Top Gun 2
Guest
I have read stories of WW1 pilots up to 13'000. WW1 pilots didn't have oxygen. I also believe they suffered illness because of it.
WW2 Bomber Crews would often unclip their masks to eat, drink but clip them back again due to hypoxia.
As others have said British needed their masks to talk but iirc both German and American did not as they used throat mikes.
After a battle, when Bader slid his canopy back his squadron would move away from his aircraft a little. He was about to light a cigarette and they didn't want to be engulfed in the ensuing explosion if he had been hit.
Adolf Galland had an ash tray installed in his cockpit.
WW2 Bomber Crews would often unclip their masks to eat, drink but clip them back again due to hypoxia.
As others have said British needed their masks to talk but iirc both German and American did not as they used throat mikes.
After a battle, when Bader slid his canopy back his squadron would move away from his aircraft a little. He was about to light a cigarette and they didn't want to be engulfed in the ensuing explosion if he had been hit.
Adolf Galland had an ash tray installed in his cockpit.
I have been up to 11,500ft quite a few times in a glider without oxy with no ill effects but I usually did not stay above 10,000ft very long
Guest
By 1917/18 RFC/RAF pilots were regularly doing high altitude patrols at 17,000ft up to sometimes 21,000ft (depending on a/c type) - not a healthy occupation without oxy and pressurisation.
I have been up to 11,500ft quite a few times in a glider without oxy with no ill effects but I usually did not stay above 10,000ft very long
I have been up to 11,500ft quite a few times in a glider without oxy with no ill effects but I usually did not stay above 10,000ft very long
I have read stories of WW1 pilots up to 13'000. WW1 pilots didn't have oxygen. I also believe they suffered illness because of it.
WW2 Bomber Crews would often unclip their masks to eat, drink but clip them back again due to hypoxia.
As others have said British needed their masks to talk but iirc both German and American did not as they used throat mikes.
After a battle, when Bader slid his canopy back his squadron would move away from his aircraft a little. He was about to light a cigarette and they didn't want to be engulfed in the ensuing explosion if he had been hit.
Adolf Galland had an ash tray installed in his cockpit.
WW2 Bomber Crews would often unclip their masks to eat, drink but clip them back again due to hypoxia.
As others have said British needed their masks to talk but iirc both German and American did not as they used throat mikes.
After a battle, when Bader slid his canopy back his squadron would move away from his aircraft a little. He was about to light a cigarette and they didn't want to be engulfed in the ensuing explosion if he had been hit.
Adolf Galland had an ash tray installed in his cockpit.
USN use 100% Oxygen from the get go, so they would normally wear the mask from start up. The (possibly) only fast jet pilots that don't wear a mask (during displays) are the Blue Angels who use a boom microphone.
Personally I would always wear one in the aircraft, apart from eating and drinking, as a bird in the face, rapid decompression, canopy failure or canopy jettison/MDC splatter can really ruin your day without one.
Personally I would always wear one in the aircraft, apart from eating and drinking, as a bird in the face, rapid decompression, canopy failure or canopy jettison/MDC splatter can really ruin your day without one.
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Australia OZ
Age: 75
Posts: 2,577
Likes: 0
Received 52 Likes
on
45 Posts
'Stitchbitch' (ex-A4G?) has the good SOP. Here is an oldie but goldie story about 'the best hangover cure EVER!' Pure Oxygen under Pressure.
Perils of Pure Oxygen Under Pressure [5 page PDF about LOX and acceleration atelectasis attached [Kiwis solved LOX problemo]
“...Another prominent influence in Paul's AirPac world was a female aviation physiologist at Alameda. He later learned that she was the first female aviation physiologist in the Navy. "A bunch of us were sitting in a briefing room awaiting the lecture on the use of oxygen equipment when this really attractive brunette walked in. We all sort of straightened up and paid attention. The young lady began the lecture by asking, 'How many of you smoke?' Several hands went up. Then, 'How many of you smoke while flying?' Some hands remained raised."
Without a further word, the physiologist strode to a console, inhaled deeply of 100 percent oxygen from a tank and produced a cigarette lighter. "This little gal blew a big breath, flicked the lighter and ignited a streak of flame right over our heads that seemed about six feet long," Paul recalls with a grin. Then she said, "That's why you don't smoke in the cockpit."
"Believe you me – she made her point! I thought, 'Hmmm... she's all right.'...”
‘Where Are They Now? Paul Gillcrist’ by Barrett Tillman http://www.tailhook.org/Gillcrist.htm
Perils of Pure Oxygen Under Pressure [5 page PDF about LOX and acceleration atelectasis attached [Kiwis solved LOX problemo]
“...Another prominent influence in Paul's AirPac world was a female aviation physiologist at Alameda. He later learned that she was the first female aviation physiologist in the Navy. "A bunch of us were sitting in a briefing room awaiting the lecture on the use of oxygen equipment when this really attractive brunette walked in. We all sort of straightened up and paid attention. The young lady began the lecture by asking, 'How many of you smoke?' Several hands went up. Then, 'How many of you smoke while flying?' Some hands remained raised."
