Go Back  PPRuNe Forums > Aircrew Forums > Military Aviation
Reload this Page >

Global Aviation Magazine : 60 Years of the Hercules

Military Aviation A forum for the professionals who fly military hardware. Also for the backroom boys and girls who support the flying and maintain the equipment, and without whom nothing would ever leave the ground. All armies, navies and air forces of the world equally welcome here.

Global Aviation Magazine : 60 Years of the Hercules

Old 26th May 2016, 13:03
  #4361 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: sussex
Posts: 1,601
In respect of the Hercules tie I wonder why mine is a different colour. I cannot recall how I came to own it. Perhaps I was just around when they were handed out..
ancientaviator62 is offline  
Old 26th May 2016, 13:47
  #4362 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: wiltshire
Age: 72
Posts: 99
SCINS Memories

My main experience of SCINS was trundling in and out of Sarajevo from Zagreb and thinking what a grand job the Navs were doing with this modern piece of kit, ( well at least compared to everything else on board ). However you still came up against that well known syndrome when it broke of when trying to get spares, the reply of " You can't have that one , it's the only one we have ". On being appraised of this reply the Nav, unfortunately I can't remember his name , understandedly went moderately ballistic and pointed out to the Avionics controller at Lyneham that as we were the only people using SCINS there wasn't liable to be a great demand from anybody else and it was to be forwarded ASAP. And so it was!
There must be quite a few stories from the work that was being carried out then, I have a few more to introduce when time permits, interesting loads, interesting people, search your memories gentlemen and ladies, all are welcome!
gopher01 is offline  
Old 26th May 2016, 14:29
  #4363 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Oct 2014
Location: Not far from a lot of solar panels.
Posts: 88
aa62,

I seem to remember the ties were available in several colours; apart from yours in maroon, mine was blue and I believe there was also a green one (if somebody has a better recall, please share).
My memory informs me that us groundies on Blue Team had to shell out for ours - perhaps your squadron fund may have coughed up for yours?
Null Orifice is offline  
Old 26th May 2016, 15:28
  #4364 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: Wiltshire
Age: 67
Posts: 2,062
Null,

ISTR that Lockheed presented the tie when I was at Colerne as a well done for doing 1 full year of service on the aircraft. In those days (71 a 73) I also recall Lockheed sponsoring the team Christmas do, I can't remember ever paying for beer on any of them, or making a contribution. Hope that helps.

Hiya Gopher, nice to see you back again.

Smudge
smujsmith is offline  
Old 26th May 2016, 16:14
  #4365 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Oct 2014
Location: Not far from a lot of solar panels.
Posts: 88
Lockheed must have mellowed by then, smudge!

No beer, no tie, nada!

I think they were still peed off about the procurement process for the aircraft. Fred H (Lockheed rep) said we had bought them in the wrong store, presumably meaning that we had paid too much going via the US military.
Null Orifice is offline  
Old 26th May 2016, 18:53
  #4366 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Aug 2013
Location: uk
Posts: 153
aa62, Re the Herc trailer, back in the day (80' thru to mid 90's) we had the "Exhibition Production Flight" at Henlow, they were a motley bunch drawn from any trade, as long as you had a skill they could use your trade mattered not. They produced all the exhibits for shows inc Royal Tournament, one of which was the Nimrod fuselage they built on two 40' semi trailers, a fine bunch who went the way of contactorization in 1997.
PM
kaitakbowler is offline  
Old 26th May 2016, 19:17
  #4367 (permalink)  
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: East Sussex UK
Age: 62
Posts: 6,996
AA62 ... Sorry old chap, but at 72k, I don't think Mrs AA62 will be signing off on your new garden shed
CoffmanStarter is offline  
Old 27th May 2016, 07:05
  #4368 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: wiltshire
Age: 61
Posts: 224
23 years ago today, we lost XV 193 near Blair Atholl. Raising a glass to the group of friends and colleagues who went en route forever that day.

Last edited by ksimboy; 27th May 2016 at 07:41.
ksimboy is online now  
Old 27th May 2016, 07:19
  #4369 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: sussex
Posts: 1,601
Null,
in respect of paying too much via the US military I always understood that to lessen the infamous 'dollar drain' they had to be bought that way.
ancientaviator62 is offline  
Old 27th May 2016, 11:20
  #4370 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Oct 2014
Location: Not far from a lot of solar panels.
Posts: 88
aa62
Thanks for your short lesson on economics

I knew there must have been a reason, but grey cells let me down.

Thanks.
Null Orifice is offline  
Old 29th May 2016, 15:08
  #4371 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: M4 Corridor
Posts: 553
Eggs in one basket

On the question of economics, I wonder what savings were in pooling all the transport effort in one type and its engineering support. I remember when I was pre-Hercs and the major exercise was Eastern something. The Argosies from Benson (on which I was) and the Andovers whined across the west of England at altitude en route for a joint force rendezvous. Towards the east the sky was blackened by the onset of darkness and the oil and smoke from the fleet of Beverleys thundering towards us out of Abingdon. Below us the Hastings were still only taxying at Colerne. All these aircraft were to join up at different cruising speeds for a drop on Salisbury plain. The Belfasts and Britannias from Brize didn't play, thank the Lord. It occurred to me then that a common plan for Transport Command might lie in the "new" Hercules of which 66 were on order. The horrors of JATFOR were then blissfully unknown. By the time of the big redundancy in 1975 all those other types, with a few exceptions had disappeared.
Dougie M is offline  
Old 29th May 2016, 15:39
  #4372 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: Vancouver Island
Age: 77
Posts: 13
From the May 1971 Changi Informer, did someone mention Uckers?
Gumpied is offline  
Old 29th May 2016, 15:42
  #4373 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: Vancouver Island
Age: 77
Posts: 13
Trying to upload a .pdf file; help please!!
Gumpied is offline  
Old 29th May 2016, 20:45
  #4374 (permalink)  
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: East Sussex UK
Age: 62
Posts: 6,996
Gumpied ...

