Just get yourself up there and do it....
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So I take it they don't have the likes of a search that we had with the Tens to reach the top. Beggars the question if he slips off how do they get him down?
Originally Posted by Coff
So that's IF for the first 20 yards then Courtney
I have a fear of heights (actually, a quite rational concern about the adverse effects of sudden deceleration on ground impact) and that makes my palms sweat. I hope he's got wooly socks on over his shoes - the only way to get anywhere on glare ice.
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Seriously though ... and I'm not a card carrying HSE type ... but isn't this an unsafe working practice. God forbid the chap should fall ... but if he did ... surley some difficult questions would be asked of his supervising NCO and the EngO ? Especially if a comparison were made at the subsequent BoE with USAF practice. I appreciate some kind of restraint harness is being used but it looks a little Heath Ribinson.
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I think he is wearing a chest harness, similar to a climbing harness
but the attachment point is on the back, you just can't see it round his body.
He'd still fall a few feet though.
but the attachment point is on the back, you just can't see it round his body.
He'd still fall a few feet though.
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I read somewhere that although they save your life the sudden arresting of your fall can cause other injuries...
Low observerable, never heard of that one, but I can tell you working on a VC10 in the winter with deicing fluid over the engines and fuselage over gloss paint was lethal. We had harnesses, but they lived in stores as the top of a Tens engines had nowhere to attach them, I was scared of heights and it took ages to get used to working up top, sliding down over the side of the cowling and onto the safety raiser took some getting used to, we had one guy go out to replace a upper beacon in mid winter with snow on the ground at about minus 5 plus wind, he came back in his light blue shirt covered in oil, the search engine stopped when he was at the top of the fin at about 2am, without any way to let people know he was trapped and with just a shirt on and in danger of hypothermia, he shinned the 75 odd foot down the search arm....
Low observerable, never heard of that one, but I can tell you working on a VC10 in the winter with deicing fluid over the engines and fuselage over gloss paint was lethal. We had harnesses, but they lived in stores as the top of a Tens engines had nowhere to attach them, I was scared of heights and it took ages to get used to working up top, sliding down over the side of the cowling and onto the safety raiser took some getting used to, we had one guy go out to replace a upper beacon in mid winter with snow on the ground at about minus 5 plus wind, he came back in his light blue shirt covered in oil, the search engine stopped when he was at the top of the fin at about 2am, without any way to let people know he was trapped and with just a shirt on and in danger of hypothermia, he shinned the 75 odd foot down the search arm....
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"I read somewhere that although they save your life the sudden arresting of your fall can cause other injuries..."
Especially if you have your "tackle" in the wrong place
Yes, even hanging by them causes pressure !
Especially if you have your "tackle" in the wrong place
Yes, even hanging by them causes pressure !
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Just do what I do with my car. Drive really fast and it all blows off. Simples.
Using a de-icing rig with its heated fluid and chemicals on dry, loose snow is a very expensive and inefficient method of snow clearance ..
Looks like someone is watching the pennies and having the loose stuff brushed off efficiently, before the de-icing or anti-icing fluids (and they are markedly different) are applied.
Less pollution and less money wasted ... so why not ???
Looks like someone is watching the pennies and having the loose stuff brushed off efficiently, before the de-icing or anti-icing fluids (and they are markedly different) are applied.
Less pollution and less money wasted ... so why not ???
"I read somewhere that although they save your life the sudden arresting of your fall can cause other injuries..."
Especially if you have your "tackle" in the wrong place
Yes, even hanging by them causes pressure !
Especially if you have your "tackle" in the wrong place
Yes, even hanging by them causes pressure !
Last edited by MAINJAFAD; 15th Jan 2013 at 20:21.
Seriously though ... and I'm not a card carrying HSE type ... but isn't this an unsafe working practice. God forbid the chap should fall ... but if he did ... surely some difficult questions would be asked of his supervising NCO and the EngO ? Especially if a comparison were made at the subsequent BoE with USAF practice. I appreciate some kind of restraint harness is being used but it looks a little Heath Robinson.
