Females can not march like men....

[Unchecked]

I'd just like to add my tuppence worth here. I can tell you on absolute authority that the injuries suffered to this young woman were not caused by big- standard drill and marching, it was the march up and down Armoury Hill each day, with webbing and Bergen, that did it.

Since that particular Halton course and this subsequent occurrence, that practice has now been stopped, I'm now reliably informed. (A sad watering down of standards to cover the arse.)

The girl was in a lot of pain for a long time. The medics did what they could AFAIK. Whoever allowed her to claim for such a large amount of money without looking at the whole picture are the ones to blame IMHO.

[The Legend]

WTF - Maybe FJ aircrew will be able to claim for saggy tits after pulling too much g !

[Mr C Hinecap]

Just in case anyone would rather understand the topic rather than getting all internet angry. For those not used to such things, the link does contain pictures of ladies wearing sports attire and indeed some photographs where naked ankles are visible. Do not click if these may excite or offend:

http://www.cs.amedd.army.mil/borden/...2-4a518be998f7

Musculoskeletal injuries in military women are common. Prevention and management of such injuries are very important to sustain the fighting force and maintain military readiness. this monograph provides information about the incidence, risk factors, prevention, diagnosis, evaluation, treatment, and rehabilitation of common musculo-skeletal overuse and traumatic injuries sustained by women in the military.

[lj101]

WTF - Maybe FJ aircrew will be able to claim for saggy tits after pulling too much g

Aye Legend - and that's just the blokes.

[goudie]

Maybe FJ aircrew will be able to claim for saggy tits after pulling too much g

Well I read somewhere, many moons ago, that Lightning pilots suffered from piles. LM will confirm or deny, I'm sure,

[MrSnuggles]

mad_jock has a point

The female pelvis is anatomically different from the male pelvis. This can lead to improper walking techniques and subsequently pelvis pain or stress fatigue if forced to exceed its limits.

It has nothing to do with height, that's why short blokes manage perfectly well.

AFAIK a female would be just as proficient at walking excercises if attention was paid to the anatomical differences - to shorten the stride is one example. The main goal is to keep recruits healthy and getting there on time can be achieved very well although the stride is accomodated to the difference in pelvis anatomy.

[Willard Whyte]

If one shortens the stride too much it becomes more of a mince.

[Lonewolf_50]

mad_jock, with your points in mind, should we cancel all running and competitive walking for women in the Olympics?

[NutLoose]

And Nutloose is a ginger beer. I suspect apart from an amateur interest in female anatomy I suspect it was missed out from his trade training. I would like to think though that it would be included in the training for PTI and also DS staff who are in charge of training recruits.

Far from it, unfortunately I removed part of the text which said something along the lines of as a male I would struggle struggle after a hard night out to pinch off a loaf.... that deletion made it sound serious as opposed to humorous..

The only WRAF I had dealings up with close and personal could probably claim for RSI, although the Strain would be replaced with Sha***** so to speak.... Ahhh she was fun while it lasted

Lonewolf, don't forget the hop, skip and claim...

[tucumseh]

I'd just like to add my tuppence worth here. I can tell you on absolute authority that the injuries suffered to this young woman were not caused by big- standard drill and marching, it was the march up and down Armoury Hill each day, with webbing and Bergen, that did it.

Unchecked - was the issue the load carried or the incorrect use of Bergen/webbing? If the former, you may have got to the bottom of why MoD succumbed with high awards, because it is well known that the loads carried during training were agreed by Arms Directors using a vague wave of wet fingers at a meeting in 1997, but no-one was quite sure where the figures had originated nor if they were based on any methodology. The programme that was mean to to formalise this using scientific means, didn't, and ever since MoD has been hoping nothing would happen. A well known MoD risk reduction strategy!

[MrSnuggles]

Willard Whyte, Lonewolf_50

Don't act silly chaps, you know very well that female athletes do very well in competitions where it is allowed for them to adjust stride lenght etc to the female anathomy(sp?).

It would be equally difficult for a bloke to adjust to female anatomy, just consider females have no erhm... lower delicate parts to save from crunching, you know.

We're anatomically different, ladies vs gents, so no need to make remarks like that (looking at you lonewolf). Just some attention re differences and everyone's happy, no need for mockery or over exaggerating.

[Onceapilot]

Yes, females are different! It is amazing how a 55 year old male has to virtually match the performance of an 18 year old female in the VO2 max beep test .

OAP

[Danny42C]

Quote:

Musculoskeletal injuries in military women are common. Prevention and management of such injuries are very important to sustain the fighting force and maintain military readiness (Mr.C.Hinecap #63).

Might a possible solution be to exclude women from the fighting force ? (we seem to have got along pretty well without them for quite a while until now, and our Forces have not done too badly on the whole).

In the matter of length of step: in my experience that is decided by 'im in front, the rest of us had to follow on behind.

Yes, I know, I'll get my hat....

[Unchecked]

Tucumseh - I'm not sure, but I do know that the Bergen was literally about 2/3rds the size of her in length. It did look kind of ridiculous to see her struggle with it up and down that hill.

[TomJoad]

Originally Posted by Robert Cooper

So the poor dears are getting more than folks blown up with IEDs because they can't march? Something wrong there!

Bob C

You are so right there Bob. The folks with IED injuries should be getting far higher compensation than they presently do.

[NutLoose]

Though to be fair Tom, a shorter stride means they have to take more steps with an increased chance of setting off a pressure related IED.

Basically it all seems to boil down to a right Royal F up. Nothing agInst the award, it just is disproportional to those folks injured in harms way get, personally I think theirs should be doubled at least.

[Courtney Mil]

It sounds very much like she was not anatomically suited to the physical requirements of the training. The training, of course, being dictated by the requirements of the fighting force in question. If she was incapable of meeting the training standards, she would unlikely to meet the performace requirements of operations. Unless one can alter the physical demands of operations, one cannot be justified in reducing the training standards. Or should someone be appointed to carry her bag wherever she goes?

[Unchecked]

And is that the fault of the selection system? We should be better at selecting the right people so that everyone's time and money is no longer wasted.

[Unchecked]

Oh, and if that means "discriminating" against those that cannot hack the military (it's pretty obvious who won't before they even start) then so be it.

[dervish]

Or should someone be appointed to carry her bag wherever she goes?

Closer than you realize CM! Proposed and rejected in about 2000, the idea has made a comeback and the "Personal Robotic Support Vehicle" is being considered again. The original name was the Mule, but the general idea is a robotic vehicle that is remotely controlled by the soldier or a rear echelon via video link and which carries most of his load. Not one each, but one per section in the original trials. No one involved will ever forget the accompanying US Army video.