What a waste, what a fool.
I just like to see consistency
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Bob,
I stand corrected, although surely, due to the very nature of his work, he would have a higher level of clearance than 'standard' RAF pilots? He was a Special Forces chauffeur, so that would be a bigger target on his back for evil-doers in this country.
Personally, I don't care that he snorted cocaine when he let his hair down a little too much. That's up to him and there's no evidence that it impaired his flying judgement. Taking those substances on to the base was very stupid, although it doesn't make him a bad guy. Trashing his career was a little harsh, IMHO.
Although we aren't in possession of all of the facts which is why I point-blank refuse to judge his character.
I stand corrected, although surely, due to the very nature of his work, he would have a higher level of clearance than 'standard' RAF pilots? He was a Special Forces chauffeur, so that would be a bigger target on his back for evil-doers in this country.
Personally, I don't care that he snorted cocaine when he let his hair down a little too much. That's up to him and there's no evidence that it impaired his flying judgement. Taking those substances on to the base was very stupid, although it doesn't make him a bad guy. Trashing his career was a little harsh, IMHO.
Although we aren't in possession of all of the facts which is why I point-blank refuse to judge his character.
If I may go back 45 years or so :
One University Air Squadron Act. Plt. Off. Drunk driving. Ended up as Gp Capt.,
Another University Air Squadron Act. Plt. Off. Possession of Marijuana. Ended up as a Wg. Cdr.
No, neither were on ULAS, although we jokingly criticized Plod for burning "Sub Standard" hash at a demo at 206 Brompton Road ( "Just so you know what it smells like, guys " (
)
Had to laugh when my Hall of Residence ( in the Kings Road) was raided by London's finest in 1971...
The warden remonstrating that "In my day in 1922 it was OPIUM as gentlemans' choice for relaxation"
Actually the choice vehicle then was LSD - and no NO WAY was Haraka tempted - a flashback whilst flying.......!
One University Air Squadron Act. Plt. Off. Drunk driving. Ended up as Gp Capt.,
Another University Air Squadron Act. Plt. Off. Possession of Marijuana. Ended up as a Wg. Cdr.
No, neither were on ULAS, although we jokingly criticized Plod for burning "Sub Standard" hash at a demo at 206 Brompton Road ( "Just so you know what it smells like, guys " (
) Had to laugh when my Hall of Residence ( in the Kings Road) was raided by London's finest in 1971...
The warden remonstrating that "In my day in 1922 it was OPIUM as gentlemans' choice for relaxation"
Actually the choice vehicle then was LSD - and no NO WAY was Haraka tempted - a flashback whilst flying.......!
I don't own this space under my name. I should have leased it while I still could
More recently, say 10 years, one-off usage of class C, provided it was confessed as not a show stopper as it was accepted that the majority of the population at large May well have sampled recreational drugs at sometime.
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Pain killer abuse and to a certain extent steroids abuse was also pretty frequent in the more active parts of the army.
Pain killers to get them through courses.
And steroids to get the muscle bulk up quickly.
Pain killers to get them through courses.
And steroids to get the muscle bulk up quickly.
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Seventy bloody years on this Planet, and I've never even been tempted to try ... and that was growing up in Richmond, surrey, in the Swinging Sixties and knowing a few interesting Pop Stars of the time. Booze and tobacco was sufficient ... and the females.
What did I miss?
I avoided a criminal record
What did I miss?
I avoided a criminal record
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I don't give a damn about what the general population do, nor the fact he isn't a junkie, or that it probably didn't affect his flying, or even that he was combat stressed, divorce? so what, womanizer? big deal. None of it.
His behaviour in taking Class A drugs was simply unacceptable for a Royal Air Force Officer. The end.
His behaviour in taking Class A drugs was simply unacceptable for a Royal Air Force Officer. The end.
MPN11, Concur.
Nevertheless, very disappointed by a top guy blowing it.
As an Australian CP of my acquaintance was wont to say at tea without biscuits; "What were you thinking of?!"
