Second Op Shader DFC
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You doubt the level of hostility?
May I cordially invite you to take a stroll around the target area dressed in flying kit with the smouldering remains of your strike platform nestled in the background?
From your handle I guess you were a rotary crewman and you probably saw your fair share of hostile environments.
Just because you may have seen worse doesn’t make Syria any more pleasant for a downed pilot. Just ask the Jordanians.
BV
May I cordially invite you to take a stroll around the target area dressed in flying kit with the smouldering remains of your strike platform nestled in the background?
From your handle I guess you were a rotary crewman and you probably saw your fair share of hostile environments.
Just because you may have seen worse doesn’t make Syria any more pleasant for a downed pilot. Just ask the Jordanians.
BV
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I see the thread title refers to the second Op Shader DFC. If the earlier one was awarded before the authorisation of the Op Shader campaign medal (Operational Service Medal) which came out earlier this year I believe, then that would have been a rare instance of a DFC being awarded when there was no associated campaign medal. Anyone have any details of the earlier award?
Oh, and many congratulations to Flt Lt Hansford
Oh, and many congratulations to Flt Lt Hansford
He's a great man who does excellent work behind the scenes to raise awareness for mental health, and I have great respect for him for that as somebody both directly and indirectly effected with dodgy brain chemicals. He has certainly directly given me some encouragement and helped me to build my confidence.
http://www.insidemoray.com/dfc-for-p...typhoon-pilot/
Edit: Just re-read Easy Street's post. Same link.
Thanks for the info Easy Street and BVRAAM.
Re the "tariff" altering in time, this is inevitable. The very first Victoria Cross was won in the Crimean War by a naval officer who picked up a "fizzing bomb" from the deck of his ship and threw it overboard. By the time we get to WW1, picking up a German stick grenade and throwing it out of the trench would barely be commented on, never mind warrant the award of the VC
Re the wearing of the Bronze Star it is quite normal for foreign award issued by our allies to be authorised for wear. This does not always happen. When I was researching Soviet awards to British personnel during WW2 I discovered that as the iron curtain came down and the Cold War started, the wearing of these awards and their ribbons was not authorised.
Re the "tariff" altering in time, this is inevitable. The very first Victoria Cross was won in the Crimean War by a naval officer who picked up a "fizzing bomb" from the deck of his ship and threw it overboard. By the time we get to WW1, picking up a German stick grenade and throwing it out of the trench would barely be commented on, never mind warrant the award of the VC
Re the wearing of the Bronze Star it is quite normal for foreign award issued by our allies to be authorised for wear. This does not always happen. When I was researching Soviet awards to British personnel during WW2 I discovered that as the iron curtain came down and the Cold War started, the wearing of these awards and their ribbons was not authorised.
Funny co-incidence.
The original Typhoon, built by Hawker, was designed as a fighter but found great fame as a ground attack platform, now the present Typhoon is doing the same.
Excellent job Flt Lt Hansford.
The original Typhoon, built by Hawker, was designed as a fighter but found great fame as a ground attack platform, now the present Typhoon is doing the same.
Excellent job Flt Lt Hansford.
Can anyone answer this? There seems to have been a mix up as two US awards are mentioned. Air Comodore Smith was awarded the Legion of Merit. Don't see it being a problem, but you never know!
...it is quite normal for foreign award issued by our allies to be authorised for wear. This does not always happen.
I was pleased to see that at least one retiree had given that a stiff ignoring and was wearing those medals at a dinner I attended a few years ago.
US Awards - section 10.23 with caveat:
https://assets.publishing.service.go...P761_Part1.pdf
https://assets.publishing.service.go...P761_Part1.pdf
Permission to accept and wear will only be sought for awards of the Legion of Merit, Bronze Star Medal,Distinguished Flying Cross (US) and the Air Medal, provided the recipient has not received National (UK Level 1- 4) recognition for the same service and / or period of service
By the time we get to WW1, picking up a German stick grenade and throwing it out of the trench would barely be commented on, never mind warrant the award of the VC
Frederick Youens
Frederick was one of my grandfather’s cousins.
[QUOTE=Tankertrashnav;10320377]Thanks for the info Easy Street and BVRAAM.
Re the "tariff" altering in time, this is inevitable. The very first Victoria Cross was won in the Crimean War by a naval officer who picked up a "fizzing bomb" from the deck of his ship and threw it overboard. By the time we get to WW1, picking up a German stick grenade and throwing it out of the trench would barely be commented on, never mind warrant the award of the VC
Re the wearing of the Bronze Star it is quite normal for foreign award issued by our allies to be authorised for wear. This does not always happen. When I was researching Soviet awards to British personnel during WW2 I discovered that as the iron curtain came down and the Cold War started, the wearing of these awards and their ribbons was not authorised
There has been at least one occasion when authorisation has been given to wear a medal awarded by an ENEMY! Lt Cdr Rick Jolly proudly wore his Orden de Mayo alongside his South Atlantic medal and MBE and never was a gong more deserved.