If you PM me with your eMail address, I'll gladly help


Coff.
CoffmanStarter is offline  
Old 30th May 2016, 18:36
  #4375 (permalink)  
ICM
 
Join Date: May 2008
Location: Bishops Stortford, UK
Age: 78
Posts: 403
Doug: Like you, I have some memories of those Argosy/Andover/Beverley/Hastings streams, and of the mild mayhem that could ensue if going IFR when a Scatter Plan had to be executed. Anything similar in the JATFOR era?
ICM is offline  
Old 31st May 2016, 07:20
  #4376 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: sussex
Posts: 1,601
At least in the JATFOR era we had only one a/c type the 'K' so the various plans need only take into account one set of speeds etc. I have no recollection of scattering as such but perhaps someone else has.
ancientaviator62 is offline  
Old 31st May 2016, 10:50
  #4377 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: M4 Corridor
Posts: 553
JATFOR

Not my picture.




When the K hercs assembled at Lyneham , the Airborne Forces thought that they could blacken the skies of Europe again with a Brigade strength assault using 36 aircraft. There were no separation aids like SKE then so the force was VMC capable only. Formations were under Wave Leaders and Stream Leaders and the whole caravanserai was magnificent but impractical, rather like the charge of the Light Brigade. If the stream went IMC then the Penetration Plan was called but it couldn't survive any major heading changes on the route. If VMC couldn't be regained then the stream would be ordered to scatter and the sky became a very dangerous place to be in cloud. Some have since claimed to have sought refuge in restricted areas like the 2000ft avoid over Bath only to be told "So did I" and "Me too"
When I arrived on the fleet the Paras had lowered their sights so the assaults were Battalion strength streams of only 15 aircraft. 8 Para and 7 MSP. The Para aircraft became SKE capable but most of the MSP aircraft weren't so basically it was still a VMC capability. On an exercise mounted out of Abingdon (Dalton Barracks) we set off down round the Isle of Wight in the gloom. The lead called "Pegasus climbing 2000ft for cloud avoidance" so dutifully the rest checked in "2,3,4,5, 6, etc." When 15 piped up the lead said " Height and heading changes will be transmitted by lead without requiring acknowledgement " There was a slight pause then "2,3,4,5,..."
There wasn't much fun on long transits
Dougie M is offline  
Old 1st Jun 2016, 09:50
  #4378 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Oct 2014
Location: Not far from a lot of solar panels.
Posts: 88
Dougie's post reminded me of the early days of the mighty streams of the 70s.

First up from the memory bank came the mental image of the day when 41 of Lynehams Ks were all crewed and running at the same time - can't remember if they all got off though. What I do remember was the subsequent whingeing from the ladies of Melsome Road AMQs who weren't impressed with the aroma of Avtur replacing that of Febreze in their lines of washing (didn't affect our washing - I lived in Chippenham at the time .

Next came a recollection from Exercise Long Link (?) at a glorious location in southern Turkey. All the aircraft had been allotted a particular parking spot according to their respective role and stream position. On a lovely sunny day i.e. shrieking hot, a large number (36? memory failure) started engines and set out on their aerial adventures, involving a stream takeoff. IIRC the lead aircraft aborted due to the ASI failing to indicate. It was later found to have swallowed a bee or wasp via the pitot head. The subsequent mayhem was thoroughly enjoyed by all, especially us groundies who were faced with a massive game of chess to restore all the pieces to their original parking spots .
Null Orifice is offline  
Old 1st Jun 2016, 13:06
  #4379 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: sussex
Posts: 1,601
Null,
the Turkey exercise was Deep Furrow and the similar one to Denmark was Bold Guard. How did we generate so many frames ! Respect to the ground crew.
ancientaviator62 is offline  
Old 1st Jun 2016, 14:05
  #4380 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Oct 2014
Location: Not far from a lot of solar panels.
Posts: 88
aa62,

What's in a name? Everything, if you have a memory like mine!
Thanks for the nudge in the right direction.
As for the number of frames generated - perhaps the 12 hour shifts played a significant role in this?

It was somewhat strange that, in those days, the powers-that-be saw fit to introduce the 12-on, 12-off shift pattern for exercises, heightened alert states, etc - but when we mooted the same time periods for our standard three-shift system on the LSSs it was ruled out for so-called 'safety reasons'.

Most of us groundies who were at Lyneham, post-48 Sqdn Changi period, enjoyed (for a while, anyway) the old-style Britannia shift system with a 23-day cycle that commenced on a Wednesday:7 x 12 hour days on shift, including the weekend, then 6 days off!!, followed by 5 x 12 hour nights, then 4 days off. Weekends were covered by splitting the 7-day shift, with a smaller party covering the 'swing' shift overnight Sat & Sunday.

Not always a bed of roses, however. During the 6-off, some of us were 'duty spanner' in case some of the flyers fancied some pool time and went u/s down route. I clocked up many frequent flyer miles that way, although British Airways refused to accept my (mainly, Herc, VC10,Brit) vouchers
Null Orifice is offline  

Thread Tools
Search this Thread

Contact Us - Archive - Advertising - Cookie Policy - Privacy Statement - Terms of Service - Do Not Sell My Personal Information

Copyright 2018 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. All rights reserved. Use of this site indicates your consent to the Terms of Use.