I do recollect, as a little Argosy co-jo, staying up VERY late with an 0400 call.
A couple of weeks later, nowt having been mentioned, I said to the captain: "Thanks for not reporting that flight back from Malta to the boss."
Capt: "What flight?"
Nevertheless, very disappointed by a top guy blowing it.
As an Australian CP of my acquaintance was wont to say at tea without biscuits; "What were you thinking of?!"
I do recollect, as a little Argosy co-jo, staying up VERY late with an 0400 call.
A couple of weeks later, nowt having been mentioned, I said to the captain: "Thanks for not reporting that flight back from Malta to the boss."
Capt: "What flight?"
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Pain killer abuse and to a certain extent steroids abuse was also pretty frequent in the more active parts of the army.
Pain killers to get them through courses.
And steroids to get the muscle bulk up quickly.
Pain killers to get them through courses.
And steroids to get the muscle bulk up quickly.
At least one that I know of had irreparable damage to both kidneys (he was medivac'd on a filter). Of course the stuff he was taking was all legal which makes it 'good' drug abuse I guess.
SHornet wrote:
You need to get rid of that attitude sharpish if you are ever to be accepted into the RAF. Let alone as a pilot.
Join our club? = Play by our rules.
Break our rules? = Get out of our club!
Personally, I don't care that he snorted cocaine when he let his hair down a little too much. That's up to him and there's no evidence that it impaired his flying judgement.
Join our club? = Play by our rules.
Break our rules? = Get out of our club!
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co-dynamol was called running candy and it certainly wasn't legal without a prescription.
Yellow eyes in mortar or fire support platoons wasn't uncommon.
The only unit that seem to have a serious issue with that sort thing was the royals. Which is from whom I found out about what the yellow eyes thing was all about.
Yellow eyes in mortar or fire support platoons wasn't uncommon.
The only unit that seem to have a serious issue with that sort thing was the royals. Which is from whom I found out about what the yellow eyes thing was all about.
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IMHO the worst of this is not the drugs per se but the fact that this guy couldn't give two hoots about totally screwing -in every sense -his fellow officers. Had either of the young female officers accepted his kind offer, what did he intend to happen next? How many other young officers did he put in jeopardy, aside from his co-defendant whose career is in shreds. As people keep pointing out, we don't know the full facts. If we did I suspect it would be even worse!
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If he had PVR'd how long would it have taken to get out?
And what would have been his work load in the last say 2 years?
And would he have any form of return of service hanging over him to prevent him getting out?
And what would have been his work load in the last say 2 years?
And would he have any form of return of service hanging over him to prevent him getting out?
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Its something to do with that I think. Also changes the skin colour as well.
From a distant memory the Royals thought it was stupid for that and.
It gives a tendency for your Achilles tendon to snap.
And screws with your vision.
And screws with your pancreas
They could spot a user from 50 meters away.
From a distant memory the Royals thought it was stupid for that and.
It gives a tendency for your Achilles tendon to snap.
And screws with your vision.
And screws with your pancreas
They could spot a user from 50 meters away.
changed his skin colour?
Like from what?
Like from what?
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Well with none whites you can't see it.
But basically I think whites it gives you a yellow tinge.
I really don't know, I was more in the beer and kebab line of training regime for weight gain.
Which tended to only give you chilli sauce pigment colour changes.
But basically I think whites it gives you a yellow tinge.
I really don't know, I was more in the beer and kebab line of training regime for weight gain.
Which tended to only give you chilli sauce pigment colour changes.
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Mad Jock;
Quote:
The criminal record will also prevent him from becoming a commercial pilot.
It won't.
And he just needs to be clean for 2 years to get a medical.
I'm afraid it will. A criminal conviction is an automatic bar to anyone wanting to be issued a civilian airside pass. Similarly, a criminal conviction will render it highly unlikely any visa application necessary for a job as civilian pilot will be granted. There are probably more reasons but those are sufficient.
Quote:
The criminal record will also prevent him from becoming a commercial pilot.
It won't.