RIP
Re the "tariff" altering in time, this is inevitable. The very first Victoria Cross was won in the Crimean War by a naval officer who picked up a "fizzing bomb" from the deck of his ship and threw it overboard. By the time we get to WW1, picking up a German stick grenade and throwing it out of the trench would barely be commented on, never mind warrant the award of the VC
Re the wearing of the Bronze Star it is quite normal for foreign award issued by our allies to be authorised for wear. This does not always happen. When I was researching Soviet awards to British personnel during WW2 I discovered that as the iron curtain came down and the Cold War started, the wearing of these awards and their ribbons was not authorised
There has been at least one occasion when authorisation has been given to wear a medal awarded by an ENEMY! Lt Cdr Rick Jolly proudly wore his Orden de Mayo alongside his South Atlantic medal and MBE and never was a gong more deserved.
RIP
I don't own this space under my name. I should have leased it while I still could
In addition to Rick Jolly's award of an Argentinian medal is this award of an MC from an Argentinian citation.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gavin_Hamilton_(British_Army_officer)
Cpl. Roy Fonseka, Royal Signalsattached to the Special Air Service, who was of Goan origin convinced the Argentinians that he was not SF, his role was just to carry the officer's kit. Given the way the Argentinian officers treated their men they believed he was just an ordinary soldier.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gavin_Hamilton_(British_Army_officer)
Cpl. Roy Fonseka, Royal Signalsattached to the Special Air Service, who was of Goan origin convinced the Argentinians that he was not SF, his role was just to carry the officer's kit. Given the way the Argentinian officers treated their men they believed he was just an ordinary soldier.
Indeed - as those of us who received those friendly little notes along with our Saudi and Kuwaiti medals know only too well; 'Here is your medal. You are not allowed to wear it'...
Never knew that about Rick Jolly, Mogwi, very interesting.
There were four awards of the prestigious Soviet Order of Lenin to members of 151 Wing (Hurricanes) operating in the Kola Peninsula in 1941, namely Wing Commander Ramsbottom-Isherwood, Squadron Leaders A. H. Rook and A. G. Miller and Flight Sergeant Haw.
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I see the thread title refers to the second Op Shader DFC. If the earlier one was awarded before the authorisation of the Op Shader campaign medal (Operational Service Medal) which came out earlier this year I believe, then that would have been a rare instance of a DFC being awarded when there was no associated campaign medal.
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Tankertrashnav: lots of precedence for this: hundreds if not thousands of DFCs (& DFMs) awarded to members of Bomber Command during WW2 & still no campaign medal!
Ken Scott - you are correct in one sense - in many cases the DFCs etc were awarded long before the first campaign ribbon, the 1939-43 Star as it was originally was authorised. I suppose what I meant was that in the post war years a DFC (or indeed any other gallantry medal) always went with an associated campaign medal, while in the case of the first Op Shader DFC the award of a campaign medal had not then been decided. However I have never agreed with a separate medal for Bomber Command. Why not one for Fighter Command? Or Coastal Command whose efforts have never received the attention which Bomber Command has? Once you agree to one special award, there is no end to it.
Re foreign awards, when I was in Kong Kong I was chatting with a US army officer who was on R & R from Vietnam. I told him I had spent a couple of hours on the ground at Qui Non when were staging through in an RNZAF Bristol Freighter. He told me that in the US forces that would immediately have qualified me for the US Vietnam campaign medal. A few weeks later I was surprised to receive one in the post from him - but although I was dared to pin the ribbon bar on I never quite had the nerve!
Re foreign awards, when I was in Kong Kong I was chatting with a US army officer who was on R & R from Vietnam. I told him I had spent a couple of hours on the ground at Qui Non when were staging through in an RNZAF Bristol Freighter. He told me that in the US forces that would immediately have qualified me for the US Vietnam campaign medal. A few weeks later I was surprised to receive one in the post from him - but although I was dared to pin the ribbon bar on I never quite had the nerve!
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I told him I had spent a couple of hours on the ground at Qui Non when were staging through in an RNZAF Bristol Freighter. He told me that in the US forces that would immediately have qualified me for the US Vietnam campaign medal.
Wensleydale,
Good to hear that some USAF were given a ride in our Sentries.
When I tried to get a ride in a USAF Awacs at Nellis in 87/88 I was turned down because "they could see inside the big box".
This was at the time when there were rumours about stealth aircraft operating from inside the big box.
My first reaction was that if they could spot the stealth then it wasn't very stealthy but with SSR it would have been visible, but hopefully not on primary.
Sorry about the thread drift. Well done all those recipients. Well deserved no doubt.
1066
Good to hear that some USAF were given a ride in our Sentries.
When I tried to get a ride in a USAF Awacs at Nellis in 87/88 I was turned down because "they could see inside the big box".
This was at the time when there were rumours about stealth aircraft operating from inside the big box.
My first reaction was that if they could spot the stealth then it wasn't very stealthy but with SSR it would have been visible, but hopefully not on primary.
Sorry about the thread drift. Well done all those recipients. Well deserved no doubt.
1066