The regulations are on the internet. What he is doing is covered by JSP 375 Volume 2 Leaflet 7, As long as all of the boxes are ticked as regards his training, serviceability of climbing equipment, medical fitness and rapid rescue capability if there is an arrested fall (plus a risk assessment, a safe system of work and method statement from hell which he is totally briefed on), it's totally legal as regards UK HSW law.
The regulations are on the internet. What he is doing is covered by JSP 375 Volume 2 Leaflet 7, As long as all of the boxes are ticked as regards his training, serviceability of climbing equipment, medical fitness and rapid rescue capability if there is an arrested fall (plus a risk assessment, a safe system of work and method statement from hell which he is totally briefed on), it's totally legal as regards UK HSW law.
(On the Herc we would draw straws to see who had to climb out of the escape hatch and start sweeping ... and who calls the police to arrest that faller ??
)
"Seriously though, and I'm not a card carrying HSE type, but isn't this an unsafe working practice. God forbid the chap should fall, but if he did, surely some difficult questions would be asked of his supervising NCO and the EngO ? Especially if a comparison were made at the subsequent BoE with USAF practice. I appreciate some kind of restraint harness is being used but it looks a little Heath Robinson".
MAINJAFAD is absolutely right, considering that in addition to Brize being the MOB for the C17 there are a number of high wing/tail plane/surface aircraft whose home is Brize, not to count the variety of visiting aircraft. If this is the best that Brize can do the coroner/ BOI might be asking some serious questions regarding practice and procedures across the AT fleet. The defence that it rarely snows at Brize is no defence. I seem to remember a picture in the RAF news shortly after the introduction of the C17 showing a similar scenario in Norway.
It is difficult, from the picture, to determine if the individual is wearing a fall restraint or a fall arrest device however both devices would seem inappropriate in this particular case.
a. Fall restraint. The anchor point for the rope/strop connecting the individual to the horizontal surface appears to be about half way between the tip and the centre of the tailplane, this will prevent him falling off the tip but not over the sides (fore & aft). A fall will result in a pendulum effect resulting in the individual colliding with the vertical component of the tailplane and possibly sustaining injury. By definition a shock absorbing device (to lessen the effects of sudden arrest) is not incorporated in fall restraint devices.
b. Fall Arrest. Same as the above with the possible addition of a shock absorbing device. The end result would be the same.
It beggars belief that in 2013 the Service have still not got their heads around the working at height regulations particularly with regard to aircraft operations.
MAINJAFAD is absolutely right, considering that in addition to Brize being the MOB for the C17 there are a number of high wing/tail plane/surface aircraft whose home is Brize, not to count the variety of visiting aircraft. If this is the best that Brize can do the coroner/ BOI might be asking some serious questions regarding practice and procedures across the AT fleet. The defence that it rarely snows at Brize is no defence. I seem to remember a picture in the RAF news shortly after the introduction of the C17 showing a similar scenario in Norway.
It is difficult, from the picture, to determine if the individual is wearing a fall restraint or a fall arrest device however both devices would seem inappropriate in this particular case.
a. Fall restraint. The anchor point for the rope/strop connecting the individual to the horizontal surface appears to be about half way between the tip and the centre of the tailplane, this will prevent him falling off the tip but not over the sides (fore & aft). A fall will result in a pendulum effect resulting in the individual colliding with the vertical component of the tailplane and possibly sustaining injury. By definition a shock absorbing device (to lessen the effects of sudden arrest) is not incorporated in fall restraint devices.
b. Fall Arrest. Same as the above with the possible addition of a shock absorbing device. The end result would be the same.
It beggars belief that in 2013 the Service have still not got their heads around the working at height regulations particularly with regard to aircraft operations.
WOW ... all that knowledge/proof/expertise from one grainy photo .... amazing !!!