Without a further word, the physiologist strode to a console, inhaled deeply of 100 percent oxygen from a tank and produced a cigarette lighter. "This little gal blew a big breath, flicked the lighter and ignited a streak of flame right over our heads that seemed about six feet long," Paul recalls with a grin. Then she said, "That's why you don't smoke in the cockpit."
"Believe you me – she made her point! I thought, 'Hmmm... she's all right.'...”
‘Where Are They Now? Paul Gillcrist’ by Barrett Tillman http://www.tailhook.org/Gillcrist.htm
Last edited by SpazSinbad; 1st Jun 2022 at 23:52. Reason: proofredding
Wasn't there a story of a pilot with a bushy moustache, which caught fire in his mask as the acft transitioned to 100% oxy - he had been eating a peanut butter sandwich and the oil was still on his mo.
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Australia OZ
Age: 75
Posts: 2,577
Likes: 0
Received 52 Likes
on
45 Posts
30 odd years ago this RAAF Pilot paid a heavy penalty for habitually removing oxy mask in flight. I have other PDFs/Links saying so but this one will do for now.
I have read stories of WW1 pilots up to 13'000. WW1 pilots didn't have oxygen. I also believe they suffered illness because of it.
WW2 Bomber Crews would often unclip their masks to eat, drink but clip them back again due to hypoxia.
As others have said British needed their masks to talk but iirc both German and American did not as they used throat mikes.
After a battle, when Bader slid his canopy back his squadron would move away from his aircraft a little. He was about to light a cigarette and they didn't want to be engulfed in the ensuing explosion if he had been hit.
Adolf Galland had an ash tray installed in his cockpit.
WW2 Bomber Crews would often unclip their masks to eat, drink but clip them back again due to hypoxia.
As others have said British needed their masks to talk but iirc both German and American did not as they used throat mikes.
After a battle, when Bader slid his canopy back his squadron would move away from his aircraft a little. He was about to light a cigarette and they didn't want to be engulfed in the ensuing explosion if he had been hit.
Adolf Galland had an ash tray installed in his cockpit.
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Australia OZ
Age: 75
Posts: 2,577
Likes: 0
Received 52 Likes
on
45 Posts
SIFTING THROUGH THE EVIDENCE Pilot incapacitation near Tindal, 05 June 1991, (AF/A-18 A21-41) 2 page PDF attached
DDAAFS Defence Aviation Air Force Safety http://www.pigzbum.com/accidents/sif...he-evidenc.pdf
"...If the incident pilot had in fact not realised the cabin pressure switch was incorrectly set to DUMP, the cabin would have been unpressurised and the pilot, on removing his mask at altitude, would have quickly suffered hypoxic hypoxia due to the lack of cabin oxygen....
...The most likely causal factor was deemed to be that the pilot suffered hypoxic hypoxia, as a result of removing his oxygen mask in an unpressurised cockpit at altitudes greater than 28,000 ft....
...Footnotes: The incident pilot had a history of flying with his oxygen mask removed. As recently as two days before the accident, the incident pilot had indicated to another squadron pilot that he considered it unnecessary to wear his oxygen mask at altitudes around 30,000 ft since the cabin altitude was only about 12,000 ft under those circumstances. (With the cabin pressure switch set to NORM, the AF/A-18 cabin pressure schedule maintains a cockpit altitude of approximately 8000 ft until 23,000 ft aircraft altitude. Above 23,000 ft aircraft altitude, the cockpit altitude increases slowly to approximately 14,500 ft at 35,000 ft aircraft altitude, and 20,000 ft at 50,000 ft aircraft altitude.) The Board concluded that since a radio call had been made passing FL220, the incident pilot must have taken his oxygen mask off some time later, probably when he unexplainably levelled off at FL280 for a short period during the climb. (The time of useful consciousness at FL280 is less than two minutes and time to unconsciousness is less than four minutes. These times decrease with increasing altitude.)...
...It was thought, that since the incident pilot had only completed AVMED training once (during his initial pilot training and four years prior to the accident) that he may have had insufficient experience to be fully aware of his individual hypoxia symptoms. At the time of the accident he was 11 months overdue for his AVMED refresher training."
DDAAFS Defence Aviation Air Force Safety http://www.pigzbum.com/accidents/sif...he-evidenc.pdf
"...If the incident pilot had in fact not realised the cabin pressure switch was incorrectly set to DUMP, the cabin would have been unpressurised and the pilot, on removing his mask at altitude, would have quickly suffered hypoxic hypoxia due to the lack of cabin oxygen....
