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Gaza Air War

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Old 18th Oct 2023, 07:07
  #161 (permalink)  
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Israeli press conference ongoing on the explosion - following highlights.

Explosion was in the car park, not the hospital, and there are no bomb craters or associated damage. It was not a aircraft bomb. IR and visual photos of the area.

Radar trace of rockets fired from behind the hospital towards Israel with misfires which hit the hospital area.

Third party videos showing the misfires and debris falling on the hospital area.

Radio/telephone intercepts of conversation between Hamas stating that it was a misfire of a missile fired from the cemetery behind the hospital.

Seems quite comprehensive.
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Old 18th Oct 2023, 07:42
  #162 (permalink)  
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Reference the RAF evacuation flights shown earlier.

POLITICO:

The Foreign Office Tuesday night briefed that 900 British citizens have now been flown out of Israel, with all those who registered as wishing to leave allocated seats. The booking portal will close at 10 a.m. U.K. time, and nationals who wish to fly have been told to prepare to travel in the next 24 hours.
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Old 18th Oct 2023, 08:33
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Originally Posted by Ninthace
Think you may need to revisit those incidents in the light of new evidence, Ninthace.
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Old 18th Oct 2023, 08:48
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Originally Posted by Mil-26Man
Think you may need to revisit those incidents in the light of new evidence, Ninthace.
Since they predated the hospital incident, I don’t think so.
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Old 18th Oct 2023, 08:50
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What is it about this conflict that removes people’s ability to think critically or to see both sides of a dispute?
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Old 18th Oct 2023, 09:04
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Originally Posted by Ninthace
Since they predated the hospital incident, I don’t think so.
The second article you linked is literally about the Gaza hospital. Any mention in either of those articles about 750 lb unguided bombs being used?
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Old 18th Oct 2023, 09:05
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Originally Posted by Ninthace
What is it about this conflict that removes people’s ability to think critically or to see both sides of a dispute?
It's a good question.
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Old 18th Oct 2023, 10:52
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Originally Posted by Ninthace
To me it is simple. If the images of IAF F-16s carrying racks of dumb bombs are true and they are bombing built up areas then that is bombing for effect rather than precision and that equals indiscriminate killing. Yes the bad guys were guilty of exactly that, but that is no reason to emulate it in spades. A professional military is supposed to be better than that.
Not if such a jet drops it on a building/position which is positively identified by ISTAR or during a combat engagement as being a military target. Dive, toss and laydown bombing of 'dumb bombs' with good accuracy are bread and butter to fast jets. It doesn't always have to be a PGM.
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Old 18th Oct 2023, 11:38
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Whatever hit the hospital, it wasn't a JDAM or a 750 lb dumb bomb...

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Old 18th Oct 2023, 16:23
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Listening to some supposed “Expert War Reporters” last night:
”The reported blast was too large to be a missile, It must have been a bomb.”

My thought:
If the missile launches “normally” it will most likely impact with only the explosive warhead charge on board.
However if it face-plants immediately after launch there may be considerable amounts of yet unburnt propellant ( fuel) still in the rocket tube.
When the warhead detonates the remaining propellant will most likely sympathetically explode causing much additional fire and shrapnel from the missile tube to cover the area.

Unfortunately the chances of a fair and impartial investigation are slim to nil.

I am sure some IAF bomb debris from elsewhere is being spread in the area even as I type this.

”The First Casualty is Truth”
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Old 18th Oct 2023, 19:22
  #171 (permalink)  
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Foreign Office has just devised against any travel to Lebanon and for all Britons in Lebanon to leave immediately whilst means are available.

I presume they have intelligence on future activity.

Now that evacuation from Israel is complete I presume, if clearance can be obtained, the C-17s/A-400Ms may be doing the same from Beirut….

https://www.gov.uk/foreign-travel-advice/lebanon

Last edited by ORAC; 19th Oct 2023 at 08:01.
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Old 18th Oct 2023, 23:58
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Originally Posted by ORAC
Foreign Office has just devised against any travel to Lebanon and for all Britons in Lebanon to leave immediately whilst means are available.

