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Moskva down

Old 16th Apr 2022, 12:12
  #181 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by petit plateau
They are however due to receive at least one USV soonish.
There's been much discussion about loitering munitions, but does such a thing as a sub-surface loitering munition exist e.g. a sea mine with sensors and propulsion? Would seem a fairly obvious weapon to develop.
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Old 16th Apr 2022, 14:43
  #182 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by dead_pan
There's been much discussion about loitering munitions, but does such a thing as a sub-surface loitering munition exist e.g. a sea mine with sensors and propulsion? Would seem a fairly obvious weapon to develop.
Very much so, the US Navy version is called the Captor, been around for decades and iirc it used a Mk-46 lightweight torpedo configured as a mine, creating a loitering torpedo. I've no idea how smart the holding package is, but certainly expect that it has seen significant improvement thanks to more modern electronics, making the weapon much more versatile..
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Old 16th Apr 2022, 15:05
  #183 (permalink)  
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The USN plans to use XLUUV ORCA to deploy Hammerhead mines (Captor replacement).

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Old 16th Apr 2022, 16:13
  #184 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by dead_pan
Shocking to think the Russian's priority appeared to be to tow the vessel back to Sevastopol to avoid the humiliation of its loss, rather than concentrate on rescuing any crew members who may still have been trapped below decks, or recovering the bodies of those who died. Its the Kursk all over again.
I do wonder if they were attempting to get it to shallow waters or a port where the facilities are available to carry out a rescue, in the middle of the sea in a warzone is not the place to congregate various vessels to attempt a rescue knowing the ship you are attempting to rescue folks off was hit at that location. If it was buoyant the last thing you would want to be doing would be cutting holes in the hull. But I am just guessing as the nearest I have been to see is a ferry.
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Old 16th Apr 2022, 18:21
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"n the middle of the sea in a warzone is not the place to congregate various vessels to attempt a rescue knowing the ship you are attempting to rescue folks off was hit at that location."

Correct - remember the three British cruisers torpedoed early in WW1 when they tried to rescue the crews of each other..................
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Old 16th Apr 2022, 18:34
  #186 (permalink)  
 
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Maybe they were ordered to save the nukes first?
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Old 16th Apr 2022, 18:54
  #187 (permalink)  
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Remaining saved crew - assuming they are the actual crew and not PR stand-ins.

Not sure how the crew would have been retrieved, recovered, re-uniformed and in a fit state to go on parade so soon after their ship being sunk under them…

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Old 16th Apr 2022, 20:07
  #188 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by NutLoose
While not the missile used, could you imagine two of these hitting a fully armed ship, no wonder there could be heavy casualties.
I recall reading an article (probably AW&ST) maybe 40 years ago about a test of a then new US Navy anti-ship weapon (Harpoon?). Anyway, the target was a decommissioned US warship - but fully prepared with all the watertight doors shut, etc.
The missile didn't have any warhead, but the kinetic energy of the missile impact along with the residual fuel caused such a massive explosion that the target ship broke-up and sank.
Reportedly the Navy was rather unhappy that the target ship sank as they had planned to use it for something else...
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Old 16th Apr 2022, 20:35
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Originally Posted by ORAC
Remaining saved crew - assuming they are the actual crew and not PR stand-ins.

Not sure how the crew would have been retrieved, recovered, re-uniformed and in a fit state to go on parade so soon after their ship being sunk under them…
They do appear to be in remarkably good health given the traumatic event they've just experienced. Not a flash burn in sight
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Old 16th Apr 2022, 20:46
  #190 (permalink)  
 
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Plus all the trees appear to be in full bloom.

Regardless of sides I do find this ( I believe a Russian’s ) tribute rather moving. As someone says in the comments, they treated the people off Snake Island fairly and they were eventually released.




..

Last edited by NutLoose; 16th Apr 2022 at 20:59.
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Old 16th Apr 2022, 20:47
  #191 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by dead_pan
They do appear to be in remarkably good health given the traumatic event they've just experienced. Not a flash burn in sight
The reserve crew of the Moskva I wager.

