Thunderbird Diamond SoCal Emergency Breakaway
Thread Starter
Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 5,896
Likes: 1
From: Rockytop, Tennessee, USA
Thunderbird Diamond SoCal Emergency Breakaway
Another day at the office. Looks like the right wing got sucked into the lead in a turn, quickly backed out and spooked one of the solos. Don't know who'll buy the beer but good job, no paint swapped. 
The breakaway occurs at about :25 in this video:
Some commentary in this article by Tyler Rogoway:
https://www.thedrive.com/the-war-zon...ency-breakaway
The breakaway occurs at about :25 in this video:
Some commentary in this article by Tyler Rogoway:
https://www.thedrive.com/the-war-zon...ency-breakaway
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 954
Likes: 64
From: england
Well done that man! A professional pilot with no ego. Took the necessary action and then rejoined the formation. Would have made the display more interesting to watch if the commentator explained what was happening to those on the ground .
It just goes to show it’s harder than it looks!
It just goes to show it’s harder than it looks!
Thread Starter
Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 5,896
Likes: 1
From: Rockytop, Tennessee, USA
Joined: Mar 2016
Posts: 43
Likes: 8
From: Alberta
Looked to me like the lead reversed the turn, a little abruptly, 2 adjusted and the solo didn’t pick it up. Used to happen when you glanced away briefly, looked back and got surprised. The whole formation was a bit loose at times, I suspect some sightseeing going on.
Joined: Sep 2004
Posts: 613
Likes: 30
From: 11A
There's no way the rest of the team expected the lead to roll out of the left turn when he did. It also looks as though the leader's roll-rate as he rolled out of the left turn was higher than the rate he used during entry. Possible therefore the lead made a rather late decision to roll-out, and I doubt very much he had called it. A rate of change of bank that the lead used rolling right to wings level would have to be called in anything other than a basic 3-ship for the guys on the wing to have a chance of keeping on the references. So much of the close formation manoeuvring relies upon the 'procedural' control inputs applied based on the leaders voice/tone and of course the expected manoeuvre.
Below the Glidepath - not correcting
Joined: Jun 2005
Posts: 1,886
Likes: 97
From: U.S.A.
Both. The Thunderbirds and Blue Angels are doing national fly-bys of hospital and health provider facilities in lieu of displays and/or training. Last week they did a bunch of East Coast stuff with the Blue Angels, obviously this week LA isn't far (relatively) from Nellis for the Thunderbirds.
/It was caused by the lead suddenly reversing his left turn, surprised Number 2 who reversed even quicker, and Number 6 got the airmanship award.
/It was caused by the lead suddenly reversing his left turn, surprised Number 2 who reversed even quicker, and Number 6 got the airmanship award.
Thread Starter
Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 5,896
Likes: 1
From: Rockytop, Tennessee, USA
A couple of years ago the leader of the Thunderbirds was fired for, among other things, trying to choke a teammate in a bar after a dispute over a too low flyover of a Washington Redskins football game:
https://www.airforcetimes.com/news/y...-bar-argument/
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 2,205
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From: US
The T-birds do look like they have more spacing than the Blues. To me it looks like the F-16 is a less stable platform to fly on the wing. One or two videos might be local conditions but it looks that way in a lot of the videos IMO. #6 looks a little spooked after he rejoined... :-0
Joined: Jun 2009
Aviation Qualifications: Military
Posts: 1,852
Likes: 647
From: florida
Salute!
The "cracking the whip" aspect of multi-plane formations is a big player, especially for the third/fourth/fifth fellow on the echelon/wedge/diamond.
#3 reacted very quickly, but #6, or whoever the solo member was, honored the unrehearsed and rather abrupt minor wing drop by lead and #3's reaction. The two solo folks do not practice as many really close formation maneuvers as #2 and #3. Ditto for the Blues. Most of the six-ship passes are benign and for pictures, ceremonies, etc. I think the Reds and the Cannuck Snows do a lot more 6-ship + close stuff than the U.S. teams, from what I have seen from their performances.