I presume they have intelligence on future activity.

Now that evacuation from Israel is complete I presume, if clearance can be obtained, the C-17s/A-400Ms may be doing the same from Beirut….
Would you wish to go near the eastern Med? Not me!
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Old 19th Oct 2023, 07:55
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Now that evacuation from Israel is complete I presume, if clearance can be obtained, the C-17s/A-400Ms may be doing the same from Beirut….
Perhaps the third time in recent living memory we'll see Chinooks with Union Jacks on their tails evacuating British citizens from Beirut.
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Old 19th Oct 2023, 09:18
  #174 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by albatross
Listening to some supposed “Expert War Reporters” last night:
”The reported blast was too large to be a missile, It must have been a bomb.”

My thought:
If the missile launches “normally” it will most likely impact with only the explosive warhead charge on board.
However if it face-plants immediately after launch there may be considerable amounts of yet unburnt propellant ( fuel) still in the rocket tube.
When the warhead detonates the remaining propellant will most likely sympathetically explode causing much additional fire and shrapnel from the missile tube to cover the area.

Unfortunately the chances of a fair and impartial investigation are slim to nil.

I am sure some IAF bomb debris from elsewhere is being spread in the area even as I type this.

”The First Casualty is Truth”
Agreed: see my #155 above regarding IAF debris ........... taking a long time to produce ANYTHING from the explosion, is it not?
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Old 19th Oct 2023, 10:49
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Originally Posted by albatross
Listening to some supposed “Expert War Reporters” last night:
”The reported blast was too large to be a missile, It must have been a bomb.”

My thought:
If the missile launches “normally” it will most likely impact with only the explosive warhead charge on board.
However if it face-plants immediately after launch there may be considerable amounts of yet unburnt propellant ( fuel) still in the rocket tube.
When the warhead detonates the remaining propellant will most likely sympathetically explode causing much additional fire and shrapnel from the missile tube to cover the area.

Unfortunately the chances of a fair and impartial investigation are slim to nil.

I am sure some IAF bomb debris from elsewhere is being spread in the area even as I type this.

”The First Casualty is Truth”
Truth, impartiality, balance, critical thinking and common sense.
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Old 19th Oct 2023, 12:20
  #176 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by langleybaston
Agreed: see my #155 above regarding IAF debris ........... taking a long time to produce ANYTHING from the explosion, is it not?
To be fair, a shooting war is still in progress. so the investigative arm may not get the emphasis we spectators may wish.
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Old 19th Oct 2023, 12:34
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Originally Posted by Lonewolf_50
To be fair, a shooting war is still in progress. so the investigative arm may not get the emphasis we spectators may wish.

Surely
some relevant debris even if only B&Q price tag on the pipe/tube.
The dog that did not bark in the night.
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Old 19th Oct 2023, 12:50
  #178 (permalink)  
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The U.S. State Department has now followed the UK Foreign Office and is telling all Americans in Lebanon to prepare to leave the country and is also evacuating the families of government staff and non-emergency personnel from their embassy.

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Old 19th Oct 2023, 14:29
  #179 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Mil-26Man
Whatever hit the hospital, it wasn't a JDAM or a 750 lb dumb bomb...

Assuming that the solar arrays are orientated south, the impact appears to have been on a heading of c 045 degrees. This fits the rocket theory.

Mog
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Old 19th Oct 2023, 14:43
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Originally Posted by langleybaston
Surely
some relevant debris even if only B&Q price tag on the pipe/tube.
The dog that did not bark in the night.
I saw some film of thick walled water pipes being dug out of the ground in order to be used in the manufacture of missiles in Gaza.
I assume the pipe would be used to contain solid chemical propellant. .
Should the fuel detonate you would have a heck of a pipe bomb. Large shrapnel everywhere especially if the detonation occurred just above ground when the warhead exploded. Small crater…big damage.

Sadly there is no evidence anyone can produce that would change some peoples belief that the weapon was anything but an IAF Bomb aimed deliberately at the hospital. Much like the folks who believe and will continue to believe that the 2020 US election was stolen no matter what evidence to the contrary is produced.
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