Last edited by Senior Pilot; 16th Apr 2022 at 21:23. Reason: Keep the OT comments for a political thread
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Old 16th Apr 2022, 20:54
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Originally Posted by tdracer
I recall reading an article (probably AW&ST) maybe 40 years ago about a test of a then new US Navy anti-ship weapon (Harpoon?). Anyway, the target was a decommissioned US warship - but fully prepared with all the watertight doors shut, etc.
The missile didn't have any warhead, but the kinetic energy of the missile impact along with the residual fuel caused such a massive explosion that the target ship broke-up and sank.
Reportedly the Navy was rather unhappy that the target ship sank as they had planned to use it for something else...
I seem. to recall reading that the anti-ship, anti-U-boat, anti-armour rockets used in WW2 on Swordfish, Mosquitos ect. on maritime missions and. by Typhoons overland were equivalent to a 6 inch AP shell and often penetrated the pressure hulls of U-boats and exited the other side leaving 2 large holes which rapidly flooded the hulls.
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Old 16th Apr 2022, 21:02
  #193 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by tdracer
I recall reading an article (probably AW&ST) maybe 40 years ago about a test of a then new US Navy anti-ship weapon (Harpoon?). Anyway, the target was a decommissioned US warship - but fully prepared with all the watertight doors shut, etc.
The missile didn't have any warhead, but the kinetic energy of the missile impact along with the residual fuel caused such a massive explosion that the target ship broke-up and sank.
Reportedly the Navy was rather unhappy that the target ship sank as they had planned to use it for something else...
I'll need to do a bit of digging, but for some reason I think that was a Tomahawk TASM (ASCM) test. (Early version, before the land attack versions were rolled out). Let me see what I can figure out.
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Old 16th Apr 2022, 21:13
  #194 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by ORAC
Remaining saved crew - assuming they are the actual crew and not PR stand-ins.

Not sure how the crew would have been retrieved, recovered, re-uniformed and in a fit state to go on parade so soon after their ship being sunk under them…
All look remarkably “old” and unscathed. I am as sceptical as you..
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Old 16th Apr 2022, 22:41
  #195 (permalink)  
 
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I haven't seen these photos, but really what purpose will they serve? Potentially smooth the waters for a week or two, but when the stories of 400+ bereaved families seep out into the news - initially in Sevastopol but then nationally and internationally - Putin's empire is once again exposed as the dyed-in-the-wool liars they are.

Perhaps that's still the problem. They were only ever taught short-term cover-up, as long-term was - previously - not needed.
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Old 16th Apr 2022, 23:09
  #196 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Tartiflette Fan
I haven't seen these photos, but really what purpose will they serve? Potentially smooth the waters for a week or two, but when the stories of 400+ bereaved families seep out into the news - initially in Sevastopol but then nationally and internationally - Putin's empire is once again exposed as the dyed-in-the-wool liars they are.

Perhaps that's still the problem. They were only ever taught short-term cover-up, as long-term was - previously - not needed.
Isn't there a posthumous medal for giving life in active duty? Do the Russians still publish that now? If they do, that maybe a clue. I doubt they do. Most died a horrible death, occuring due the actions by one man and his henchmen.
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Old 16th Apr 2022, 23:27
  #197 (permalink)  
 
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Either way, the people in the video purporting to be moskva survivors look like little more than a rabble
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Old 17th Apr 2022, 03:18
  #198 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Lonewolf_50
I'll need to do a bit of digging, but for some reason I think that was a Tomahawk TASM (ASCM) test. (Early version, before the land attack versions were rolled out). Let me see what I can figure out.
There have been a variety of live fire tests for both Harpoon and Tomahawk over the years. Harpoons were used against a decommissioned amphibious supply ship (formerly the USS Durham) during the SINKEX phase of RIMPAC 2020 - https://www.thedrive.com/the-war-zon...nking-exercise A Tomahawk was used in a live fire against barge stacked with shipping containers in 2015 - https://news.usni.org/2015/02/09/vid...aritime-target There are undoubtedly others.
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Old 17th Apr 2022, 03:23
  #199 (permalink)  
 
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How about in the Iraq War...any used there against the Iraqi Navy?
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Old 17th Apr 2022, 04:14
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Originally Posted by SASless
How about in the Iraq War...any used there against the Iraqi Navy?
The Battle of Bubiyan of the first Gulf War saw over 20 Iraqi Navy vessels sunk in one action. Mainly smaller vessels like fast attack craft, patrol boats and mine layer/sweepers were sunk, over half to Royal Navy Sea Skua missiles (~30 kg HE warhead), half a dozen to laser-guided bombs. There was even an attempted engagement of a fast attack boat by a Canadian Hornet using a Sparrow air-to-air missile - the Hornet could lock the target up but the missile failed to track.

Last edited by MickG0105; 17th Apr 2022 at 07:55. Reason: Typo, nationality mix up fixed
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