But when we returned to the secret base we washed the car ..... :)

I'm sure men of your advancing years shouldn't be bending down to wash cars Timex.

Which is why you take a young officer with you........;) ;)

Ha Ha Ha Ha..........................................

Keep it coming girls, Blue Circle Airlines have done themselves proud with this bit of hand bag swinging.
What a gem this thread is, and it reminds me of why i became a civie.

My 2 cents:

This comes down to respect.

Any self respecting SWO or RSM is going to pick up a junior officer for dirty boots. Any complaints from said officer and they will find themselves doing the "Axminster shuffle", receiving career guidance from the CO. Not their direct boss, so embarrassing said boss. It therefore doesn't happen very often.

Said SWO/RSM isn't going to do the same to a 20yrs-in Sqn Ldr/Maj.

Same for MT. Car's in crap order. Plt Offr Bloggs will clean the bloody thing. Sqn Ldr Smith won't. Any MT wallah who insists the Sqn Ldr does it wants shooting. Any MT wallah who doesn't insist the Plt Offr cleans it, similarly wants shooting.

As for those misguided individuals who have equated "doing well at school" with being an Officer, I take pride that those who know better have corrected them. In the specific case of Aircrew, aptitude counts considerably. You can be a duffer at school with (I believe) 5 O levels or whatever they are called now and qualify for an SSC. This has been evidenced by some of the ATROCIOUS grammar and spelling of those posting. You must, however, have the aptitude to be a pilot. This does not imply superior-being status, and certainly not man management skills. However, it isn't possible to climb the greasy pole too high without these skills.

Holier-than-thou attitudes earn a good spading or jerry-canning in your doss bag. Not a mistake to repeat.

I was an Army sergeant. I served on a couple of RAF stations in my time. Two great years of my life. I'd defend the Royal Air Force as much as the Army. It's so sad to see bickering like this thread. Be ashamed gentlemen. Officer or not.

8 pages on cleaning a poxy car.

Oh.....my......God.

:sad:

I agree, lets put this to rest.

Airman, clean the soddin' car.

Sir, with respect, you got it dirty, you clean it (IAW MT orders)

:ok:

Just out of interest - who signed the orders (ie who is giving the order). Is it:Mind you, having picked up corpses and bits of corpses and loaded them onto the back of a lorry, I can't see what all the fuss is about. It's not the worst job in the world.
The worst job in the world is, of course,

http://www.defence.gov.au/news/navyn...Car%20wash.jpg

http://www.ahajokes.com/cartoon/wash.jpg

I have just deleted my initial post before submitting because I suspect it would have added some petrol to the flames, and my boss knows who I am on these forums.
To summarise, without the 'due respect' I wouldn't clean anyone's car in the same vein I wouldn't clean their personal weapon!

Would look forward to the orderly room aswell. No doubt followed by the redress.

Gone are the days of subservient oiks. Clean your own car/rifle/hoop!

Bless your exhaust pipe.

It's a laugh in the RAF, us lucky few that got in!

Climebear, you are nearly correct. MT orders will come under the realm of OC Eng (as was when people knew what was going on). If officers feel the order is inappropriate there are clear and well trodden paths to have it changed. Seems to me that frankly only a very few feel it beneath them (and therefore attempt to change the order) or the SO1 has the policy that if you get it dirty, you clean it, or maybe the lower orders of the officer cadre haven't the energy (or wit) to suggest change other than on this little bunfight. Personally I think a quick trip to the local car wash is well worth while, especially in the winter.

BTW Widger, top pics :ok:

There is a class system within the forces, including the RAF. Moan about it as much as you like, it is there and as officers it is our job to uphold this divide as a pillar of military discipline. Officers are accommodated separately, travel separately and, most of the time, socialise separately from the Men and long may it continue.

Officers are, in general, busier than most. The exception being the swathe of blunties I see fleeing the station at 1645 each and every day. I certainly will not be dictated to by an increasingly large junta of union-men SNCOs that are determined to waste the valuable time of front-line aircrew.

When I return an MT wagon, I will certainly ensure that it is clean inside and all litter is removed, but washing it is not my job. That is for MT Flt to sort out. Perhaps they could do it between cups of tea/games of pool/darts?

My, you listened to all the lectures at Cranwell didn't you?

Putz

Remove your fish'n'chip paper/paper cups/used condoms/vomit but apart from that the MT erks clean it.
To the bitter and twisted lower deck personnel on this site - pull your heads in - there is a rank structure in the armed forces and I would say the middle level of this structure, at least in the air forces of the world, do more - take more risks - and have more onerous tasks. An old and bold RAAF rigger once told me - "being in the Air Force is great - the officers are the ones that do all the fighting".
If we had no rank and we were all Misters then I can assure you some Misters would be more senior than others!
And don't get up me for ignoring females - I am trying to pretend they don't exist at the sharp end!
GAGS
E86

Forces Class System
 

Mud Clubber

I agree that there does still appear to be an officer/others class sytem in some areas of the RAF. In general it appears to be upheld by a few pompous @rses like yourself. In this day and age of reduced manning and higher tasking we all have to knuckle down and get on with the job in hand which sometimes means everyone getting their hands dirty.

The vast majority of the officers that I work with wouldn't give your class system the time of day and these officers cover the broad spectrum including aircrew. I also believe that this is representative of the majority of officers in todays RAF

I am all for discipline and leadership but this is born out of respect that is earned it is not a birth right or class system throwback. If you choose to treat all below you in the chain of command like serfs then I am not surprised that you have met with the 'junta of union men SNCOs', they are probably trying to protect their hard working troops from idiots like you.


If the MT orders say wash your car then wash your car, stop bl00dy whingeing and get a life

A NON UNION SNCO

I wish people would stop posting on this thread it's making folk look stupid (and many don't need any help on that score).:E

BTW
off topic but has anyone noticed southsnide dissapeared when tourist restarted postin? Coincidence? We should be told!

I know I know:ok:

insty66.

There is personal and there is nasty.
And that's just nasty!

I only wash mine cos if i don't the tiffy gets a sad on and limits our flying, nowt to do with pride

Tourist,
I accept you are not he and apologise.:O :O

He has gone quiet though.

bu88er done it again

I have watched this thread with a knowledge of the dirge it would produce. As someone who has actually been an OC MT, I can say you lot moan and whine. Managing the difference between 'want' and 'need' is jolly fun. What you wanted was a gold-plated, mink lined service. What you needed was 4 seats, an engine and some diesel (single fuel concept). It was funny how expectations and variation between want and need increased with the regular working altitude of the customer :E

Well put and can this be an end to this debate, we as a Service have far more pressing concerns to worry about than 'should I wash a car', while funny and has been an enjoyable debate, it has shown the pettiness that is still prevalent in our whole rank structure.

If the orders say the driver cleans the vehicle, the driver cleans it, PERIOD.

Ergo, if the high and mighty Sqn Ldr didn't want to wash it then he asks for a driver, if not then he signs the vehicle out knowing full well the MT orders for that Base and complys with them per his annual signature on the afore mentioned MT orders.

Oh yes it's the 'Union Junta' that help to keep you flying Mub Clubber, if you're not happy with that fix then your own jet, if you are so important.