...The most likely causal factor was deemed to be that the pilot suffered hypoxic hypoxia, as a result of removing his oxygen mask in an unpressurised cockpit at altitudes greater than 28,000 ft....
...Footnotes: The incident pilot had a history of flying with his oxygen mask removed. As recently as two days before the accident, the incident pilot had indicated to another squadron pilot that he considered it unnecessary to wear his oxygen mask at altitudes around 30,000 ft since the cabin altitude was only about 12,000 ft under those circumstances. (With the cabin pressure switch set to NORM, the AF/A-18 cabin pressure schedule maintains a cockpit altitude of approximately 8000 ft until 23,000 ft aircraft altitude. Above 23,000 ft aircraft altitude, the cockpit altitude increases slowly to approximately 14,500 ft at 35,000 ft aircraft altitude, and 20,000 ft at 50,000 ft aircraft altitude.) The Board concluded that since a radio call had been made passing FL220, the incident pilot must have taken his oxygen mask off some time later, probably when he unexplainably levelled off at FL280 for a short period during the climb. (The time of useful consciousness at FL280 is less than two minutes and time to unconsciousness is less than four minutes. These times decrease with increasing altitude.)...
...It was thought, that since the incident pilot had only completed AVMED training once (during his initial pilot training and four years prior to the accident) that he may have had insufficient experience to be fully aware of his individual hypoxia symptoms. At the time of the accident he was 11 months overdue for his AVMED refresher training."
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Australia OZ
Age: 75
Posts: 2,577
Likes: 0
Received 52 Likes
on
45 Posts
Where is your recollection from please? TIA. As you can see I'm interested in this story for my BIG PDF & 'oxy probs' not just LOX.
Spaz, details here, page 34, the wingman returned to Tindal upon reaching min fuel, no mention of Gove. I see you have referenced the link yourself previously.
http://www.pigzbum.com/accidents/sif...he-evidenc.pdf
I have some extremely vague recollection that there was some problem with the Hornet pilot to airframe oxy connection at some time where it could become unplugged, may be the memory turning to mush.
Then again, perhaps he recognised the onset of hypoxia because of the now recognised issues with the on board oxygen generation system and removed his mask, who knows.
http://www.pigzbum.com/accidents/sif...he-evidenc.pdf
I have some extremely vague recollection that there was some problem with the Hornet pilot to airframe oxy connection at some time where it could become unplugged, may be the memory turning to mush.
Then again, perhaps he recognised the onset of hypoxia because of the now recognised issues with the on board oxygen generation system and removed his mask, who knows.
Last edited by megan; 2nd Jun 2022 at 06:08.
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Australia OZ
Age: 75
Posts: 2,577
Likes: 0
Received 52 Likes
on
45 Posts
Spaz, details here, page 34, the wingman returned to Tindal upon reaching min fuel, no mention of Gove. I see you have referenced the link yourself previously.
http://www.pigzbum.com/accidents/sif...he-evidenc.pdf
I have some extremely vague recollection that there was some problem with the Hornet pilot to airframe oxy connection at some time where it could become unplugged, may be the memory turning to mush. [mine is mush that is why I make BIG PDF ] Then again, perhaps he recognised the onset of hypoxia because of the now recognised issues with the on board oxygen generation system and removed his mask, who knows.
http://www.pigzbum.com/accidents/sif...he-evidenc.pdf
I have some extremely vague recollection that there was some problem with the Hornet pilot to airframe oxy connection at some time where it could become unplugged, may be the memory turning to mush. [mine is mush that is why I make BIG PDF
] Then again, perhaps he recognised the onset of hypoxia because of the now recognised issues with the on board oxygen generation system and removed his mask, who knows.Hypoxic hypoxia (hypoxemic hypoxia) : There is a lack of oxygen in the blood flowing to the tissues.
Last edited by SpazSinbad; 2nd Jun 2022 at 06:57. Reason: Hypoxic hypoxia symptoms
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Australia OZ
Age: 75
Posts: 2,577
Likes: 0
Received 52 Likes
on
45 Posts
Ecce Homo! Loquitur...
https://www.washingtonpost.com/archi...-df082d1dac9c/
June 24, 1995
Navy officials said yesterday that their investigation into the fatal crash of an F-14 jet fighter in 1989 in Arizona revealed that the mishap occurred when the pilot and navigator removed their helmets and oxygen masks, donned their cloth garrison caps and saluted pilots in a nearby plane who were taking pictures of them.…
June 24, 1995
Navy officials said yesterday that their investigation into the fatal crash of an F-14 jet fighter in 1989 in Arizona revealed that the mishap occurred when the pilot and navigator removed their helmets and oxygen masks, donned their cloth garrison caps and saluted pilots in a nearby plane who were taking pictures of them.…