And he just needs to be clean for 2 years to get a medical.
I'm afraid it will. A criminal conviction is an automatic bar to anyone wanting to be issued a civilian airside pass. Similarly, a criminal conviction will render it highly unlikely any visa application necessary for a job as civilian pilot will be granted. There are probably more reasons but those are sufficient.
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There are plenty of jobs especially in the rotary world that don't require airside passes.
So I agree the north sea will be out. For the short term.
Anyway because he hasn't done any time it will be considered spent after two years. Or even 1 year if its consider a fine.
There are plenty of commercial pilots out there with time in prison and airside passes.
And places where his skill set will be at a premium all they will be interested in is hard currency for a visa.
If someone refuses to give him a job due to a spent conviction they are opening themselves up to discrimination charges.
It also depends on the charge the CM put him through on. If its a mil charge that doesn't mention drugs nobody will know what it is only that he was dishonourably discharged. So the visa thing might not be an issue depending on the charge sheet.
Either way by the time he completes the clean sheet for the class 1 medical it won't appear on a CRC.
If he was low houred unskilled pilot I would say he would be extremely unlikely to got a job as a commercial pilot. With his experience and skill set I suspect there will be certain company's and areas of operation he will be like gold dust. He could be a serial killer and rapist and they would take him on. If he has instructor experience even more so. Like it or not he has been chucked out on the street with a couple of million of well respected military training behind him and he has also put it to use.
So I agree the north sea will be out. For the short term.
Anyway because he hasn't done any time it will be considered spent after two years. Or even 1 year if its consider a fine.
There are plenty of commercial pilots out there with time in prison and airside passes.
And places where his skill set will be at a premium all they will be interested in is hard currency for a visa.
If someone refuses to give him a job due to a spent conviction they are opening themselves up to discrimination charges.
It also depends on the charge the CM put him through on. If its a mil charge that doesn't mention drugs nobody will know what it is only that he was dishonourably discharged. So the visa thing might not be an issue depending on the charge sheet.
Either way by the time he completes the clean sheet for the class 1 medical it won't appear on a CRC.
If he was low houred unskilled pilot I would say he would be extremely unlikely to got a job as a commercial pilot. With his experience and skill set I suspect there will be certain company's and areas of operation he will be like gold dust. He could be a serial killer and rapist and they would take him on. If he has instructor experience even more so. Like it or not he has been chucked out on the street with a couple of million of well respected military training behind him and he has also put it to use.
Last edited by mad_jock; 10th Dec 2014 at 22:22.
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SHornet
Up to him, as a serving officer, whether he takes Class A drugs and commits a criminal/service offence by doing so?
In your opinion, is it only judgment when flying that matters?
From a post of yours a week ago:
Please forgive me for asking but, do you really think that with your attitudes you are suited to a service career?
BEagle
Were the 'big 3' questions during your QFI days on ULAS?
I vaguely remember being asked the Police question when we were students, but not the others.
Were there a 'PC approved' answer to Q3?
Haraka
45 years! If you must remind us.
I was persuaded to go for a quick nightcap at 206 Brompton Road a couple of weeks ago (I'm easily led) and ended up leaving at something past 2 am. Some things never change - thankfully. I'm going back for the final party soon. Sad to see the old place go. We had a lot of fun there.
Personally, I don't care that he snorted cocaine when he let his hair down a little too much. That's up to him and there's no evidence that it impaired his flying judgement.
In your opinion, is it only judgment when flying that matters?
From a post of yours a week ago:
I'm not military (yet)
BEagle
Were the 'big 3' questions during your QFI days on ULAS?
I vaguely remember being asked the Police question when we were students, but not the others.
Were there a 'PC approved' answer to Q3?
Haraka
If I may go back 45 years or so
I was persuaded to go for a quick nightcap at 206 Brompton Road a couple of weeks ago (I'm easily led) and ended up leaving at something past 2 am. Some things never change - thankfully. I'm going back for the final party soon. Sad to see the old place go. We had a lot of fun there.