I am sure that many here have been the leader or #5 in close formations and can add to my comments, huh? /sarc
My own experience was to use the private freq and narrate the show as a lead.. If I had to change the practice roll/pitch rates and such, it was a simple comment like "bit tighter", "more pull now", "rolling out", etc.
Oh well, I liked the solo dude's very quick rejoin and all's well for the tour they made to thank the medical folks and others.
=================
BTW, I was at the Sun and Fun show 6 or 7 years ago when the Blues leader got lower than planned/practiced and the #2 and #3 guys broke up and away. We thot it was a new maneuver. Later, that next day, the Leader asked to be relieved, and said he had also had a problem on a previous performance, as well.
The Birds and Blues and Arrows and Snows must have the utmost confidence in their leader and team members. The great formation flying is the easiest part of what they do.
Gums sends...
The "cracking the whip" aspect of multi-plane formations is a big player, especially for the third/fourth/fifth fellow on the echelon/wedge/diamond.
#3 reacted very quickly, but #6, or whoever the solo member was, honored the unrehearsed and rather abrupt minor wing drop by lead and #3's reaction. The two solo folks do not practice as many really close formation maneuvers as #2 and #3. Ditto for the Blues. Most of the six-ship passes are benign and for pictures, ceremonies, etc. I think the Reds and the Cannuck Snows do a lot more 6-ship + close stuff than the U.S. teams, from what I have seen from their performances.
I am sure that many here have been the leader or #5 in close formations and can add to my comments, huh? /sarc
My own experience was to use the private freq and narrate the show as a lead.. If I had to change the practice roll/pitch rates and such, it was a simple comment like "bit tighter", "more pull now", "rolling out", etc.
Oh well, I liked the solo dude's very quick rejoin and all's well for the tour they made to thank the medical folks and others.
=================
BTW, I was at the Sun and Fun show 6 or 7 years ago when the Blues leader got lower than planned/practiced and the #2 and #3 guys broke up and away. We thot it was a new maneuver. Later, that next day, the Leader asked to be relieved, and said he had also had a problem on a previous performance, as well.
The Birds and Blues and Arrows and Snows must have the utmost confidence in their leader and team members. The great formation flying is the easiest part of what they do.
Gums sends...
Last edited by gums; 16th May 2020 at 22:44. Reason: corrected flight numbers
Joined: Feb 2015
Aviation Qualifications: PPL
Posts: 1,760
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From: Cincinnati, Ohio
I'll take an F/A-18C or a F16C with Gums as lead, anytime! I had an unforgettable ride in a Phantom F4C out of NAS Oceana long ago and far away. (My father was a "big guy" in the U.S. Navy and could arrange such things.) I was 15 and Angels 40 was reached far more rapidly than my young flight-suited self could have imagined! My face was peeled back by the G's for a minute; the smile has been on my face ever since.
When I earned my PPL in 1977, I'd go around the pattern or aviate long cross county flights to maintain currency. For the joy of it. I'd always look upward and think: "I've been there!"
Salute right back!
- Ed
When I earned my PPL in 1977, I'd go around the pattern or aviate long cross county flights to maintain currency. For the joy of it. I'd always look upward and think: "I've been there!"
Salute right back!
- Ed
Joined: Nov 2019
Posts: 3
Likes: 0
From: unknown
A couple of years ago the leader of the Thunderbirds was fired for, among other things, trying to choke a teammate in a bar after a dispute over a too low flyover of a Washington Redskins football game:
https://www.airforcetimes.com/news/y...-bar-argument/
https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-47219253
Thread Starter
Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 5,896
Likes: 1
From: Rockytop, Tennessee, USA
Could anybody tell me why the first female Thunderbird team leader was fired after just two weeks on the job....
https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-47219253
https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-47219253
Captain Katie Higgins Cook was the first female Blue Angel pilot to fly the C-130 support plane:
https://www.sandiegouniontribune.com/military/sdut-blue-angels-female-pilot-katie-higgins-2015oct01-htmlstory.html
More here on Captain Zoe Kotnik's 15 minutes of fame: First Female USAF F-16 Demo Team Commander Fired After Two Weeks
Last edited by Airbubba; 17th May 2020 at 04:54.